On Thu, 03 Nov 2005 21:57:41 +0000, Jack wrote:


If you look up the definition of a "Lie" you will find that a lie is when
you say something you know to be false at the time that you say it.
Everything that Bush has said was thought to be true. If you really
think he lied, than please tell us what the lie is that he said -
SPECIFICALLY.

If you look up the definition of lie, you will see you are referring only
to one of it's definitions. Another is, "to say or do, that which is
intended to deceive another." That being said, we, including you, do not
know if Bush lied. We do not know his reason for invading Iraq. We know
the given reason, the "bureaucratic" reason, the WMDs Iraq possessed,
*and* the threat they posed to America, but as Wolfowitz said, there were
other reasons. We do not yet know those other reasons.

There were no WMDs. Did Bush lie about them? We don't know. There is
quite a bit of speculation the Ledeen, Rove's bud, may behind the Niger
forgeries. If true, that would tend toward lying, but that, at least at
this point, is just speculation. It is quite clear that the Office of
Special Plans cherry-picked WMD intel. Was it intended to deceive, or
just a bad management decision? We don't know, do we?

Then, even if there were WMDs, Bush's statements could still be a lie, if
they were used to deceive, and divert, the American people from those
other reasons Wolfowitz mentioned. If WMDs were used, when the real
reason for the war was oil or, elimination of Israel's enemies, it would
be a lie. Those of you who say Bush didn't lie, are no more accurate
than if I were to say he did. Without knowing those other reasons for
this war, we just don't know.

I say Bush lied and not about WMD. I'm guessing he truly expected we
would find Iraq's WMD, as most Americans did. I'm saying Bush lied
because I have read the PNAC timelines, and papers. I'm saying Bush lied
because, if you read those papers, there were calls for Saddam's removal
well back into the nineties, and the reasons given then, were not WMDs.
I'm saying Bush lied because the whole issue of WMDs was a lie.

On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 07:54:52 -0500, thunder wrote:

On Thu, 03 Nov 2005 21:57:41 +0000, Jack wrote:


If you look up the definition of a "Lie" you will find that a lie is when
you say something you know to be false at the time that you say it.
Everything that Bush has said was thought to be true. If you really
think he lied, than please tell us what the lie is that he said -
SPECIFICALLY.

If you look up the definition of lie, you will see you are referring only
to one of it's definitions. Another is, "to say or do, that which is
intended to deceive another." That being said, we, including you, do not
know if Bush lied.

*That* is the point. Well said. Now spread it around.
--
John H

"It's *not* a baby kicking, bride of mine, it's just a fetus!"

HK