On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:25:56 -0400, hk wrote:


It is a shame, we see people with a lifetime of experience they should
be able to pas on to others but odd personality flaws prevent them from
being able to do so. It is really odd that they often even refuse to
look at things logically; when everybody around them complains about
their behavior, they conclude that everybody else is wrong. How likely
is that? So, this lifetime of accumulated knowledge remains locked
inside their heads. A real shame.

Just so you know, Harry, two dashes followed by a space, is the delimiter
for a signature. Many/most newsreaders will cut off a signature when
replying.

Wayne.B wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 12:50:39 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

Parker's solid fir plywood stringer system continues to give
customers the strongest, toughest and safest fiberglass boats built.

~~ snerk~~

Plywood stringers indeed. At least they're not chip board.


Parker and Grady use the same XL ply stringer material, as do many other
manufacturers of top-quality boats. What are the stringers made of in
your floating RV?

wrote:
On Aug 17, 6:33 pm, wrote:
On Aug 17, 6:25 pm, hk wrote:





wrote:
On Aug 17, 5:53 pm, wrote:
On Aug 17, 5:45 pm, wrote:
On Aug 17, 5:09 pm, hk wrote:
wrote:
On Aug 17, 4:48 pm, wrote:
On Aug 17, 4:32 pm, wrote:
On Aug 17, 2:43 pm, hk wrote:
RMR wrote:
This is ridiculous.. the hybrids we make no adays are every bit as
strong as wood stringer, poly boats.. You can't compare what your dad
sold in his shop made of polyester resin, and the epoxy, mahogany,
glass and bi axle made now. It's in the engineering, you can spew all
you want, but you are wrong... The Toleman's in particular are some
beefy boats that go where your Parker never will. I won't let you pull
me into this one, you need to do your homework then come back and we
will talk..
Consider you probably have never even been close to a Parker, or climbed
aboard one and looked around, I find your comment laughable.
Then your comment about a certain Tolman is equally laughable if
you've not seen it.
I've seen some stitch-and-glue dories around here, even a couple of
16-footers. I wasn't impressed.
There are small dories that are wood handbuilt that will still be
around when you're Parker is dead.
What's the biggest stitch-and-glue heavy duty boat you've built that
regularly plies the ocean?
To think that someone can't build a wood boat at least as strong as a
commercial company (who is trying to make a profit) that makes thin
F.G. boats is stupid and absurd.
I believe that empiracally and theoretically, that a joint made using
epoxy/glass/biax/epoxy saturated wood is stronger than a poly-resin
boat built with poly-glass/wood stringer construction.
Even the best production boat company cannot put as much work into a
boat as a home builder can. The home builder can afford to use the
best materials and lavish time on each joint to maximize strength and
when it is done decide to do it over whereas once the production boat
company decides its profit margin is going down, so do invisible
improvements.
I wouldn't leave the marina in the typical home built boat. I've seen
lots of 'em. I'm not saying a careful knowledgeable builder can't do a
fine job, because I have seen examples of those, too. But typically, the
homebuilts I have seen are poorly constructed out of crappy materials.
Memo to self: Cross HK offa invite list.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
If you know the history, he was really trolling folks like myself who
actually know a little about composite, skin on frame boats, try KF
the guy, and Genes server, and life will be a lot easier.. I love the
tolmans, I always wanted to build a Simmons Sea Skiff for "out east"
here.
It is a shame, we see people with a lifetime of experience they should
be able to pas on to others but odd personality flaws prevent them
from being able to do so. It is really odd that they often even
refuse to look at things logically; when everybody around them
complains about their behavior, they conclude that everybody else is
wrong. How likely is that? So, this lifetime of accumulated
knowledge remains locked inside their heads. A real shame.
--
I'll tell you what is a shame: someone like JustWait who has never built
a large wood boat capable of ocean duty making all manner of incorrect
claims, as for example, the Tolmans are not stitch and glue, when, in
fact, the designer of said boats says they are.
What is also ridiculous is a home brew builder claiming his boat is as
strong as a factory built boat. What does your boat weigh, sans engine,
fuel, et cetera? Under 1000 pounds? The last 18-foot boat I had weighed
1650 pounds and was built like a tank. My current boat is 21' and weighs
almost 3000 pounds. I bet you think weight isn't relative to strength in
boats capable of running in heavy water.
Getting back to the original question...how fast can you run a really
choppy inlet? With your lightweight boat and its nearly flat bottom, I'd
guess you could maintain planing speed...maybe.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
the designer is using laymans terms when he calls it stitch and tape.
If you study the plans for a Toleman, there is one seam that is
stitched, but the boat is a skin on frame, not a stitch and tape..
Like I said Harry, twist it any way you wish.. it is what it is...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

And you twisted the question, a typical trait of yours. First it was
"what stitch and tape..." now it's "what ocean going.. " you are
toying around while folks are trying to get serious info, but you
obliviously don't know the difference between stitch and tape, and
composite, and skin on frame..



D'uh. Tolman, the designer of Tolman boats, describes the construction
method as stitch-and-glue. Go argue with Tollman.

And once again, what large, ocean capable boats have you built?
The answer is none. You build dinghies, rowboats, and the ugliest canoe
I have ever seen, bar none.

Vic Smith wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:25:56 -0400, hk wrote:

What is also ridiculous is a home brew builder claiming his boat is as
strong as a factory built boat. What does your boat weigh, sans engine,
fuel, et cetera? Under 1000 pounds? The last 18-foot boat I had weighed
1650 pounds and was built like a tank. My current boat is 21' and weighs
almost 3000 pounds. I bet you think weight isn't relative to strength in
boats capable of running in heavy water.

Depending on the care taken by the home-builder, he could well have a
more solid boat than a factory boat.
Factory boats *are* hand-made, by factory workers.
Some of them might come in with a hangover, and the QC guy might have
one too.
Many things can wrong during the build process, and get hidden.
The home builder has the advantage of *knowing* nothing went wrong.


You are assuming the home builder knows what he is doing. I would bet
against that much of the time.

hk wrote:
Vic Smith wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:25:56 -0400, hk wrote:

What is also ridiculous is a home brew builder claiming his boat is
as strong as a factory built boat. What does your boat weigh, sans
engine, fuel, et cetera? Under 1000 pounds? The last 18-foot boat I
had weighed 1650 pounds and was built like a tank. My current boat is
21' and weighs almost 3000 pounds. I bet you think weight isn't
relative to strength in boats capable of running in heavy water.

Depending on the care taken by the home-builder, he could well have a
more solid boat than a factory boat.
Factory boats *are* hand-made, by factory workers.
Some of them might come in with a hangover, and the QC guy might have
one too.
Many things can wrong during the build process, and get hidden.
The home builder has the advantage of *knowing* nothing went wrong.


You are assuming the home builder knows what he is doing. I would bet
against that much of the time.

Do you like ass play?

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:35:08 -0400, hk wrote:


You are assuming the home builder knows what he is doing. I would bet
against that much of the time.

It's my "impression" they usually do.
Guys who work on cars are a different story.
Beware of ads like this"
1974 Camaro $2600
Rebuilt engine and trans.
Lots of extra parts thrown in for free.

--Vic.

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:52:20 -0500, Vic Smith penned the following
well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:35:08 -0400, hk wrote:

You are assuming the home builder knows what he is doing. I would bet
against that much of the time.
It's my "impression" they usually do.
Guys who work on cars are a different story.
Beware of ads like this"
1974 Camaro $2600
Rebuilt engine and trans.
Lots of extra parts thrown in for free.

I think Harry may actually be onto something.

Homebuilders are homebuilders.... and I see a lot of homebuilt
aircraft built in the most meticulous way.... poorly. These builders
think and feel that they are building with the highest quality
possible and with the utmost attention to detail and craftsmanship.

Feeling that one knows what they are doing and really KNOWING what
they are doing may not always appear in the same place...... best
intentions notwithstanding.


I see a considerable number of "boats under construction" by amateurs
who live near the shoreline. The majority are destined to become useless
- or worse - dangerous hulks. On the other hand, I have seen some nice
"homebrew" restorations of boats worth restoring.

"Don White" whited.ns.sympatico.ca wrote in message
...
hk wrote:
Vic Smith wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:25:56 -0400, hk wrote:

What is also ridiculous is a home brew builder claiming his boat is as
strong as a factory built boat. What does your boat weigh, sans engine,
fuel, et cetera? Under 1000 pounds? The last 18-foot boat I had weighed
1650 pounds and was built like a tank. My current boat is 21' and
weighs almost 3000 pounds. I bet you think weight isn't relative to
strength in boats capable of running in heavy water.

Depending on the care taken by the home-builder, he could well have a
more solid boat than a factory boat.
Factory boats *are* hand-made, by factory workers.
Some of them might come in with a hangover, and the QC guy might have
one too.
Many things can wrong during the build process, and get hidden.
The home builder has the advantage of *knowing* nothing went wrong.


You are assuming the home builder knows what he is doing. I would bet
against that much of the time.

Do you like ass play?


Ok now someone is posting with my name.
Can anyone trace this?

Don White wrote:
"Don White" whited.ns.sympatico.ca wrote in message
...
hk wrote:
Vic Smith wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:25:56 -0400, hk wrote:

What is also ridiculous is a home brew builder claiming his boat is as
strong as a factory built boat. What does your boat weigh, sans engine,
fuel, et cetera? Under 1000 pounds? The last 18-foot boat I had weighed
1650 pounds and was built like a tank. My current boat is 21' and
weighs almost 3000 pounds. I bet you think weight isn't relative to
strength in boats capable of running in heavy water.
Depending on the care taken by the home-builder, he could well have a
more solid boat than a factory boat.
Factory boats *are* hand-made, by factory workers.
Some of them might come in with a hangover, and the QC guy might have
one too.
Many things can wrong during the build process, and get hidden.
The home builder has the advantage of *knowing* nothing went wrong.

You are assuming the home builder knows what he is doing. I would bet
against that much of the time.

Do you like ass play?


Ok now someone is posting with my name.
Can anyone trace this?





Surely it is one of the seven little schitts.

Nice troll. but I am not biting, everyone knows you are full of
bull....

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 22:08:04 -0400, hk wrote:

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:52:20 -0500, Vic Smith penned the following
well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:35:08 -0400, hk wrote:

You are assuming the home builder knows what he is doing. I would bet
against that much of the time.
It's my "impression" they usually do.
Guys who work on cars are a different story.
Beware of ads like this"
1974 Camaro $2600
Rebuilt engine and trans.
Lots of extra parts thrown in for free.

I think Harry may actually be onto something.

Homebuilders are homebuilders.... and I see a lot of homebuilt
aircraft built in the most meticulous way.... poorly. These builders
think and feel that they are building with the highest quality
possible and with the utmost attention to detail and craftsmanship.

Feeling that one knows what they are doing and really KNOWING what
they are doing may not always appear in the same place...... best
intentions notwithstanding.


I see a considerable number of "boats under construction" by amateurs
who live near the shoreline. The majority are destined to become useless
- or worse - dangerous hulks. On the other hand, I have seen some nice
"homebrew" restorations of boats worth restoring.