I think Harry will really be saddened to hear that I went to the seminar at
Fort A.P.Hill here in Virginia and got my deer permit for the base this
coming
season. Venison steaks will be for dinner!

Butch Ammon


Deer hunting? Maybe your deer are bigger, meaner, and warier back east but
shooting a deer out west here anymore is like gunning down the neighbor's pet
goat.
Darn things are all semi-tame. They are so acclimated to people that about half
of them come up and beg for snacks when they see human beings. There was
probably something to the "sport" at one time, but most of the deer around here
are not much bigger than (and no more clever than) a typical petting-zoo goat.

I think Harry will really be saddened to hear that I went to the seminar at
Fort A.P.Hill here in Virginia and got my deer permit for the base this
coming
season. Venison steaks will be for dinner!

Butch Ammon


Deer hunting? Maybe your deer are bigger, meaner, and warier back east but
shooting a deer out west here anymore is like gunning down the neighbor's pet
goat.
Darn things are all semi-tame. They are so acclimated to people that about
half
of them come up and beg for snacks when they see human beings. There was
probably something to the "sport" at one time, but most of the deer around
here
are not much bigger than (and no more clever than) a typical petting-zoo
goat.


Some of the deer in Virginia (western part around the Blue Ridge Mts and
Skyline drive areas) are HUGE... Massive 16 point bucks that can easily weigh
as much as a full grown man. The rest of Virginia has ordinary, common, deer
herds. They are not tame, but are starting to venture more and more into urban
areas and trash people's gardens - and get hit by cars!

I don't exactly "shoot" deer, as in using a rifle - I don't own a rifle. But I
have a big compound bow with 65 lbs of pull to it, and merely launch an arrow
at a deer. It's more sporty that way - you have to get REAL CLOSE to a deer
too.

Butch Ammon

I don't exactly "shoot" deer, as in using a rifle - I don't own a rifle. But
I
have a big compound bow with 65 lbs of pull to it, and merely launch an arrow
at a deer. It's more sporty that way - you have to get REAL CLOSE to a deer

too.

Yes, that does sound a little more sporting
than blasting a 75-pound Bambi from 200 yards away using a high-powered rifle
and scope. :-)

Gould 0738 wrote:

I don't exactly "shoot" deer, as in using a rifle - I don't own a rifle. But
I
have a big compound bow with 65 lbs of pull to it, and merely launch an arrow
at a deer. It's more sporty that way - you have to get REAL CLOSE to a deer

too.

Yes, that does sound a little more sporting
than blasting a 75-pound Bambi from 200 yards away using a high-powered rifle
and scope. :-)


Where's the "sport" part? Does Bambi shoot back?

--
* * *
email sent to will *never* get to me.

I don't exactly "shoot" deer, as in using a rifle - I don't own a rifle.
But
I
have a big compound bow with 65 lbs of pull to it, and merely launch an
arrow
at a deer. It's more sporty that way - you have to get REAL CLOSE to a
deer

too.

Yes, that does sound a little more sporting
than blasting a 75-pound Bambi from 200 yards away using a high-powered
rifle
and scope. :-)


Where's the "sport" part? Does Bambi shoot back?


*SIGH*

Look, a deer (or turkey, duck, heck even a pronghorn antelope) have powerful
senses far keener than man. They *know* you are out there and can detect you,
smell you, see you....

A deer rifle could "blast a deer" from 200 yards away - as you and Chuck Gould
said. But with that compound bow of mine, I only have 3 sight pins on it (10
yards, 20 yards, 30 yards). Do you know how CLOSE 30 yards actually is? How
to get a deer to walk within 30 yards is a major challenge, because of their
wariness. Now with turkeys, they are torturous creatures that frustrate even
the most seasoned of hunters. They see in full color like a human, and can see
you and your human outline from probably a 1/4 mile away!

Ducks and geese seem to know that "something doesn't look right here..." and
will flare off just outside of shotgun range. They too have senses and aerial
acrobatics to elude a spray of shotgun shot.

Anyway, let's talk about boating in this thread... I like duckhunting and
boating with friends of mine. They have big Polarcraft duck boats with the big
pop-up blinds on them. They are about 14' jon boats and have about a 25hp
outboard on them. Kinda cool looking...

Butch Ammon

Butch Ammon wrote:

I don't exactly "shoot" deer, as in using a rifle - I don't own a rifle.
But
I
have a big compound bow with 65 lbs of pull to it, and merely launch an
arrow
at a deer. It's more sporty that way - you have to get REAL CLOSE to a
deer

too.

Yes, that does sound a little more sporting
than blasting a 75-pound Bambi from 200 yards away using a high-powered
rifle
and scope. :-)


Where's the "sport" part? Does Bambi shoot back?


*SIGH*

Look, a deer (or turkey, duck, heck even a pronghorn antelope) have powerful
senses far keener than man. They *know* you are out there and can detect you,
smell you, see you....

A deer rifle could "blast a deer" from 200 yards away - as you and Chuck Gould
said. But with that compound bow of mine, I only have 3 sight pins on it (10
yards, 20 yards, 30 yards). Do you know how CLOSE 30 yards actually is? How
to get a deer to walk within 30 yards is a major challenge, because of their
wariness. Now with turkeys, they are torturous creatures that frustrate even
the most seasoned of hunters. They see in full color like a human, and can see
you and your human outline from probably a 1/4 mile away!

Ducks and geese seem to know that "something doesn't look right here..." and
will flare off just outside of shotgun range. They too have senses and aerial
acrobatics to elude a spray of shotgun shot.

Anyway, let's talk about boating in this thread... I like duckhunting and
boating with friends of mine. They have big Polarcraft duck boats with the big
pop-up blinds on them. They are about 14' jon boats and have about a 25hp
outboard on them. Kinda cool looking...

Butch Ammon

Butch, I know you to be a very decent and honorable guy, and I'm really
not picking on you, but, rather, on the concept of hunting animals as
"sport."

I'm not even anti-shotgun, as you well know. I kill my quota of
defenseless skeet every year. In fact, I think sporting clays is the
best way of all to hunt, and it is indeed a "sport," as is paper target
or range shooting. The sport is the competition.

--
* * *
email sent to will *never* get to me.

I agree with the comment that all of our food comes from somewhere. There's no
moral difference between killing the food personally or paying somebody else to
do it for you.

Will somebody please pass the A-1 steak sauce? :-)

On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 07:35:36 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

Gould 0738 wrote:

I don't exactly "shoot" deer, as in using a rifle - I don't own a rifle. But
I
have a big compound bow with 65 lbs of pull to it, and merely launch an arrow
at a deer. It's more sporty that way - you have to get REAL CLOSE to a deer

too.

Yes, that does sound a little more sporting
than blasting a 75-pound Bambi from 200 yards away using a high-powered rifle
and scope. :-)


Where's the "sport" part? Does Bambi shoot back?

C'mon Harry. "Bambi" is a cartoon characterization of a deer fawn.
That is where the similarities end. Your response is emotionally, not
reality based. Ever eat "veal"?

According to my handy-dandy Websters:

"sport n. :1a a source of diversion. b. sexual play. c(1) physical
activity engaged in for pleasure (2) a particular activity (as hunting
or an athletic game) so engaged in."

If you have an emotional aversion to hunting, so be it. Don't make it
sound like moral superiority, OK? A big part of the folly in this
country comes from moral high-handedness. Don't join it, please.

further:

"sport fish n. a fish important for the sport it affords anglers."

Let's not rehash what the meaning of the word "is" is.

Regards,
noah

I don't see where it's a sport anymore.
If your family needs the food...that's one thing, but to sit on the edge of
a field and blast away at a flock of geese walking around resting or trying
to find feed......seems a bit like shooting fish in a barrell.
Same with deer hunting. With a high powered rifle and scope...not to mention
ATV's & Ski Doos what chance does the deer have.
What's next?...laser rifles that are silent? The 'great white hunter' could
blast holes in dozens of the beasts before they are scared off. The
Beatles said it all....'hey Bunglow Bill what did you kill'

Gould 0738 wrote in message
...
I think Harry will really be saddened to hear that I went to the seminar
at
Fort A.P.Hill here in Virginia and got my deer permit for the base this
coming
season. Venison steaks will be for dinner!

Butch Ammon


Deer hunting? Maybe your deer are bigger, meaner, and warier back east but
shooting a deer out west here anymore is like gunning down the neighbor's
pet
goat.
Darn things are all semi-tame. They are so acclimated to people that about
half
of them come up and beg for snacks when they see human beings. There was
probably something to the "sport" at one time, but most of the deer around
here
are not much bigger than (and no more clever than) a typical petting-zoo
goat.

On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 02:38:37 GMT, "Don White"
wrote:

I don't see where it's a sport anymore.
If your family needs the food...that's one thing, but to sit on the edge of
a field and blast away at a flock of geese walking around resting or trying
to find feed......seems a bit like shooting fish in a barrell.
Same with deer hunting. With a high powered rifle and scope...not to mention
ATV's & Ski Doos what chance does the deer have.
What's next?...laser rifles that are silent? The 'great white hunter' could
blast holes in dozens of the beasts before they are scared off. The
Beatles said it all....'hey Bunglow Bill what did you kill'

Don, FWIW, laser sights and silencers are strictly illegal for any
kind of hunting, and any responsible hunter would not think of using
them even if they were legal. Also FWIW, if I am bird hunting
(including waterfowl), I do not shoot them if they are "down". All
shots are taken "in flight". I don't know if this makes any
difference to you, but please get the facts straight about laser
sights and silencers.

Thanks,
noah


Gould 0738 wrote in message
...
I think Harry will really be saddened to hear that I went to the seminar
at
Fort A.P.Hill here in Virginia and got my deer permit for the base this
coming
season. Venison steaks will be for dinner!

Butch Ammon


Deer hunting? Maybe your deer are bigger, meaner, and warier back east but
shooting a deer out west here anymore is like gunning down the neighbor's
pet
goat.
Darn things are all semi-tame. They are so acclimated to people that about
half
of them come up and beg for snacks when they see human beings. There was
probably something to the "sport" at one time, but most of the deer around
here
are not much bigger than (and no more clever than) a typical petting-zoo
goat.