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Holy shit!
On Sep 16, 8:12*pm, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, *A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. *You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. *If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say.. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. All I can say is...........unfrickenbelievable. 'nuff said. |
Holy shit!
"John H." wrote in message ... I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch |
Holy shit!
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. You're on a roll now. I see you've been here already. www.fixya.com/support/dometic/air_conditioners |
Holy shit!
"John H." wrote in message ... On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:57:17 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:15:01 -0400, John H. wrote: Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. As others have mentioned, the two most likely causes are either low voltage or insufficient anti-cycling delay in the condenser controller. Excessive cycling can be caused by poor air flow among other things - clogged filter, fan speed too low, etc. When I got the circuit breaker, the service guy at the dealership mentioned that on hot, humid days the fan should always be going full blast. Now I know. Thanks for the come back. -- John H. You also need a circuit breaker with a slow trip curve. I think it is a "C" curve, but will not stand behind the statement. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 20:30:10 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:
"John H." wrote in message .. . I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch Thanks. I'll check on that. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 20:59:44 -0400, jim wrote:
John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. You're on a roll now. I see you've been here already. www.fixya.com/support/dometic/air_conditioners Yes. I found that place soon. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 18:29:31 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote: "John H." wrote in message .. . On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:57:17 -0400, Wayne.B wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:15:01 -0400, John H. wrote: Unlike some other folks, I have no problem with being wrong. If the problem reoccurs, I'll let you know. As others have mentioned, the two most likely causes are either low voltage or insufficient anti-cycling delay in the condenser controller. Excessive cycling can be caused by poor air flow among other things - clogged filter, fan speed too low, etc. When I got the circuit breaker, the service guy at the dealership mentioned that on hot, humid days the fan should always be going full blast. Now I know. Thanks for the come back. -- John H. You also need a circuit breaker with a slow trip curve. I think it is a "C" curve, but will not stand behind the statement. I've already replaced it. I just took the one the dealer gave me, same as the old one. -- John H. |
Holy shit!
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 20:59:44 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:51:59 -0400, jim wrote: John H. wrote: On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 06:54:53 -0400, "Raphael" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... Gone four days and back to 853 messages. Over 300 from one individual. Had a great time at Virginia Beach. Saw lots of boats. Will post pictures of some when I get the chance. Air conditioner kept popping the circuit breaker when the temp was hovering around 95 yesterday. Anyone know anything about air conditioners? -- John H. Seems to me that when you first had this problem we talked about undersized extension cords, undersized house wiring, defective breaker in RV, and low voltage. As I recall, your AC started working and the issue was dropped. Someone said head pressure will increase as ambient temp increases. That's true. So now you have at least 5 potential reasons why you are popping the breaker in the RV. The reason the breaker popped at the campground may be different than why it popped at your house, but let's assume the reason is the same. I think I have laid out the situation properly. If not, correct me. I know there are at least 4 or 5 guys here that would be able to put you on the right track. Would you like some help to resolve the problem? The problem may have been due to the heat, but I don't remember the temperature when I first had the problem. Most folks thought the problem then was caused by having the trailer connected to house wiring (20 amp). But this time I was connected to 30 amp. I'm thinking that outside temp may be the common theme to both problems. Sure! John, A 20 amp circuit when properly installed can handle a 20 amp load, and a 30 amp circuit can handle a 30 amp load. That doesn't say the source is providing proper frequency or voltage. What we are thinking here is a voltage sag for various reasons, or short cycle might have caused higher current draw due to not enough time for excessive head pressure to bleed off between cycles. Your AC unit may or may not have built in short cycle protection or it might not be working. You can test this by running the AC and quickly shutting it of then on again. There should be a 3 to 5 minute delay before the compressor starts again. The conditions that precipitated your failures may not be easy for your dealer to replicate. He may have to ask you to leave your rig at his service department for an extended period for troubleshooting, and even then he might not see the problem if it is caused by a power source. If I were in your shoes I would take the time to learn about AC wiring and problem solving. Also an overview of how the air conditioner works would help you a lot. Jim/Raphael The manual tells me to get it serviced on an annual basis, and that's about it. There is no information on wiring, etc, except for the installation instructions. Apparently, Dometic, which makes just about everything for travel trailers, doesn't want anyone other than itself messing with the innards of the AC. I did check the coils and filters, but they've been used hardly at all and were very clean. I understand about the voltage variances. I'll take a multimeter next time I go out. I agree that the dealer won't be able to replicate the conditions. They will check that the output is 20 degrees less than the input. If that is true, then it passes and no further checks are made. I'm thinking the trip to the dealer's would be a waste of gas. I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. You're on a roll now. I see you've been here already. www.fixya.com/support/dometic/air_conditioners Yes. I found that place soon. Ya'll be sure to let us know how that new manicure shop works out. |
Holy shit!
On Sep 16, 8:30*pm, "Eisboch" wrote:
"John H." wrote in message ... I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. *They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! |
Holy shit!
wrote in message ... On Sep 16, 8:30 pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "John H." wrote in message ... I just tried running the AC, turning it off, and then back on. The compressor did not delay in starting. So apparently the short cycle protection is non existent or not working. Tomorrow I'll give the Dometic folks a call and see what they have to say. Thanks for the feedback, Jim. -- John H. Any air conditioning guy can add the time delay. They are not expensive. It will extend the life of your compressor and will help prevent nuisance circuit breaker tripping. Eisboch I can't believe that there are idiots on this planet stupid enough to think that because someone is an engineer in a completely different field, that they should know everything about HVAC, electrical, and just exactly how well the power is conditioned at each and every campground!!! ------------------------- You trying to pick a fight, Pilgrim? EIsboch |
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