"John H." wrote in message
...
On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 17:21:02 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:


"Dan J.S." wrote in message
...

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
startribune.com
Editorial: Bush creates illusion of progress in Iraq

December 1, 2005


What about your boy Lieberman and his latest editorial? Seems to support
Bush.


For how long will Lieberman's article be your bible? Is there an
expiration
date, or does the article trump any subsequent information, regardless of
the source?


Why does the major media have so much 'respect' for Murtha's words, but so
little for Lieberman's?
--
John H

Where do you get the idea that I have no respect for Lieberman's words? I'm
sure that he actually saw the things he wrote about. But, as NOYB and I
established a few minutes ago, he did not see everything.

If he *did* see everything and withheld that information, then I would have
a reason to mistrust him. I might even want his personal investment
portfolio audited, preferably with a gun to his head, on national
television. Any time a politician supports a lousy idea, there are two
possible reasons, one or both of which are present 100% of the time: Money,
or religion.

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

"NOYB" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"NOYB" wrote in message
link.net...

It's not a matter of agreeing with him. The question is: do you believe
he is telling the truth?

He stated certain *facts* about Iraq, that are in direct contrast to
what the news media would have us believe. Is he lying or is the news
media lying?

Two separate questions for you. Sit down.

1) Is it possible that a new school could be successfully completed,
opened and populated in one part of Iraq, while in another location,
things are a total ****ing mess and have only gotten worse?

Yes. The first school is in the Shiite regions. The second is in the
Sunni regions. It's no different than red counties vs. blue counties
right in here in the good ol' U.S of A. The blue counties are analogous
to the Sunni regions.

Good! So, we've agreed that there are places which are not so happy and
shiny and peaceful.

Then ask yourself this:
Why does the media ignore the places that Lieberman talked about, and only
report about the "other" places?





2) Is it possible that a senator might not be willing or able to tour
the second location, where even our own servicemen enter at extreme risk
to themselves, in armored vehicles which are not immune to roadside
bombs?

Just like most politicians avoid visiting inner-city project housing for
fear of their own safety.

Good! That means Lieberman didn't see everything, or speak to people who
had stories which contradict the rosy picture. For instance, people whose
male family members had been taken away and killed in the middle of the
night, by the Iraqi police.

On NBC news last night, a general (in a uniform, in front of a microphone,
in Iraq) commented that out of 8 or 10 divisions of Iraqi soldiers, only 1
(as in ONE) division was ready to be self-sufficient. The rest were useful
only as backup for our own troops. One of your president's measures of
success (per his own blather last spring) was how well the Iraqi army was
doing in its training.

Perhaps someone else here can answer this question: Here in America, if
you enter Army boot camp on January 1, what is the shortest period of time
that must pass before the Army would consider you ready to be sent into
battle?

You can train riflemen to be ready to fight in well under 6 months. But how
long does it take for commanders to work their way up the ranks in the US
military? The Iraqis don't have experienced leadership, which is why their
divisions are not self-sufficient.

"NOYB" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

"NOYB" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"NOYB" wrote in message
link.net...

It's not a matter of agreeing with him. The question is: do you
believe he is telling the truth?

He stated certain *facts* about Iraq, that are in direct contrast to
what the news media would have us believe. Is he lying or is the news
media lying?

Two separate questions for you. Sit down.

1) Is it possible that a new school could be successfully completed,
opened and populated in one part of Iraq, while in another location,
things are a total ****ing mess and have only gotten worse?

Yes. The first school is in the Shiite regions. The second is in the
Sunni regions. It's no different than red counties vs. blue counties
right in here in the good ol' U.S of A. The blue counties are analogous
to the Sunni regions.

Good! So, we've agreed that there are places which are not so happy and
shiny and peaceful.

Then ask yourself this:
Why does the media ignore the places that Lieberman talked about, and only
report about the "other" places?


You've been making that same claim for over a year now. Before we can
continue discussing it, I need more information. Give me two or three
examples of the types of positive things you believe are not getting enough
coverage. No links. Your own words.

On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 12:31:53 -0500, Harry Krause wrote:

NOYB wrote:
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"NOYB" wrote in message
link.net...

It's not a matter of agreeing with him. The question is: do you believe
he is telling the truth?

He stated certain *facts* about Iraq, that are in direct contrast to what
the news media would have us believe. Is he lying or is the news media
lying?
Two separate questions for you. Sit down.

1) Is it possible that a new school could be successfully completed,
opened and populated in one part of Iraq, while in another location,
things are a total ****ing mess and have only gotten worse?

Yes. The first school is in the Shiite regions. The second is in the Sunni
regions. It's no different than red counties vs. blue counties right in
here in the good ol' U.S of A. The blue counties are analogous to the Sunni
regions.

Another example of your inability to think.




Narcissists are generally contemptuous of others.


--
John H

"It's not a *baby* kicking, beautiful bride, it's just a fetus!"
[A Self-obsessed Hypocrite]

On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 17:37:18 GMT, "NOYB" wrote:


"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...

You mean, of course, most Republican politicians. I've been on visits to
inner-city project housing with Democratic politicians.

Handing out cigarettes to bribe derelicts to vote, eh?

LOL!!
--
John H

"It's not a *baby* kicking, beautiful bride, it's just a fetus!"
[A Self-obsessed Hypocrite]

On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 17:36:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"John H." wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 17:19:52 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:

"NOYB" wrote in message
rthlink.net...

It's not a matter of agreeing with him. The question is: do you believe
he
is telling the truth?

He stated certain *facts* about Iraq, that are in direct contrast to
what
the news media would have us believe. Is he lying or is the news media
lying?

Two separate questions for you. Sit down.

1) Is it possible that a new school could be successfully completed,
opened
and populated in one part of Iraq, while in another location, things are a
total ****ing mess and have only gotten worse?

2) Is it possible that a senator might not be willing or able to tour the
second location, where even our own servicemen enter at extreme risk to
themselves, in armored vehicles which are not immune to roadside bombs?


Regardless, Doug. Why is the major media keeping silent about it?

Silent about what?

Lieberman's views, especially given the hype Murtha's gotten (and getting).

--
John H

"It's not a *baby* kicking, beautiful bride, it's just a fetus!"
[A Self-obsessed Hypocrite]

"NOYB" wrote in message
k.net...

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...

You mean, of course, most Republican politicians. I've been on visits to
inner-city project housing with Democratic politicians.

Handing out cigarettes to bribe derelicts to vote, eh?



"Narcissists are totally and inflexibly authoritarian. In other words,
they are suck-ups. They want to be authority figures and, short of that,
they want to be associated with authority figures. In their hearts, they
know they can't think well, have no judgment about what matters, are not
connected with the world they inhabit, so they cling fanatically to the
opinions of people they regard as authority figures

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
NOYB wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...

You mean, of course, most Republican politicians. I've been on visits to
inner-city project housing with Democratic politicians.

Handing out cigarettes to bribe derelicts to vote, eh?



Just because people have little money doesn't mean they are as ignorant as
your typical Republican voter.

As a matter of fact, the last time time I was in "the projects" was a
couple months ago, accompanying some local pols and a mortgage lender who
has a special program to help the working poor qualify for home ownership.
I was there to interview some of those who were signing up for a free
"homebuying" course, so I could call them from time to time to see how
they were progressing.


The last time I was on foot in "the projects" was 6 1/2 years ago when I
went knocking on the door of my perio patient who didn't show up for her
appointment at the dental school.

She had advanced periodontal disease, and no money. I convinced my
instructor to get the school to treat the case pro bono. After 4
appointments of *free* scaling and root planing and perio surgery, all she
had to do was come back in for a final post-operative evaluation to see how
her gingiva had responded to treatment. Without her showing up for the
reevaluation, I didn't get "credit" for the case...and it was threatening to
hold me up from graduating.

A white guy driving a white, four-door sedan into the projects and knocking
on someone's door sure drew a lot of funny looks...but she wouldn't answer
her phone. She begrudgingly accompanied me to the school and I graduated 4
days later.

"John H." wrote in message
...
On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 17:36:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:


"John H." wrote in message
. ..
On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 17:19:52 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:

"NOYB" wrote in message
arthlink.net...

It's not a matter of agreeing with him. The question is: do you
believe
he
is telling the truth?

He stated certain *facts* about Iraq, that are in direct contrast to
what
the news media would have us believe. Is he lying or is the news
media
lying?

Two separate questions for you. Sit down.

1) Is it possible that a new school could be successfully completed,
opened
and populated in one part of Iraq, while in another location, things are
a
total ****ing mess and have only gotten worse?

2) Is it possible that a senator might not be willing or able to tour
the
second location, where even our own servicemen enter at extreme risk to
themselves, in armored vehicles which are not immune to roadside bombs?


Regardless, Doug. Why is the major media keeping silent about it?

Silent about what?

Lieberman's views, especially given the hype Murtha's gotten (and
getting).

John, I think you need more variety in your news sources. Lieberman's thing
wasn't buried. Is something wrong with your local newspaper, or broadcast
networks?

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"NOYB" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

"NOYB" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"NOYB" wrote in message
link.net...

It's not a matter of agreeing with him. The question is: do you
believe he is telling the truth?

He stated certain *facts* about Iraq, that are in direct contrast to
what the news media would have us believe. Is he lying or is the
news media lying?

Two separate questions for you. Sit down.

1) Is it possible that a new school could be successfully completed,
opened and populated in one part of Iraq, while in another location,
things are a total ****ing mess and have only gotten worse?

Yes. The first school is in the Shiite regions. The second is in the
Sunni regions. It's no different than red counties vs. blue counties
right in here in the good ol' U.S of A. The blue counties are
analogous to the Sunni regions.

Good! So, we've agreed that there are places which are not so happy and
shiny and peaceful.

Then ask yourself this:
Why does the media ignore the places that Lieberman talked about, and
only report about the "other" places?


You've been making that same claim for over a year now. Before we can
continue discussing it, I need more information. Give me two or three
examples of the types of positive things you believe are not getting
enough coverage. No links. Your own words.

Like you, I haven't been there. So all we have to go on is the words of
others. I choose to believe our elected representatives who recently
returned from Iraq (some of them after their 3rd or 4th visit).