Sorry, I thought you were chiming in with Joe & Vito in claiming that
the torture of U.S. prisoners was just some "good clean fun."


Vito wrote:
C'mon Doug, I never said "good clean fun". However I do recognize that
intellegence info from some prisoners is needed to save US lives and see
getting it as a necessary evil.

No, it's not. It's evil, period.

... The degree of "torture" condoned should be
comenserate with the value of the info.

In other words, the ends justify the means? Great little flexible set or
morals ya got there Vito.


... Suppose a captive knew the location
of a hostage his group planned to behead in 12 hours. How much mental and/or
physical discomfort should I be allowed to inflict to get that info?


You'd be a lot more likley to get accurate info with positive
reinforcement, although working against a deadline makes it difficult to
overcome heavy indoctrination.

One of the U.S.'s biggest liabilities in this war against terrorists is
that we have little "human intel" resources. They have to be developed.
It's a lot more likely to be able to 'turn' some of those in custody if
they are well treated and identify *us* as the good guys.

As for what terrorists do with regard to blowing up kids, beheading
innocent victims, etc etc, they are already evil. They have made their
choice. We can not allow them to make moral decisions for us.

That requires a large amount of backbone... some people find that
uncomfortable and prefer to lean on the fractured morals of others.
That's just human nature I guess.

DSK