Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144 Volts, or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
JAXAshby wrote:
oh, you mean horsepower can not be compared to watts?

Gee, the European engine manufacturers do it all the time. somebody should
tell them you can't do that.

No, I mean this:

"6 amps at 12 volts for 24 hours = 1,728 watts, which = 2.3 hp-hours."

Amps times Volts times hours = Watt-hrs, a unit of energy
Horspower times hours= hp-hrs, a unit of energy
Watts are units of power
Horsepower is a unit of power (who would of thought it?)

Energy and power are two different things, which you well know.

Cheers
Marty

ah, I forgot about Perpetual Motion drives. Thanks for reminding me.

However, using electric motors that can regenerate through the propeller is
viable and is being done today.

no, it isn't.

Ahh yep it is Jocks.
http://solomontechnologies.com/Solom...allations.html




Oz1...of the 3 twins.

I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

Jeff Morris wrote:
Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144 Volts, or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


I'm still pretty skeptical, 3 kW is neary 5 Hp, allowing for some losses
it's going to be equivalent to stapping a 5 horse outboard to your bow
and run it full throttle trying to push the boat back. This might have
a significant impact on performance, speed wise, no?

Cheers
Marty

The was with a 47 foot, 20,000 pound catamaran doing over 9 knots in a 20+
breeze, with two of the 12hp electric wheels. Your mileage may vary.


"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
Jeff Morris wrote:
Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144 Volts,
or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


I'm still pretty skeptical, 3 kW is neary 5 Hp, allowing for some losses
it's going to be equivalent to stapping a 5 horse outboard to your bow
and run it full throttle trying to push the boat back. This might have
a significant impact on performance, speed wise, no?

Cheers
Marty

but still ... 5 hp drag on the boat. that is a lot.

The was with a 47 foot, 20,000 pound catamaran doing over 9 knots in a 20+
breeze, with two of the 12hp electric wheels. Your mileage may vary.


"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
Jeff Morris wrote:
Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder
is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144
Volts,
or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate
enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


I'm still pretty skeptical, 3 kW is neary 5 Hp, allowing for some losses
it's going to be equivalent to stapping a 5 horse outboard to your bow
and run it full throttle trying to push the boat back. This might have
a significant impact on performance, speed wise, no?

Cheers
Marty

let's see. 22 amps at 144 (sic) volts when sailing 18 knots, for about 4 hp
stored per hour times 8 hours gives about 32 hp hours.

yup, that works. you sailed 144 miles and now you're going to motor back using
1 hp and you are going to do it in just 32 hours (actually about 20 hours after
taking out ineffiencies).

Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144 Volts,
or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
JAXAshby wrote:
oh, you mean horsepower can not be compared to watts?

Gee, the European engine manufacturers do it all the time. somebody
should
tell them you can't do that.

No, I mean this:

"6 amps at 12 volts for 24 hours = 1,728 watts, which = 2.3 hp-hours."

Amps times Volts times hours = Watt-hrs, a unit of energy
Horspower times hours= hp-hrs, a unit of energy
Watts are units of power
Horsepower is a unit of power (who would of thought it?)

Energy and power are two different things, which you well know.

Cheers
Marty

Jaxie, you're having your typical comprehension problem. The 32 hp-hours
generated should be enough for an hour or two of powering - plenty to power the
cat out and back into the inlet. Since the batteries give 2 to 4 hours of
backup, it isn't really necessary to regenerate if you're day sailing out of a
slip.

If you want to do long distance powering or motorsailing, you need to run a
genset. However, a genset run at optimum rpm for recharging will be a lot
cheaper to run than twin diesels.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
let's see. 22 amps at 144 (sic) volts when sailing 18 knots, for about 4 hp
stored per hour times 8 hours gives about 32 hp hours.

yup, that works. you sailed 144 miles and now you're going to motor back
using
1 hp and you are going to do it in just 32 hours (actually about 20 hours
after
taking out ineffiencies).

Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144 Volts,
or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
JAXAshby wrote:
oh, you mean horsepower can not be compared to watts?

Gee, the European engine manufacturers do it all the time. somebody
should
tell them you can't do that.

No, I mean this:

"6 amps at 12 volts for 24 hours = 1,728 watts, which = 2.3 hp-hours."

Amps times Volts times hours = Watt-hrs, a unit of energy
Horspower times hours= hp-hrs, a unit of energy
Watts are units of power
Horsepower is a unit of power (who would of thought it?)

Energy and power are two different things, which you well know.

Cheers
Marty

so, the regen doesn't really work unless you plug the batteries in at the dock?

okay.

but, if that is the case why buy the regen equipment?


Jaxie, you're having your typical comprehension problem. The 32 hp-hours
generated should be enough for an hour or two of powering - plenty to power
the
cat out and back into the inlet. Since the batteries give 2 to 4 hours of
backup, it isn't really necessary to regenerate if you're day sailing out of
a
slip.

If you want to do long distance powering or motorsailing, you need to run a
genset. However, a genset run at optimum rpm for recharging will be a lot
cheaper to run than twin diesels.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
let's see. 22 amps at 144 (sic) volts when sailing 18 knots, for about 4
hp
stored per hour times 8 hours gives about 32 hp hours.

yup, that works. you sailed 144 miles and now you're going to motor back
using
1 hp and you are going to do it in just 32 hours (actually about 20 hours
after
taking out ineffiencies).

Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144
Volts,
or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
JAXAshby wrote:
oh, you mean horsepower can not be compared to watts?

Gee, the European engine manufacturers do it all the time. somebody
should
tell them you can't do that.

No, I mean this:

"6 amps at 12 volts for 24 hours = 1,728 watts, which = 2.3 hp-hours."

Amps times Volts times hours = Watt-hrs, a unit of energy
Horspower times hours= hp-hrs, a unit of energy
Watts are units of power
Horsepower is a unit of power (who would of thought it?)

Energy and power are two different things, which you well know.

Cheers
Marty

No, the regen isn't necessarily needed if you start with a topped of battery. A
system like this gives one a lot of options. Regeneration will not provide for
all needs, except in limited cases. However, it is nice if it can supply a
substantial part of the use.


"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
so, the regen doesn't really work unless you plug the batteries in at the
dock?

okay.

but, if that is the case why buy the regen equipment?


Jaxie, you're having your typical comprehension problem. The 32 hp-hours
generated should be enough for an hour or two of powering - plenty to power
the
cat out and back into the inlet. Since the batteries give 2 to 4 hours of
backup, it isn't really necessary to regenerate if you're day sailing out of
a
slip.

If you want to do long distance powering or motorsailing, you need to run a
genset. However, a genset run at optimum rpm for recharging will be a lot
cheaper to run than twin diesels.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
let's see. 22 amps at 144 (sic) volts when sailing 18 knots, for about 4
hp
stored per hour times 8 hours gives about 32 hp hours.

yup, that works. you sailed 144 miles and now you're going to motor back
using
1 hp and you are going to do it in just 32 hours (actually about 20 hours
after
taking out ineffiencies).

Being a little sloppy with the units is not that bad - his real blunder is
claiming 72 Watts output. The Condor catamaran claims 22 Amps at 144
Volts,
or
over 3 kW output when regenerating in a good breeze. They generate enough
sailing during the day to power in and out of their inlet.


"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
JAXAshby wrote:
oh, you mean horsepower can not be compared to watts?

Gee, the European engine manufacturers do it all the time. somebody
should
tell them you can't do that.

No, I mean this:

"6 amps at 12 volts for 24 hours = 1,728 watts, which = 2.3 hp-hours."

Amps times Volts times hours = Watt-hrs, a unit of energy
Horspower times hours= hp-hrs, a unit of energy
Watts are units of power
Horsepower is a unit of power (who would of thought it?)

Energy and power are two different things, which you well know.

Cheers
Marty

Regeneration will not provide for
all needs, except in limited cases. However, it is nice if it can supply a
substantial part of the use.


even at the cost of 5 hp pushing backwards on the boat as you sail?

it seems to me to be a damned expensive way to move a boat. why not buy a
little Honda generator and drag a 55-gallon drum behind the boat. same net
effect, and cheaper, too.