On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 19:29:24 -0400, BAR penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:02:26 -0700, penned the
following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

Your suggestion to buy somewhere that doesn't have an HOA sounds
really good, except that most people don't have the money to buy the
kind of home they would REALLY like. In other words, not everyone is
rich, or lives in an area that the housing cost are reasonable
compared to wages. For us working folks, HOAs can be a necessary evil,
if we want to buy SOME kind of home.

It must be nice to have lots of $$.
It is unfortunate that for many, it really warps their comprehension
of the reality of life for for regular working folks.


That is odd!

Here in NC, it is the high end neighborhoods where HOAs are all the
rage. Many HOAs seem to exist, in part, to enforce rules where it
gives the illusion that no one in the neighborhood must either work
for a living or do any personal manual labor (winterize the boat, for
example).

Its all about keeping you from putting that single wide in the backyard
for mama and making sure that you don't have that old Chevy up on blocks
in the front yard fro a couple of years.


Simply a straw man. Cities and towns have ordinances governing these
practices and there really is no need to create an umbrella of civil
litigation over the existing laws.... unless you are an attorney, then
it probably seems like a great idea!

Most covenants are written such that you can keep a boat on the
property if it is housed within a garage..... and many covenants
prohibit an unattached garage. So.... you can have your boat if you
can afford a house/garage big enough to house both.

Go figure.......

Its all about resale value.

I think there is more to it than that.

--

Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC.

Homepage
http://pamandgene.idleplay.net/

Rec.boats at Lee Yeaton's Bayguide
http://www.thebayguide.com/rec.boats
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Gene Kearns wrote:
On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 19:29:24 -0400, BAR penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:02:26 -0700, penned the
following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

Your suggestion to buy somewhere that doesn't have an HOA sounds
really good, except that most people don't have the money to buy the
kind of home they would REALLY like. In other words, not everyone is
rich, or lives in an area that the housing cost are reasonable
compared to wages. For us working folks, HOAs can be a necessary evil,
if we want to buy SOME kind of home.

It must be nice to have lots of $$.
It is unfortunate that for many, it really warps their comprehension
of the reality of life for for regular working folks.

That is odd!

Here in NC, it is the high end neighborhoods where HOAs are all the
rage. Many HOAs seem to exist, in part, to enforce rules where it
gives the illusion that no one in the neighborhood must either work
for a living or do any personal manual labor (winterize the boat, for
example).
Its all about keeping you from putting that single wide in the backyard
for mama and making sure that you don't have that old Chevy up on blocks
in the front yard fro a couple of years.


Simply a straw man. Cities and towns have ordinances governing these
practices and there really is no need to create an umbrella of civil
litigation over the existing laws.... unless you are an attorney, then
it probably seems like a great idea!

Most covenants are written such that you can keep a boat on the
property if it is housed within a garage..... and many covenants
prohibit an unattached garage. So.... you can have your boat if you
can afford a house/garage big enough to house both.

Go figure.......
Its all about resale value.

I think there is more to it than that.


No, it really is all about the resale value. When you drive through my
neighborhood you see that every yard is clean and well kept, the paint
is not peeling off the trim, the garage doors all work and look good.
There are no paved over front yards, although one or two owners would do
it if they could, and houses sell rather quickly with deals that don't
fall through at the closing table.

BAR wrote:
Gene Kearns wrote:
On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 19:29:24 -0400, BAR penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:02:26 -0700, penned the
following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

Your suggestion to buy somewhere that doesn't have an HOA sounds
really good, except that most people don't have the money to buy the
kind of home they would REALLY like. In other words, not everyone is
rich, or lives in an area that the housing cost are reasonable
compared to wages. For us working folks, HOAs can be a necessary evil,
if we want to buy SOME kind of home.

It must be nice to have lots of $$.
It is unfortunate that for many, it really warps their comprehension
of the reality of life for for regular working folks.

That is odd!

Here in NC, it is the high end neighborhoods where HOAs are all the
rage. Many HOAs seem to exist, in part, to enforce rules where it
gives the illusion that no one in the neighborhood must either work
for a living or do any personal manual labor (winterize the boat, for
example).
Its all about keeping you from putting that single wide in the
backyard for mama and making sure that you don't have that old Chevy
up on blocks in the front yard fro a couple of years.


Simply a straw man. Cities and towns have ordinances governing these
practices and there really is no need to create an umbrella of civil
litigation over the existing laws.... unless you are an attorney, then
it probably seems like a great idea!

Most covenants are written such that you can keep a boat on the
property if it is housed within a garage..... and many covenants
prohibit an unattached garage. So.... you can have your boat if you
can afford a house/garage big enough to house both.

Go figure.......
Its all about resale value.

I think there is more to it than that.


No, it really is all about the resale value. When you drive through my
neighborhood you see that every yard is clean and well kept, the paint
is not peeling off the trim, the garage doors all work and look good.
There are no paved over front yards, although one or two owners would do
it if they could, and houses sell rather quickly with deals that don't
fall through at the closing table.


The developers put together the restrictive covenants and the HOA
because it helps them sell the homes initially. If the homeowners and
the HOA enforce the covenants it does make the neighborhood have much
better curb appeal and homes will sell much quicker. Nothing worse than
a yard with cars parked all over. with half the cars torn apart and not
working, it to destroy the resale value of all the homes close by.

Most HOA would not worry if someone was working on a boat for a day, but
if the boat was out in the street, or torn apart in the driveway or
yard, they would enforce the covenants. That being said, they will be
some HOA Nazi's, but if the homeowners don't like their enforcement
style, they will vote them out quickly.

"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..

Nothing worse than a yard with cars parked all over. with half the cars
torn apart and not working, it to destroy the resale value of all the
homes close by.


Our properties are private (heh) and not subject to HOA restrictions, but
*are* subject to town ordinances, conservation, etc. I had a go-a-round
with the town because I was clearing some ditches of old branches, leaves,
etc. so the water would flow better. Long story short, it took 2 years,
lawyer fees and a environmental scientist consultant to accomplish what I
could have done in an afternoon.

During this experience I got so ticked off that I started reviewing some of
the town ordinances. One, common to many towns, permits only one
unregistered vehicle to be on any property. We happen to own three adjacent
but irregularly shaped lots, all three of which meet at one point at the end
of our driveway. I seriously considered purchasing three old, rusty
"clunker" type cars and parking them next to each other where the lots meet,
each on a separate lot, just to **** the town administrators off. My wife
convinced me to be a little more rational.

Eisboch

Eisboch wrote:
"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
. ..

Nothing worse than a yard with cars parked all over. with half the cars
torn apart and not working, it to destroy the resale value of all the
homes close by.


Our properties are private (heh) and not subject to HOA restrictions, but
*are* subject to town ordinances, conservation, etc. I had a go-a-round
with the town because I was clearing some ditches of old branches, leaves,
etc. so the water would flow better. Long story short, it took 2 years,
lawyer fees and a environmental scientist consultant to accomplish what I
could have done in an afternoon.

During this experience I got so ticked off that I started reviewing some of
the town ordinances. One, common to many towns, permits only one
unregistered vehicle to be on any property. We happen to own three adjacent
but irregularly shaped lots, all three of which meet at one point at the end
of our driveway. I seriously considered purchasing three old, rusty
"clunker" type cars and parking them next to each other where the lots meet,
each on a separate lot, just to **** the town administrators off. My wife
convinced me to be a little more rational.

Eisboch


Eisboch,
You are an impetuous individual, I am sure you wife is used to
"convincing you to be a little more rational".

On Thu, 23 Aug 2007 07:27:57 -0400, BAR wrote:



No, it really is all about the resale value. When you drive through my
neighborhood you see that every yard is clean and well kept, the paint
is not peeling off the trim, the garage doors all work and look good.
There are no paved over front yards, although one or two owners would do
it if they could, and houses sell rather quickly with deals that don't
fall through at the closing table.

My neighborhood is no different and there is no HOA.
When homes reach a certain price range people take care of them.
The village imposes some fencing restrictions and they'll ticket you
if your grass gets too shaggy. Had a warning on my door when we got
back from vacation once because my son had let it go for more than a
week.
But I found this on the village website:
"FENCES
Fences are not permitted on any part of a front yard.
Fences are not permitted on any side yards that face an
intersecting street. Fences may be built up to a height of six
feet from ground level, and the finished side”of the fence
must face outward. A permit is required before installing
or replacing a fence.
PROPERTY & LAWN
MAINTENANCE
Each property owner is responsible for the minimum
maintenance requirements established by ordinance.
Code enforcement personnel routinely monitor compliance.
Using the Village’s Minimum Housing Standards
Ordinance that establish the minimum standards to ensure
the health, safety and welfare of the public, code
enforcement officers review exterior and interior maintenance,
drainage, sanitary facilities, rodent infestation
and other aesthetic, health and safety considerations.
Deficiencies include peeling paint, improper storage on
property, abandoned automobiles, and overgrown vegetation.
Residents are notified if their homes fall below
these standards.
No person may permit weeds, grass or plants other than
trees, bushes or other ornamental shrubs to grow to a
height exceeding six inches. All landscape debris must
be properly disposed. Please review the Yard Waste
information in the Garbage and Recycling section.
Violators of property maintenance codes are subject
to a code enforcement ticket and a fine between $75
and $750.
VEHICLE & BOAT STORAGE
Boats, commercial vehicles and other recreational
vehicles may not be parked or placed in front yard
driveways (front yard driveways are defined as the area
between the curb and the front building line). They
must be parked behind the building line on a hard
surface, screened from view or garaged. No vehicle
may be parked on unpaved surfaces in front yards.
Vehicles not garaged must be licensed and operable."

That boat part is even more restrictive than the HOA we're talking
about here.
As a matter of fact, I've never seen a boat anywhere around here.
Oh oh. Better tell my wife we have to move to Florida.
I'm thinking there's nothing wrong with HOA's per se so long as
you know what you're getting into. In fact, you better be aware
of local ordinances too. It's like that old Holiday Inn commercial
about surprises.

--Vic

On Thu, 23 Aug 2007 07:27:57 -0400, BAR penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:



No, it really is all about the resale value. When you drive through my
neighborhood you see that every yard is clean and well kept, the paint
is not peeling off the trim, the garage doors all work and look good.
There are no paved over front yards, although one or two owners would do
it if they could, and houses sell rather quickly with deals that don't
fall through at the closing table.

None of the properties I own have a deed restriction. All of them
sound like your description.... except I can't conceive of a paved
yard.... we have real lawns.

One neighboring house that just sold was never even listed. It sold
within an hour, the morning it went on the market.

Apparently, there are many exceptions to your rule!

--

Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC.

Homepage
http://pamandgene.idleplay.net/

Rec.boats at Lee Yeaton's Bayguide
http://www.thebayguide.com/rec.boats
-----------------
www.Newsgroup-Binaries.com - *Completion*Retention*Speed*
Access your favorite newsgroups from home or on the road
-----------------

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Thu, 23 Aug 2007 07:27:57 -0400, BAR penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

No, it really is all about the resale value. When you drive through my
neighborhood you see that every yard is clean and well kept, the paint
is not peeling off the trim, the garage doors all work and look good.
There are no paved over front yards, although one or two owners would do
it if they could, and houses sell rather quickly with deals that don't
fall through at the closing table.

None of the properties I own have a deed restriction. All of them
sound like your description.... except I can't conceive of a paved
yard.... we have real lawns.

One neighboring house that just sold was never even listed. It sold
within an hour, the morning it went on the market.

Apparently, there are many exceptions to your rule!


Gene,
Of course there are, but if you are one of the people who live next to
someone who has destroyed the value of your home, you would wish there
were restrictive covenants.

For what it is worth, most homes do have some restrictive covenants
enforced by the local or county goverements (ie zoning, sanitary etc.)

On Thu, 23 Aug 2007 08:33:47 -0400, Reginald P. Smithers III penned
the following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:


Gene,
Of course there are, but if you are one of the people who live next to
someone who has destroyed the value of your home, you would wish there
were restrictive covenants.

For what it is worth, most homes do have some restrictive covenants
enforced by the local or county goverements (ie zoning, sanitary etc.)

Ok.... again..... here is my point. Local or county governments are
free to pass *LAWS* (no taxation without representation and all of
that stuff), but they don't do restrictive covenants.

Restrictive covenants are legal obligations imposed in a deed by the
seller upon the buyer of real estate to do or not do something. (And
likely supplement and supercede any laws that don't violate police
powers..... such as SWS's example of the FCC.) Violate a restrictive
covenant and you have not violated a law..... you have (unnecessarily,
IMHO) exposed yourself to civil litigation and forfeiture of your
home, possessions, and property (protected by an all too eager group
of people that want to shape your behavior in some manner that they
find acceptable). Anybody note any contradiction there?

If someone has destroyed the value of your home, they have most likely
violated existing safety and/or zoning LAWS and the nice guys in blue
suits are likely to take care of the problem for you (with your
already collected tax money).... you don't need to pay a virtually
uncontrollable band of vigilantes to guard your interests (picture
Barney Fife screaming, "Citizens arrest!, Citizens arrest!").

However, if YOU decide that a HOA is the way to protect your
investment and THEY decide, as part of the deal, to shape you, the
conduct of your affairs, and/or how to pursue your hobbies...... well,
that is between YOU, THEM, and everyone's respective attorneys.

Have at it, just include me out.....

--

Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC.

Homepage
http://pamandgene.idleplay.net/

Rec.boats at Lee Yeaton's Bayguide
http://www.thebayguide.com/rec.boats
-----------------
www.Newsgroup-Binaries.com - *Completion*Retention*Speed*
Access your favorite newsgroups from home or on the road
-----------------

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Thu, 23 Aug 2007 07:27:57 -0400, BAR penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

No, it really is all about the resale value. When you drive through my
neighborhood you see that every yard is clean and well kept, the paint
is not peeling off the trim, the garage doors all work and look good.
There are no paved over front yards, although one or two owners would do
it if they could, and houses sell rather quickly with deals that don't
fall through at the closing table.

None of the properties I own have a deed restriction. All of them
sound like your description.... except I can't conceive of a paved
yard.... we have real lawns.

In the Wash. DC area it is becoming a real problem. Somebody buys the
house next door and rents individual rooms and to accomodate all of the
cars the front yard is paved over, removing the need for lawn maintenance.

One neighboring house that just sold was never even listed. It sold
within an hour, the morning it went on the market.

How did it go "on the market?" Usually real estate agents delay the
posting of the listing trying to get the sale themselves or keeping it
with the brokerage family.

Apparently, there are many exceptions to your rule!

All over the country.