NOYB wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

(!) He
looked really puzzled after he asked whether we had our sanitation Y
valve wired shut and I told him "no". I let him stew for a few seconds
before telling him we have an approved Type I MSD.

Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone, the MSD cannot be used and must be secured to
prevent discharge.When operating in a No Discharge Zone, a Type I or Type II
MSD must be secured in some way to prevent discharge. Closing the seacock
and padlocking, using a non-releasable wire-tie, or removing the seacock
handle would be sufficient.


http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...ting/4_2_f.htm

Chuck,
If you have a Type I or Type II MSD, the MSD must be secured with a seacock
and padlocking or wire-tie.


From the definitions that I've read, it appears that I have a Type III
MSD...and only the Type III MSD doesn't need to be padlocked or wired shut.
Your Type I MSD *does* need to be secured according to the description that
I posted above.


You've got it backward, NOYB.

A type-III system is a holding tank. A holding tank does nothing to
disinfect human waste.
It's simply a storage tank for sewage. You can't pump your holding tank
overboard in any inland waters or less than three miles offshore. The
only time you can operate in inland waters or less than 3-miles
offshore with a Type III without your Y valve wired shut is if you own
one of the increasing numbers of boats that have no option for disposal
of waste except a pumpout- and in that case you won't have a Y valve.

A type-I system reduces the bacterial count to something that would
compare to the output of a typical, shoreside, sewage treatment plant
and (mine, at least) also "liquifies" any solids before discharge.

Outside of a designated no-discharge zone, it is not illegal to dump
properly treated sewage into the water. (That's exactly what happens to
it if you pump out and it goes to
a taxpayer funded shoreside facility- it gets treated and dumped back
into the water). I do have a holding tank on board for use in a
no-discharge zone. When boarded, I was not in a no-discharge zone and I
did not have my Y valve wired shut. (I don't "wire it shut" when we
switch to the holding tank, to be honest- it's down in the engine room
and there is no chance that anybody would ever mess with it except
myself.

wrote in message
ups.com...

NOYB wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

(!) He
looked really puzzled after he asked whether we had our sanitation Y
valve wired shut and I told him "no". I let him stew for a few seconds
before telling him we have an approved Type I MSD.

Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone, the MSD cannot be used and must be secured
to
prevent discharge.When operating in a No Discharge Zone, a Type I or Type
II
MSD must be secured in some way to prevent discharge. Closing the seacock
and padlocking, using a non-releasable wire-tie, or removing the seacock
handle would be sufficient.


http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...ting/4_2_f.htm

Chuck,
If you have a Type I or Type II MSD, the MSD must be secured with a
seacock
and padlocking or wire-tie.


From the definitions that I've read, it appears that I have a Type III
MSD...and only the Type III MSD doesn't need to be padlocked or wired
shut.
Your Type I MSD *does* need to be secured according to the description
that
I posted above.


You've got it backward, NOYB.

"Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone, the MSD cannot be used and must be secured to
prevent discharge."

http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...ting/4_2_f.htm

NOYB wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

NOYB wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

(!) He
looked really puzzled after he asked whether we had our sanitation Y
valve wired shut and I told him "no". I let him stew for a few seconds
before telling him we have an approved Type I MSD.

Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone, the MSD cannot be used and must be secured
to
prevent discharge.When operating in a No Discharge Zone, a Type I or Type
II
MSD must be secured in some way to prevent discharge. Closing the seacock
and padlocking, using a non-releasable wire-tie, or removing the seacock
handle would be sufficient.


http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...ting/4_2_f.htm

Chuck,
If you have a Type I or Type II MSD, the MSD must be secured with a
seacock
and padlocking or wire-tie.


From the definitions that I've read, it appears that I have a Type III
MSD...and only the Type III MSD doesn't need to be padlocked or wired
shut.
Your Type I MSD *does* need to be secured according to the description
that
I posted above.


You've got it backward, NOYB.

"Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone, the MSD cannot be used and must be secured to
prevent discharge."

http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...ting/4_2_f.htm



Here's the portion that you keep overlooking:

"Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone,............................

Most of Puget Sound is *not* a no discharge zone. It is, of course,
illegal to discharge *untreated* sewage anywhere in inland waters or
less than three miles off shore. The difference is that in a "no
discharge zone" you can't dump treated sewage, either.

wrote in message
oups.com...

NOYB wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

NOYB wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

(!) He
looked really puzzled after he asked whether we had our sanitation Y
valve wired shut and I told him "no". I let him stew for a few
seconds
before telling him we have an approved Type I MSD.

Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has
been
declared a No Discharge Zone, the MSD cannot be used and must be
secured
to
prevent discharge.When operating in a No Discharge Zone, a Type I or
Type
II
MSD must be secured in some way to prevent discharge. Closing the
seacock
and padlocking, using a non-releasable wire-tie, or removing the
seacock
handle would be sufficient.


http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...ting/4_2_f.htm

Chuck,
If you have a Type I or Type II MSD, the MSD must be secured with a
seacock
and padlocking or wire-tie.


From the definitions that I've read, it appears that I have a Type III
MSD...and only the Type III MSD doesn't need to be padlocked or wired
shut.
Your Type I MSD *does* need to be secured according to the description
that
I posted above.


You've got it backward, NOYB.

"Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone, the MSD cannot be used and must be secured
to
prevent discharge."

http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...ting/4_2_f.htm



Here's the portion that you keep overlooking:

"Whenever a vessel equipped with a Type I or Type II MSD (these types
discharge treated sewage) is operating in an area of water that has been
declared a No Discharge Zone,............................

Most of Puget Sound is *not* a no discharge zone. It is, of course,
illegal to discharge *untreated* sewage anywhere in inland waters or
less than three miles off shore. The difference is that in a "no
discharge zone" you can't dump treated sewage, either.


Thanks.

Here's mo


[[Page 503]]

(b) When operating a vessel on a body of water where the discharge
of treated or untreated sewage is prohibited by the Environmental
Protection Agency under 40 CFR 140.3 or 140.4, the operator must secure
each Type I or Type II device in a manner which prevents discharge of
treated or untreated sewage. Acceptable methods of securing the device
include--
(1) Closing the seacock and removing the handle;
(2) Padlocking the seacock in the closed position;
(3) Using a non-releasable wire-tie to hold the seacock in the
closed position; or
(4) Locking the door to the space enclosing the toilets with a
padlock or door handle key lock.
(c) When operating a vessel on a body of water where the discharge
of untreated sewage is prohibited by the Environmental Protection Agency
under 40 CFR 140.3, the operator must secure each Type III device in a
manner which prevents discharge of sewage. Acceptable methods of
securing the device include--
(1) Closing each valve leading to an overboard discharge and
removing the handle;
(2) Padlocking each valve leading to an overboard discharge in the
closed position; or
(3) Using a non-releasable wire-tie to hold each valve leading to an
overboard discharge in the closed position.
[CGH 95-028, 62 FR 51194, Sept. 30, 1997]So what constitutes a
"non-releasable wire-tie"? And how do I fasten it to my thru-hull
seacock?Would monel wire wrapped several times around it suffice?

I don't understand the requirement for throwable devices. As far as I can
see on the official Coast Guard Web site, most boats over 16 feet are not
required to have them. Are you suggesting they would write you a citation
if you didn't have them?

Sherwin D.

wrote:

Enroute from Seattle to Poulsbo, (to do a little "holiday" shopping),
we got hauled down by the Coast Guard in Port Madison.

It was really no big deal, but I thought a few things were odd:

First, I was monitoring 16 but there was no attempt to hail the boat.
The CG was originally proceeding in the opposite direction, but then
did a quick turn to come up along side.

Second, the kids were, *kids*!. Two male and two female officers, (the
female officers stayed aboard the patrol boat), but they all looked
like they had graduated high school just last June.

I sort of had to help the one kid through the inspection. He didn't
know the name of the body of water where he had stopped us. (!) He
looked really puzzled after he asked whether we had our sanitation Y
valve wired shut and I told him "no". I let him stew for a few seconds
before telling him we have an approved Type I MSD. He was really
relieved as he continued his report. "Oh, yeah! Approved Type I MSD!
Super, thanks."

They looked at:

1) Documentation and ID
2) PFD's
3) oil discharge placard
4) garbage placard
5) fire extinguishers
6) horn
7) throwable devices (we carry two life rings)

They made a big deal about having Chart #1 on board. (I did).
They didn't even ask to see my flares........and that's a good thing as
my 12-gauge flares expired the end of November 2005. :-)

While the one officer followed me around the boat to check off his
list, the other officer sat at the dining table and called a *lot* of
personal information from my driver's license into a central data bank.

I did get a warning for my horn. Every few years that electric horn
gives out, and in the wet weather we have had the last few weeks it
decided to crap out since the last use and just in time for the CG
boarding. I think I'll look into an air horn. The CG officer did
mention that if I get boarded again and the horn isn't working the CG
can order me to cease operations- so I'll pick up a canned horn (which
is enough to meet the requirement) while deciding about the air horn.

Worst part of the experience was the 15 minute delay. Overall, the CG
was very professional and polite.

Apparently you are not too put-off by their Police-State tactics,
Homeland Insecurity notwithstanding. I suppose you would be similarly
accommodating if they strode in your front door at home and sat around
the dining room table going through your personal stuff, demanding to
see your furnace and water heater, and checking the batteries in your
smoke detectors. Oh, yeah, and the contents of your hard drives while
their at it.
Baaaaahhhhhh
JR

wrote:

Enroute from Seattle to Poulsbo, (to do a little "holiday" shopping),
we got hauled down by the Coast Guard in Port Madison.

It was really no big deal, but I thought a few things were odd:

First, I was monitoring 16 but there was no attempt to hail the boat.
The CG was originally proceeding in the opposite direction, but then
did a quick turn to come up along side.

Second, the kids were, *kids*!. Two male and two female officers, (the
female officers stayed aboard the patrol boat), but they all looked
like they had graduated high school just last June.

I sort of had to help the one kid through the inspection. He didn't
know the name of the body of water where he had stopped us. (!) He
looked really puzzled after he asked whether we had our sanitation Y
valve wired shut and I told him "no". I let him stew for a few seconds
before telling him we have an approved Type I MSD. He was really
relieved as he continued his report. "Oh, yeah! Approved Type I MSD!
Super, thanks."

They looked at:

1) Documentation and ID
2) PFD's
3) oil discharge placard
4) garbage placard
5) fire extinguishers
6) horn
7) throwable devices (we carry two life rings)

They made a big deal about having Chart #1 on board. (I did).
They didn't even ask to see my flares........and that's a good thing as
my 12-gauge flares expired the end of November 2005. :-)

While the one officer followed me around the boat to check off his
list, the other officer sat at the dining table and called a *lot* of
personal information from my driver's license into a central data bank.

I did get a warning for my horn. Every few years that electric horn
gives out, and in the wet weather we have had the last few weeks it
decided to crap out since the last use and just in time for the CG
boarding. I think I'll look into an air horn. The CG officer did
mention that if I get boarded again and the horn isn't working the CG
can order me to cease operations- so I'll pick up a canned horn (which
is enough to meet the requirement) while deciding about the air horn.

Worst part of the experience was the 15 minute delay. Overall, the CG
was very professional and polite.



--
--------------------------------------------------------------
Home Page: http://www.seanet.com/~jasonrnorth

JR North wrote:
Apparently you are not too put-off by their Police-State tactics,
Homeland Insecurity notwithstanding. I suppose you would be similarly
accommodating if they strode in your front door at home and sat around
the dining room table going through your personal stuff, demanding to
see your furnace and water heater, and checking the batteries in your
smoke detectors. Oh, yeah, and the contents of your hard drives while
their at it.
Baaaaahhhhhh
JR


Not put off at all. Navigation is a privilege, not a right. When one
takes up "pleasure boating" it has to be done with the understanding
that vessels in a public waterway are
subject to scrutiny by regulatory agencies. The Coast Guard was once
part of the revenue service, and inspecting cargos was an intinsic part
of the duty.

I expect to be free from "unreasonable" search and seizure. Inspecting
my furnace, water heater, smoke detectors, and examining my hard drive
(without a court order based on some evidence of a possible crime)
would be unreasonable. Making sure that the guy who might be rafted
next to me along the float at Langley has a working fire extinguisher,
or that I have one myself, is pretty much OK with me.

Besides, they asked permission to board. I don't know what would have
happened if I said "no", but I'm pretty sure that life was a whole lot
less complicated because I said "yes."

It's not much different that crossing the border and going through
customs. The customs people have the "right" to take your car apart
down to the frame if they think they need to.
Folks who can't stand the thought of being inspected at customs can
avoid the experience by not traveling. Those who can't stand the
thought of enduring a safety inspection by the Coast Guard can avoid it
by staying away from boats.