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Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
JimH wrote: If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. If that were REALLY the case, then why aren't you as rich as Bill Gates? And don't even try to give me the horse**** excuse that you've got all the money you need and want. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"basskisser" wrote in message ups.com... NOYB wrote: "basskisser" wrote in message oups.com... NOYB wrote: "basskisser" wrote in message oups.com... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: wrote in message ups.com... A handful of boats arent representative of a nation of people. It's nothing more than an indicator. But when paired with all of the other indicators, its lends credibility to the notion that our economy is firing on all cylinders. For the wealthy. That's it. By this time next year, you'll be bartering dental services for boat gasoline. I'm already doing that. One crown no longer equals a tank of of gas. Now it takes one crown, plus one build-up beneath the crown, plus a two-surface anterior resin. If it's a posterior tooth, $25 goes into my pocket. Of course, I could always take an extra radiograph to cover bait costs too. ;-) Ah, the used car saleman of the medical field. *New* car salesmen. All of our crowns are new...and the full mouth rehabilitations cost more than *used* cars. You just aren't quite swift enough to get it, are you? Au contraire. I "get it" just fine. But your statement was neither witty nor accurate...and deserved a stupid post in response. http://tinyurl.com/qxsvl I agree with #1, 2, and 4. The rest don't apply to me. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Doug Kanter wrote: "JimH" wrote in message ups.com... First show me folks who work 90 hours/week for only an annual income of $25,000. Even Micky D's pays more than the minimum wage. My son will be making $10.50/hour plus painting houses this summer, plus another $1.50 for every hour he worked if he does not miss work (except for vacations). Never mind. You are unaware of how some people exist. I certainly do. Do not even go there. I just do not know of anyone working 90 hours/week at minimum wage. I seriously doubt that you do. Sadly, I think you are right. Let's see..... 90 hours/week x 52 weeks = 4,680 hours $25,000/4,680 hours = $5.34/hour or just above minimum wage. My son in high school paints houses during the summer full time for $10.50/hour My daughter in college go to school full time and hostess's part time for $11.50/hour Mickey D's here and most places pays at least $7.50/hour starting. Immigrants are earning up to $11/hour on fields owned by reputable farmers. No pity party here for folks willing to *settle for* minimum wage. They most likely never even got a high school diploma or worked towards their GED. My fault? Nope. Lack of motivation? Yep. And we, the tax payers, pay the price for their general welfare and healthcare. But even those settling for minimum wage and working 90 hours/week can go to school on full grants from the government by taking weekend classes. A tough life? Yep. But one that will pay off in a few years. It is all about motivation. It is all about trying to make your life better. No one else does it for you nor should they have to. If you are an adult having to work 90 hours/week at minimum wage.........shame on you.......and don't blame me or anyone else. You chose it. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
Doug,
I have always thought of myself as a fiscal conservative, and a social liberal. Since the Republicans have given up on the concept of being fiscally conservative, I may have to look more closely at the Democratic candidates this year. Damn the Republicans have gone to hell in a handbasket. They must think they are LBJ the way they are spending money they don't have. "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
NOYB,
Fess up, you know you hit the gas every night after work. :) "NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "basskisser" wrote in message ups.com... NOYB wrote: "basskisser" wrote in message oups.com... NOYB wrote: "basskisser" wrote in message oups.com... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: wrote in message ups.com... A handful of boats arent representative of a nation of people. It's nothing more than an indicator. But when paired with all of the other indicators, its lends credibility to the notion that our economy is firing on all cylinders. For the wealthy. That's it. By this time next year, you'll be bartering dental services for boat gasoline. I'm already doing that. One crown no longer equals a tank of of gas. Now it takes one crown, plus one build-up beneath the crown, plus a two-surface anterior resin. If it's a posterior tooth, $25 goes into my pocket. Of course, I could always take an extra radiograph to cover bait costs too. ;-) Ah, the used car saleman of the medical field. *New* car salesmen. All of our crowns are new...and the full mouth rehabilitations cost more than *used* cars. You just aren't quite swift enough to get it, are you? Au contraire. I "get it" just fine. But your statement was neither witty nor accurate...and deserved a stupid post in response. http://tinyurl.com/qxsvl I agree with #1, 2, and 4. The rest don't apply to me. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
JimH wrote: First show me folks who work 90 hours/week for only an annual income of $25,000. Even Micky D's pays more than the minimum wage. My son will be making $10.50/hour plus painting houses this summer, plus another $1.50 for every hour he worked if he does not miss work (except for vacations). Your son lives at home and eats out of the family fridge. Big difference. Even if you charge him a token amount for room and board, that doesn't compare to trying to make it on his own with a $420/week gross income and paying the actual expenses. Your son is lucky he has his family to fall back on, and lucky that he doesn't have to work for $8-9 an hour like many others do in this WalMart economic model. Steering back toward the main topic of this thread; your son is a perfect example of a hard working person who will never be able to afford a boat (unless he makes more money in the future). Still, more people than ever before do have *big money* to spend on boats, as well as other luxuries. My point is that for those at the top things are great and getting better, but for those at the bottom things are not so great and prospects aren't very bright, either. The number of folks in the "middle" is not increasing as fast as the numbers on the extreme ends. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
wrote in message oups.com... JimH wrote: First show me folks who work 90 hours/week for only an annual income of $25,000. Even Micky D's pays more than the minimum wage. My son will be making $10.50/hour plus painting houses this summer, plus another $1.50 for every hour he worked if he does not miss work (except for vacations). Your son lives at home and eats out of the family fridge. Big difference. Actually no. The point I made is that is that even a high school student can find a job making far more than minimum wage. Even if you charge him a token amount for room and board, that doesn't compare to trying to make it on his own with a $420/week gross income and paying the actual expenses. I never brought up anything about trying to make a living on minimum wage Chuck. I agree, it has to be tough. But that was a decision those folks living at those wages made at some point in their teenage years. Skipping out of school. Not being dependable at work. Showing up late or not showing up at all. Settling for jobs that require no commitment. Going from minimum wage job to job to job because of all that. *Our* fault? The minimum wage was established for entry level jobs......no skills needed....no education needed. Just show up and work and over time you get raises. Perhaps you are motivated enough to work hard towards the job of supervisor, then store manager. It is *your* choice which path *you* choose to take. Your son is lucky he has his family to fall back on, and lucky that he doesn't have to work for $8-9 an hour like many others do in this WalMart economic model. My son found this job on his own, as did my daughter. Both are making over $10/hour and neither has yet been out fending for themselves. The point being is that no one *has to* work for minimum wage other than the folks who have no education and/or cannot hold a job because they are lazy. And even if they did they can still work to better themselves with continued education......hard work and discipline required though. ;-) It is all about choice and taking responsibility for the directions in life you choose. And it is possible to recover from the bad choices...........but that requires commitment and hard work. We are now back to my original point. ;-) |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On 2 May 2006 11:21:16 -0700, "
wrote: JohnH wrote: Could the poor be getting poorer because they don't want to work? Hell, we've got 10-15 million (depending on who is talking) illegal aliens who came here and found jobs. If they *are* the poor you refer to, then it's their own damn fault, and their poverty is certainly skewing the statistic. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** Did you know that most poor people do work? In some cases, much longer and harder everyday than people who are well off. There is no direct correlation between the amount of work one is willing to do and the amount of money they can expect to make. Motel maids, landscape laborers, food service workers, agricultural laborers, and (increasingly) construction laborers are very hard working people who cannot earn a living wage in a typical 8-9 hour shift. Yes, they are competing with a lot of illegal immigrants. It's sad to see how the politicos of both parties want to deal with that problem: Catch the illegals after they've done some work and then deport them back to Mexico. Where is the will to deport the darned employers who pay less than minimum wage, and who pay under the table to avoid contributing to the tax base that supports the social services people not earning enough to buy food and shelter are going to need? The employers who are given phony documents and don't find out from Social Security for 5-6 months that Jose Rodriguez is not legally entitled to work in this country may have some defense, but the guy who hands out 3 ten-dollar bills to a day laborer at the end of a shift and keeps no other records has no excuse whatsoever. Well, you made my point. If most of the folks you mention above are immigrants (legal or not), then surely the *illegal* ones are increasing supply and, therefore, the price goes down. You seem to understand the consequences of the illegal immigrant problem. You also seem to be one of the few liberals who does. Given the enormous influx of illegal immigrants, and their addition to the rolls of 'the poor', how can Bush be blamed for the 'poor getting poorer'? This seems to be another reason to get rid of political arguments. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote: "JimH" wrote in message roups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On 2 May 2006 15:23:22 -0700, "
wrote: JimH wrote: First show me folks who work 90 hours/week for only an annual income of $25,000. Even Micky D's pays more than the minimum wage. My son will be making $10.50/hour plus painting houses this summer, plus another $1.50 for every hour he worked if he does not miss work (except for vacations). Your son lives at home and eats out of the family fridge. Big difference. Even if you charge him a token amount for room and board, that doesn't compare to trying to make it on his own with a $420/week gross income and paying the actual expenses. Your son is lucky he has his family to fall back on, and lucky that he doesn't have to work for $8-9 an hour like many others do in this WalMart economic model. Steering back toward the main topic of this thread; your son is a perfect example of a hard working person who will never be able to afford a boat (unless he makes more money in the future). Still, more people than ever before do have *big money* to spend on boats, as well as other luxuries. My point is that for those at the top things are great and getting better, but for those at the bottom things are not so great and prospects aren't very bright, either. The number of folks in the "middle" is not increasing as fast as the numbers on the extreme ends. And they never will get bright with a million folks a year coming across the fence willing to work for next to nothing. I can't understand why these folks are supporting the illegal immigrants when it is costing the *legal* immigrants. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Tue, 2 May 2006 18:10:11 -0400, "Reginald P. Smithers"
wrote: Doug, I have always thought of myself as a fiscal conservative, and a social liberal. Since the Republicans have given up on the concept of being fiscally conservative, I may have to look more closely at the Democratic candidates this year. Damn the Republicans have gone to hell in a handbasket. They must think they are LBJ the way they are spending money they don't have. "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? Well, the Republicans are spending lots of money, but at least the money provides jobs. I would rather see the money going to the military or even to 'pork' projects than to more 'social welfare' programs that have only one goal - to buy votes. But, this is getting very political, so I'd better stop. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. Obviously making more than a *badly paid slave* in Mexico while being here *illegally* (psst, a key word). ;-) They accept the wages proposed to them......some are more than fair........some are not. And free housing (basic wood structure with bunk living) is provided, at least at the places I have seen up north. No taxes, no cost of housing.....all while being paid a better wage than they could get in Mexico, while being here *illegally* (there is that word again). Not a bad deal...........eh? Once again, it is all about choice and personal responsibility. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:29:58 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote: JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. Sounds like the Colombian argument for allowing the production of cocaine. "You make the demand, we just meet it. Stop the demand and the growers will stop production." Slow down production and the price increases. Ditto with wages. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
" JimH" jimh_osudad@yahooDOT comREMOVETHIS wrote in message
. .. "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Doug Kanter wrote: "JimH" wrote in message ups.com... First show me folks who work 90 hours/week for only an annual income of $25,000. Even Micky D's pays more than the minimum wage. My son will be making $10.50/hour plus painting houses this summer, plus another $1.50 for every hour he worked if he does not miss work (except for vacations). Never mind. You are unaware of how some people exist. I certainly do. Do not even go there. I just do not know of anyone working 90 hours/week at minimum wage. I seriously doubt that you do. OK then. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"JohnH" wrote in message ... On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message groups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. John H I forgot to include an important piece of this puzzle. Person B's spouse works almost as many hours, so the kids are in day care a lot. Unless you want your kids in a **** hole of a day care center, do you have any idea what it costs? |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Tue, 02 May 2006 13:02:01 -0400, JohnH wrote:
Could the poor be getting poorer because they don't want to work? I realize that demonizing the enemy; in this case, the working poor, is a tried and true tactic that works in most cases. Lets give some of them the benefit of the doubt and assume that they are not lazy slobs who aren't willing to work. Hell, we've got 10-15 million (depending on who is talking) illegal aliens who came here and found jobs. And where did they come from? What are the working conditions, pay scale, and health care issues in the countries they came from? Are you suggesting workers in this country should have to compete on an equal basis with the worst of the third world working conditions, just because it happens to be in the best financial interest of large and very wealthy US businesses? Can you really justify helping those folks who make millions of dollars a year make even more millions, when it hurts the working class of this country? Do you realize it's the middle class that has made this country great, and special, and the ideal of most of the world? Feeding the greed of the wealthy in this country is a cause worthy of destroying what has made this country what it is? If they *are* the poor you refer to, then it's their own damn fault, and their poverty is certainly skewing the statistic. Yeah, it's their own damned fault they don't have billions of dollars to funnel into the campaign funds of politicians so they can get special privileges. It's their own damned fault they can't afford decent health care because the health care lobbies have been able to prevent health care reform in order to protect the massive profits. It's their own damned fault the oil companies have a free hand to write federal energy policy to protect their profits. It's their own damned fault the environmental laws have been watered down to the point of being useless in order to increase the profits of the corporations. It's their own damned fault the federal reserve has flooded the market with liquidity to the point of making our currency almost worthless. Do you have any values that benefit anyone beyond your immediate family? |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
" JimH" jimh_osudad@yahooDOT comREMOVETHIS wrote in message . .. wrote in message oups.com... JimH wrote: First show me folks who work 90 hours/week for only an annual income of $25,000. Even Micky D's pays more than the minimum wage. My son will be making $10.50/hour plus painting houses this summer, plus another $1.50 for every hour he worked if he does not miss work (except for vacations). Your son lives at home and eats out of the family fridge. Big difference. Actually no. The point I made is that is that even a high school student can find a job making far more than minimum wage. Even if you charge him a token amount for room and board, that doesn't compare to trying to make it on his own with a $420/week gross income and paying the actual expenses. I never brought up anything about trying to make a living on minimum wage Chuck. I agree, it has to be tough. But that was a decision those folks living at those wages made at some point in their teenage years. Skipping out of school. Not being dependable at work. Showing up late or not showing up at all. Settling for jobs that require no commitment. Going from minimum wage job to job to job because of all that. *Our* fault? The minimum wage was established for entry level jobs......no skills needed....no education needed. Just show up and work and over time you get raises. Perhaps you are motivated enough to work hard towards the job of supervisor, then store manager. It is *your* choice which path *you* choose to take. Your son is lucky he has his family to fall back on, and lucky that he doesn't have to work for $8-9 an hour like many others do in this WalMart economic model. My son found this job on his own, as did my daughter. Both are making over $10/hour and neither has yet been out fending for themselves. The point being is that no one *has to* work for minimum wage other than the folks who have no education and/or cannot hold a job because they are lazy. And even if they did they can still work to better themselves with continued education......hard work and discipline required though. ;-) It is all about choice and taking responsibility for the directions in life you choose. And it is possible to recover from the bad choices...........but that requires commitment and hard work. We are now back to my original point. ;-) The fact is that the minimum wage is an artificial bar created by the guvmint that disrupts the economic basic of supply and demand. It is a prop for the weak minded and the unions. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
" JimH" jimh_osudad@yahooDOT comREMOVETHIS wrote in message . .. "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. Obviously making more than a *badly paid slave* in Mexico while being here *illegally* (psst, a key word). ;-) They accept the wages proposed to them......some are more than fair........some are not. And free housing (basic wood structure with bunk living) is provided, at least at the places I have seen up north. No taxes, no cost of housing.....all while being paid a better wage than they could get in Mexico, while being here *illegally* (there is that word again). Not a bad deal...........eh? Once again, it is all about choice and personal responsibility. Exactly, no one is forced at gunpoint to work at any particular job. The minimum wage myth is a union prop. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. And how do you know this? They are making better wages than a lot of people. Day laborers in Los Angeles get $10 / hour minimum. Tax free. Beats the hell out of $9/ hour at McD's. Even legal to work people work as day laborers in California. Hard to hire day workers from the state agencies. A few years ago, cleaning out the in-laws house to get it ready to sell, I called up California EDD, Employment fDevelopment Department for 4 laborers for a Saturday. Paying 150% of minimum wage for them. EDD said OK. No one showed up. Is why the Mexicans and other Central Americans are being hired. They show up and work. I picked up 3 workers in Berkeley, and as we leave, the only legal one is a 60 year old green card Mexican. Other 2 are from El Salvador and I assume they are not legal. An about 22 year old white guy is on the corner with a sign asking for money as he is homeless. The Mexican says "Lazy, just damn lazy!". And he is correct. The street people in San Francisco cause all kinds of problems by living on the street, and still get $500 month stipend. What are your cures for the problem? |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Reginald P. Smithers" wrote in message . .. Doug, I have always thought of myself as a fiscal conservative, and a social liberal. Since the Republicans have given up on the concept of being fiscally conservative, I may have to look more closely at the Democratic candidates this year. Damn the Republicans have gone to hell in a handbasket. They must think they are LBJ the way they are spending money they don't have. "Doug Kanter" wrote in message ... "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? Only 20% of the population should go to college. The rest are not college material. We need trade schools etc. for the kids while in High School. The state college administrators in California lobbied to eliminate manual arts classes. Worse thing they could of done. A lot of those dropouts would be making good salaries as auto mechanics, boat mechanics, etc, and stayed in school and graduated. How many companies are trying to hire machinists? Quite a few, but where is the training for them? |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"JohnH" wrote in message ... On 2 May 2006 11:21:16 -0700, " wrote: JohnH wrote: Could the poor be getting poorer because they don't want to work? Hell, we've got 10-15 million (depending on who is talking) illegal aliens who came here and found jobs. If they *are* the poor you refer to, then it's their own damn fault, and their poverty is certainly skewing the statistic. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** Did you know that most poor people do work? In some cases, much longer and harder everyday than people who are well off. There is no direct correlation between the amount of work one is willing to do and the amount of money they can expect to make. Motel maids, landscape laborers, food service workers, agricultural laborers, and (increasingly) construction laborers are very hard working people who cannot earn a living wage in a typical 8-9 hour shift. Yes, they are competing with a lot of illegal immigrants. It's sad to see how the politicos of both parties want to deal with that problem: Catch the illegals after they've done some work and then deport them back to Mexico. Where is the will to deport the darned employers who pay less than minimum wage, and who pay under the table to avoid contributing to the tax base that supports the social services people not earning enough to buy food and shelter are going to need? The employers who are given phony documents and don't find out from Social Security for 5-6 months that Jose Rodriguez is not legally entitled to work in this country may have some defense, but the guy who hands out 3 ten-dollar bills to a day laborer at the end of a shift and keeps no other records has no excuse whatsoever. Well, you made my point. If most of the folks you mention above are immigrants (legal or not), then surely the *illegal* ones are increasing supply and, therefore, the price goes down. You seem to understand the consequences of the illegal immigrant problem. You also seem to be one of the few liberals who does. Given the enormous influx of illegal immigrants, and their addition to the rolls of 'the poor', how can Bush be blamed for the 'poor getting poorer'? This seems to be another reason to get rid of political arguments. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** We actually have a guest worker program now. Just applies to high tech and does keep the salaries down. H-1 visa program. But since we are going to have guest workers because of the economics and because a lot of Mercan's will not pick produce, and can collect welfare that allows them to live fairly well without hard work, we might as well institute a guest worker program for the labor class. Enforce the law so that an illegal here giving birth does not have an American Citizen. No where in our laws does it say that you are automatically a citizen by birth. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Calif Bill wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. And how do you know this? They are making better wages than a lot of people. Day laborers in Los Angeles get $10 / hour minimum. Tax free. Tax free for you, too. You're breaking the law. I've got to side with Bill on this one, Harry. You hire people who want to work, which is in NO way connected with their immigration status, which is nothing but a label. If you disagree, then you must also believe that someone who's engaged to be married can **** anyone they want because they don't have the married label yet. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
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Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Doug Kanter wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Calif Bill wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. And how do you know this? They are making better wages than a lot of people. Day laborers in Los Angeles get $10 / hour minimum. Tax free. Tax free for you, too. You're breaking the law. I've got to side with Bill on this one, Harry. You hire people who want to work, which is in NO way connected with their immigration status, which is nothing but a label. If you disagree, then you must also believe that someone who's engaged to be married can **** anyone they want because they don't have the married label yet. Which has nothing to do with the fact that Bill is paying his casual labor without withholding taxes from their pay or paying taxes on their behalf. Illegal. Which has nothing to do with this discussion. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Wed, 03 May 2006 02:14:12 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote: "JohnH" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message egroups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. John H I forgot to include an important piece of this puzzle. Person B's spouse works almost as many hours, so the kids are in day care a lot. Unless you want your kids in a **** hole of a day care center, do you have any idea what it costs? You mean to tell me that person B, (legal or illegal), has no education, is working 90 hours/week, making $5.55 hr, is producing babies on top of it? Am I supposed to feel sorry for stupidity? Did person B work Monday, or was he out marching to get more illegals into the country? -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Wed, 03 May 2006 03:04:56 GMT, bb wrote:
On Tue, 02 May 2006 13:02:01 -0400, JohnH wrote: Could the poor be getting poorer because they don't want to work? I realize that demonizing the enemy; in this case, the working poor, is a tried and true tactic that works in most cases. Lets give some of them the benefit of the doubt and assume that they are not lazy slobs who aren't willing to work. Hell, we've got 10-15 million (depending on who is talking) illegal aliens who came here and found jobs. And where did they come from? What are the working conditions, pay scale, and health care issues in the countries they came from? Are you suggesting workers in this country should have to compete on an equal basis with the worst of the third world working conditions, just because it happens to be in the best financial interest of large and very wealthy US businesses? Can you really justify helping those folks who make millions of dollars a year make even more millions, when it hurts the working class of this country? Do you realize it's the middle class that has made this country great, and special, and the ideal of most of the world? Feeding the greed of the wealthy in this country is a cause worthy of destroying what has made this country what it is? It makes no difference from where they came. They're here illegally! If they *are* the poor you refer to, then it's their own damn fault, and their poverty is certainly skewing the statistic. Yeah, it's their own damned fault they don't have billions of dollars to funnel into the campaign funds of politicians so they can get special privileges. It's their own damned fault they can't afford decent health care because the health care lobbies have been able to prevent health care reform in order to protect the massive profits. It's their own damned fault the oil companies have a free hand to write federal energy policy to protect their profits. It's their own damned fault the environmental laws have been watered down to the point of being useless in order to increase the profits of the corporations. It's their own damned fault the federal reserve has flooded the market with liquidity to the point of making our currency almost worthless. No, it's their own damned fault they left their country to come to what you obviously consider a ****-hole of a country! Your 'Jesse Jackson' tirade, above, is more tripe. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Wed, 03 May 2006 07:37:54 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote: Doug Kanter wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Calif Bill wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. And how do you know this? They are making better wages than a lot of people. Day laborers in Los Angeles get $10 / hour minimum. Tax free. Tax free for you, too. You're breaking the law. I've got to side with Bill on this one, Harry. You hire people who want to work, which is in NO way connected with their immigration status, which is nothing but a label. If you disagree, then you must also believe that someone who's engaged to be married can **** anyone they want because they don't have the married label yet. Which has nothing to do with the fact that Bill is paying his casual labor without withholding taxes from their pay or paying taxes on their behalf. Illegal. You better go check out the rules on the circumstances under which taxes must be withheld, along with Social Security, etc. Are you suggesting I've got to do all that for the kid down the block when he mows my grass? -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"JohnH" wrote in message
... I forgot to include an important piece of this puzzle. Person B's spouse works almost as many hours, so the kids are in day care a lot. Unless you want your kids in a **** hole of a day care center, do you have any idea what it costs? You mean to tell me that person B, (legal or illegal), has no education, is working 90 hours/week, making $5.55 hr, is producing babies on top of it? Am I supposed to feel sorry for stupidity? Did person B work Monday, or was he out marching to get more illegals into the country? John H Ah....the recorded response. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Doug Kanter wrote: "JohnH" wrote in message ... I forgot to include an important piece of this puzzle. Person B's spouse works almost as many hours, so the kids are in day care a lot. Unless you want your kids in a **** hole of a day care center, do you have any idea what it costs? You mean to tell me that person B, (legal or illegal), has no education, is working 90 hours/week, making $5.55 hr, is producing babies on top of it? Am I supposed to feel sorry for stupidity? Did person B work Monday, or was he out marching to get more illegals into the country? John H Ah....the recorded response. There are many people in this country who just have no understanding of or compassion for the plight of the working poor, and don't want any. It's always been that way and it always will be. I used to have compassion for the stupidity of these arrogant, unfeeling nincompoops, but no more. You know any people like that, Doug? I've known a few, but none are among my friends or people with whom I would socialize, even informally. I think John cannot imagine a situation where people might have kids when they were doing OK financially, but ended up in a lousy position afterward for any of a number of embarrassingly obvious reasons. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
Am I supposed to feel sorry for stupidity? Did person B work Monday, or was he out marching to get more illegals into the country? John H Ah....the recorded response. I wonder how many "boycotter's" went back to work the next day only to find their job had either been taken by somebody else, or had closed, or they were just plain fired??? |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
wrote in message ps.com... Am I supposed to feel sorry for stupidity? Did person B work Monday, or was he out marching to get more illegals into the country? John H Ah....the recorded response. I wonder how many "boycotter's" went back to work the next day only to find their job had either been taken by somebody else, or had closed, or they were just plain fired??? I'm sure that depends on the business. I'll guess at one or two: Restaurants: Anyone can wash dishes. But, according to Anthony Bourain's book, "Kitchen Confidential", a new chef who has an attitude toward Hispanic kitchen staff will find himself in deep trouble. They're the life blood of more kitchens than most of us realize, and restaurant owners know it. Hotels: It's much too easy for customers to switch hotel brands if they end up in a room that's not clean. I doubt many hotel managers want to swap help constantly. Too much training, too risky. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
P. Fritz wrote:
The fact is that the minimum wage is an artificial bar created by the guvmint that disrupts the economic basic of supply and demand. It is a prop for the weak minded and the unions. Well, well. Look who comes slithering out from under his rock. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
thunder wrote:
I've been following this thread with some amusement. Has anyone here thought about what would happen to this country without immigration, both legal and illegal? This economy would collapse. As with most developed countries, we depend on immigration for a growing economy. It's all about birthrates. The natives aren't breeding fast enough to sustain our population, and, as our population ages, without immigration, this Ponzi scheme will collapse. We can talk all we want about curbing illegal immigration, but it ain't going to happen. We'll just make them legal. There has to be a way for developed countries to prosper without constantly growing the population. Otherwise...where will it all end? What happens when there are 20 billion people on the planet? |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Don White wrote: P. Fritz wrote: The fact is that the minimum wage is an artificial bar created by the guvmint that disrupts the economic basic of supply and demand. It is a prop for the weak minded and the unions. Well, well. Look who comes slithering out from under his rock. Indeed. The genuine newsgroup slug. Hey! I like slugs. Pick a different animal. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
Harry Krause wrote:
Doug Kanter wrote: "JohnH" wrote in message ... I forgot to include an important piece of this puzzle. Person B's spouse works almost as many hours, so the kids are in day care a lot. Unless you want your kids in a **** hole of a day care center, do you have any idea what it costs? You mean to tell me that person B, (legal or illegal), has no education, is working 90 hours/week, making $5.55 hr, is producing babies on top of it? Am I supposed to feel sorry for stupidity? Did person B work Monday, or was he out marching to get more illegals into the country? John H Ah....the recorded response. There are many people in this country who just have no understanding of or compassion for the plight of the working poor, and don't want any. It's always been that way and it always will be. I used to have compassion for the stupidity of these arrogant, unfeeling nincompoops, but no more. You know any people like that, Doug? I've known a few, but none are among my friends or people with whom I would socialize, even informally. Left unchecked, that could be the downfall of the US. As long as the 'underclasses' feel they have a chance to rise above it.they'll play along. When that hope dies...all bets are off. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
"Don White" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: I've been following this thread with some amusement. Has anyone here thought about what would happen to this country without immigration, both legal and illegal? This economy would collapse. As with most developed countries, we depend on immigration for a growing economy. It's all about birthrates. The natives aren't breeding fast enough to sustain our population, and, as our population ages, without immigration, this Ponzi scheme will collapse. We can talk all we want about curbing illegal immigration, but it ain't going to happen. We'll just make them legal. There has to be a way for developed countries to prosper without constantly growing the population. Otherwise...where will it all end? What happens when there are 20 billion people on the planet? The concept of endless growth relates to a certain chauvinism. Anyone who watches a nature show and hears about how animals manage their territories, will say "Sure. That makes sense. Don't want too many wolves competing for the same food supply". But, humans are loathe to consider themselves animals and observe the same rules. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
Reginald P. Smithers wrote: NOYB, Fess up, you know you hit the gas every night after work. :) "NOYB" wrote in message nk.net... "basskisser" wrote in message ups.com... NOYB wrote: "basskisser" wrote in message oups.com... NOYB wrote: "basskisser" wrote in message oups.com... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: wrote in message ups.com... A handful of boats arent representative of a nation of people. It's nothing more than an indicator. But when paired with all of the other indicators, its lends credibility to the notion that our economy is firing on all cylinders. For the wealthy. That's it. By this time next year, you'll be bartering dental services for boat gasoline. I'm already doing that. One crown no longer equals a tank of of gas. Now it takes one crown, plus one build-up beneath the crown, plus a two-surface anterior resin. If it's a posterior tooth, $25 goes into my pocket. Of course, I could always take an extra radiograph to cover bait costs too. ;-) Ah, the used car saleman of the medical field. *New* car salesmen. All of our crowns are new...and the full mouth rehabilitations cost more than *used* cars. You just aren't quite swift enough to get it, are you? Au contraire. I "get it" just fine. But your statement was neither witty nor accurate...and deserved a stupid post in response. http://tinyurl.com/qxsvl I agree with #1, 2, and 4. The rest don't apply to me. Ergo, the used car salesman of the medical world. Dentists are worse than Chiropractors when it comes to making you come back to fleece you some more. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
P. Fritz wrote: The fact is that the minimum wage is an artificial bar created by the guvmint that disrupts the economic basic of supply and demand. It is a prop for the weak minded and the unions. I'm sure wages would be a lot higher for everybody if employer's weren't limited to paying only the minimum wage. I assume you support the "guest worker" program? There has to be an almost unlimited demand for people desperate enough to work for $2-3 an hour. Should we condone paying people so little that they have no realistic alternative to subsist except public assistance and/or crime, just to allow the law of "supply and demand" to operate? If you hate the minimum wage, you've gotta be thrilled with illegal immigration. |
Big Boat Business Has Been Brisk
On Wed, 03 May 2006 08:34:22 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote: JohnH wrote: On Wed, 03 May 2006 07:37:54 -0400, Harry Krause wrote: Doug Kanter wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Calif Bill wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... JohnH wrote: On Tue, 02 May 2006 19:17:35 GMT, "Doug Kanter" wrote: "JimH" wrote in message oups.com... If there is a will there is a way. It depends on how motivated the person is to succeed in life. Excuses are easy. Person A works a 40 hour week and makes 50k a year. Person B works a 90 hour week and makes 25k a year. Would you theorize that it's easier, or harder for person B to go to college? If person B is an illegal immigrant, then he shouldn't be whining. If he is a legal immigrant, then he should be whining about all the cheap labor coming over the border, not marching in the streets under a Mexican flag. If Person B is an illegal, he's here working because some sleazy American employer found a way to exploit cheap labor. Person B's basically badly paid slaves. And how do you know this? They are making better wages than a lot of people. Day laborers in Los Angeles get $10 / hour minimum. Tax free. Tax free for you, too. You're breaking the law. I've got to side with Bill on this one, Harry. You hire people who want to work, which is in NO way connected with their immigration status, which is nothing but a label. If you disagree, then you must also believe that someone who's engaged to be married can **** anyone they want because they don't have the married label yet. Which has nothing to do with the fact that Bill is paying his casual labor without withholding taxes from their pay or paying taxes on their behalf. Illegal. You better go check out the rules on the circumstances under which taxes must be withheld, along with Social Security, etc. Are you suggesting I've got to do all that for the kid down the block when he mows my grass? Nope. Nor would Bill for hiring a 'casual laborer' for a few days. -- 'Til next time, John H ****************************************** ***** Have a Spectacular Day! ***** ****************************************** |
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