Here is some of the true legacy of RR. The right is putting him on a
pedestal higher than all, because of what?

Enough With Reagan Already
The Gipper's true legacy? Making the GOP as it is today: nasty,
brutish and shortsighted. Good riddance

By Mark Morford, SF Gate Columnist
Wednesday, June 16, 2004


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Let's get this straight. Ronnie Reagan allowed AIDS to flourish for
years after it was discovered and did next to nothing to stem its
virulent, lethal tide, and wouldn't even utter the word until the end
of his term, when it was too late.
Ronnie Reagan denied the existence of the nation's homeless problem
that he largely created, and then blamed the problem on not enough
people caring to get out there and get a job as he meanwhile slashed
civil services and assistance for the poor.

Ronnie Reagan pillaged the U.S. Treasury and ballooned the deficit
more than 100 percent during his term. He gave the wealthy enormous
tax breaks and gouged the living crap out health care and social
services and increased defense spending so much you'd think America
was on the verge of being attacked by giant marauding alien
centipedes.

Get that man's face on the dime!

History credits Reagan with ending the Cold War and putting the final
nail in the already-collapsing Soviet coffin. Which he did, sort of,
but not really, mostly via a massive, budget-reaming arms buildup and
via strong-arming the world and launching Star Wars and by playing
nice with all manner of dictators and then surprising everyone by
siding with Gorbachev on disarmament.

All while selling some slick, bloated version of an uber-patriotic,
thick-necked, sanitized America to a dazzled populace who were utterly
hypnotized by the man's silky-smooth ability to make toxic policy
sound like Disneyland.

Let's get this straight: Ronnie Reagan should have been impeached for
his role in the Iran-Contra scandal, for launching an illegal war on
Nicaragua, for applauding genocide in Guatemala and death squads in El
Salvador. Ronnie Reagan worked tirelessly to roll back abortion
rights, affirmative action and civil rights and was instrumental in
diminishing the voice and strength of the U.N. Ronnie Reagan opposed
stem-cell research, which could have helped end the horrible suffering
of the last decade of his own life.

Get that man's face on the 20-dollar bill!

Let us not forget: Ronnie Reagan's secretary of the interior, James
Watt, was indicted on more than 40 felony counts for leveraging his
connections at the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development to
help his cronies seek federal funds for housing projects. Nothing like
a little prison time for one of your key Cabinet members to make your
administration really shine.

As Tim Noah of Slate points out, Saddam's now-famous gassing of the
Kurds, the horrific event that BushCo never ceases to point to as
really really bad, occurred on Reagan's watch. And, in 1984, when
Reagan's hawks received their first reports that Iraq was engaged in
chemical warfare (using chemicals sold to him, in part, by the United
States), they chose to shake hands with Saddam and ignore it.

Give that man's fluffy head a spot on Mount Rushmore!

Reagan the great government shrinker? Reagan the great decreaser of
budget spending? Whatever. Truth is, spending actually increased by
one-fourth, even factoring out inflation, during his term. Know who
reversed that? Who actually decreased spending as an overall
percentage of GNP and reduced the size of government during his term?
Bill "Big Government" Clinton, that's who. Whatta jerk.

Can we forget the lovely winking deal Reagan made with the Ayatollah
Khomeini to hang on to those 52 American hostages in Iran till after
the 1980 election in order to make Jimmy Carter look small and weak?
Shall we remember how Reagan took full credit for their release, when
he had almost nothing to do with it? True American hero, that Gipper.

Ronnie Reagan tried to tell poor people that ketchup was a vegetable.

Ronnie Reagan was largely detested by his own children and wasn't
exactly highly respected for his intellect by his own Cabinet, and his
general vagueness and lack of nuanced understanding of how government
works -- not to mention how to pronounce the names of foreign leaders
and countries -- is matched only by the current least articulate least
intelligent least educated least attuned least globally respected man
who now stumbles though the Oval Office with a smirky Texas
pseudo-swagger.

Reagan could be famously snarling, pinched, mean. As California
governor, he fully cooperated with the CIA to investigate all those
nasty commie uprisings in the UC system, ended the career of then-UC
President Clark Kerr and famously warned student protesters, "If there
has to be a bloodbath, then let's get it over with." What a sweetie.
Is it too much to call Reagan "a cruel and stupid lizard" and "dumb as
a stump," as Christopher Hitchins writes? You be the judge.

Ronnie Reagan deregulated major industry and essentially loosed
corporate America upon an unsuspecting populace, including the
savings-and-loan companies, all while opening the national treasury
for his wealthy pals to loot. He promised a crackdown on
out-of-control deficit spending while working furiously to double the
national debt. "Reagan taught us that deficits don't matter," oozed a
very proud Dick Cheney, sneeringly.

But let's be fair. Let's look on Ronnie's good side, the legacy, the
reason tens of thousands are mourning the Gipper's passing and why an
aging boomer nation is still held rapt by this most beguiling and
masterful of proto-American Hollywood salesmen.

Reagan was, as widely noted, a pragmatist. He was a seductive charmer.
Gracious. He stood by his warped ideals and admitted his mistakes and
followed through on many of his promises, even if those promises
mutilated progressive ideas and stomped on the environment and gave
piles of money to the wealthy, all while sucker-punching the poor and
the working class and promising them nice shiny pennies and a big heap
of false hope if they'd just shut the hell up.

Which is why, I presume, there are any number of adorable GOP
sycophants out there right now campaigning to get the Gipper's mug on
the national currency. There are even some who want his face on
Rushmore, who think it's not enough that we named a huge airport and
an aircraft carrier and probably some nice road somewhere after him.
After all, Ronnie gave the conservative agenda its beautiful, historic
sense of bitter entitlement.

As for the mourners, they weep not because Reagan was such a profound
intellect, not because he was such a generous humanitarian, not
because he balanced budgets or worked to end poverty or because he, as
Clinton did, brokered peace in Northern Ireland and came closer than
any president in history to finally ending conflict in the Middle
East, and nearly winning the Nobel Peace Prize in the process.

No, they want Reagan canonized because he was a wildly successful,
hugely manipulative media presence. Because he charmed them to death,
because he shaped American politics like no other president in recent
history. This is what people are remembering: essentially, a surreal
and often sad and yet indelible hunk of American history, a time when
America fell under a slick jingoistic spell and conservatism found its
voice and became much of what it is today: you know, mean-spirited and
hawkish and ideologically lopsided, corporate sponsored, homophobic
and fiscally reckless and more oriented toward one overarching agenda:
military might uber alles.

This, then, is what we have to thank Reagan for. A bruising, devious,
glossy worldview, fiscal irresponsibility, the art of the slick media
sound bite, humanitarianism treated like a disease to be eradicated.

And now, with his passing, it's only appropriate to try to show a
little respect. After all, you have to give the man credit -- he did
indeed do a great deal to alter the timbre and direction modern
American politics. His legacy is convoluted and eternally debatable
and yet absolutely, undeniably extraordinary. He is the GOP's icon of
finger-wagging righteousness. He is their demigod o' slippery prefab
swagger. His attitudes and policies have had a titanic effect on the
shape of modern American conservatism.

Problem is, that shape looks increasingly, and frighteningly, like a
giant, bloody baseball bat.

That's too harsh.

So many people today think that others are "good" or "bad" people depending
upon whether their philosophies are similar to , or different than, their own.

Ronald Reagan had some screwed up principles, (in my subjective view), but he
was actually guided by those prinicples rather than the latest political poll.
He became president because America decided it needed a person with his
chracteristics, rather than because he successfully reinvented himself in an
image of what he thought the American electorate wanted.

I dislike Ronald Reagan's politics, but I have to admire the guy's style and
the sincere leadership he brought to the office.
Even though I would disagree with his philosophies, he was a good, rather than
a bad person.

On 16 Jun 2004 16:32:48 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

That's too harsh.

So many people today think that others are "good" or "bad" people depending
upon whether their philosophies are similar to , or different than, their own.

Ronald Reagan had some screwed up principles, (in my subjective view), but he
was actually guided by those prinicples rather than the latest political poll.
He became president because America decided it needed a person with his
chracteristics, rather than because he successfully reinvented himself in an
image of what he thought the American electorate wanted.

I dislike Ronald Reagan's politics, but I have to admire the guy's style and
the sincere leadership he brought to the office.
Even though I would disagree with his philosophies, he was a good, rather than
a bad person.



Thank you Chuck for showing that some liberals are not blinded by the
sheer hatred of opposing views.

As much as you might be tempted to disagree, there are a lot of
similarities between RR and our current leader. While Bush lacks
Reagan's ability to "communicate" as eloquently and effectively, he is
a leader who is guided by principles and not polls.

Dave

Dave Hall wrote:

On 16 Jun 2004 16:32:48 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

That's too harsh.

So many people today think that others are "good" or "bad" people depending
upon whether their philosophies are similar to , or different than, their own.

Ronald Reagan had some screwed up principles, (in my subjective view), but he
was actually guided by those prinicples rather than the latest political poll.
He became president because America decided it needed a person with his
chracteristics, rather than because he successfully reinvented himself in an
image of what he thought the American electorate wanted.

I dislike Ronald Reagan's politics, but I have to admire the guy's style and
the sincere leadership he brought to the office.
Even though I would disagree with his philosophies, he was a good, rather than
a bad person.



Thank you Chuck for showing that some liberals are not blinded by the
sheer hatred of opposing views.

As much as you might be tempted to disagree, there are a lot of
similarities between RR and our current leader. While Bush lacks
Reagan's ability to "communicate" as eloquently and effectively, he is
a leader who is guided by principles and not polls.

Dave


Pardon me while I roll up my pants cuffs to keep them out of Dave's
latest bull****. It's too late to save my shoes.

Bush wouldn't know a principle if he drank it.

"basskisser" wrote in message
m...
Here is some of the true legacy of RR. The right is putting him on a
pedestal higher than all, because of what?

Enough With Reagan Already
The Gipper's true legacy? Making the GOP as it is today: nasty,
brutish and shortsighted. Good riddance

By Mark Morford, SF Gate Columnist
Wednesday, June 16, 2004


Typical of today's liberals, and the Democratic part in general.
Intolerant, mean-spirited, bigoted.

Jack

"Jack Goff" wrote in message
. com...

Typical of today's liberals, and the Democratic part in general.
Intolerant, mean-spirited, bigoted.

Jack


"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child - miserable, as all spoiled
children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats."

"The principle feature of American liberalism is sanctimoniousness. By
loudly denouncing all bad things--war and hunger and date rape--liberals
testify to their own terrific goodness. More important, they promote
themselves to membership in a self-selecting elite of those who care deeply
about such things. . . . It´s a kind of natural aristocracy, and the
wonderful thing about this aristocracy is that you don´t have to be brave,
smart, strong or even lucky to join it, you just have to be liberal." --
P.J. O'Rourke

"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child - miserable, as all spoiled
children are, unsatisfied, demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats."

"The principle feature of American liberalism is sanctimoniousness. By
loudly denouncing all bad things--war and hunger and date rape--liberals
testify to their own terrific goodness. More important, they promote
themselves to membership in a self-selecting elite of those who care deeply
about such things. . . . It´s a kind of natural aristocracy, and the
wonderful thing about this aristocracy is that you don´t have to be brave,
smart, strong or even lucky to join it, you just have to be liberal." --
P.J. O'Rourke


***********
Convertible political joke.
This one tells both ways.
*********

A man died and went to Heaven.

When he got through the pearly gates, he saw St. Peter standing in front of a
huge wall, completley covered with clocks. Some of the clocks appeared to tick
once in a while, some moved rather steadily, and others seemed to be stopped.

"What are all those clocks, Pete?"

"My child, those are the clocks of lies. Everybody is born with one, and the
hands are set to midnight. Each time somebody tells a lie, the time on their
clock advances a minute. For example, here is St. Francis of Assisi's clock. In
his entire life, St Francis only told six lies so the hands only advanced to
0:06."

St. Pete contiuned, "This clock over here belongs to Jimmy Carter. He racked up
some hours a while back, but the hands seldom move these days."

The new arrival was fascinated. "Wow, that's really something! Where's the
clock for {insert John Kerry or George Bush here}?"

"Oh, that," said St. Peter, "has been relocated to God's office. He's using it
for a ceiling fan".

"Jack Goff" wrote in message .com...
"basskisser" wrote in message
m...
Here is some of the true legacy of RR. The right is putting him on a
pedestal higher than all, because of what?

Enough With Reagan Already
The Gipper's true legacy? Making the GOP as it is today: nasty,
brutish and shortsighted. Good riddance

By Mark Morford, SF Gate Columnist
Wednesday, June 16, 2004


Typical of today's liberals, and the Democratic part in general.
Intolerant, mean-spirited, bigoted.

Jack

So, you think that, because Reagan made the republican party nasty,
brutish, and short sighted, that it's somehow the Democratic party's
fault?

On 16 Jun 2004 06:36:47 -0700, (basskisser) wrote:

Here is some of the true legacy of RR. The right is putting him on a
pedestal higher than all, because of what?

Enough With Reagan Already
The Gipper's true legacy? Making the GOP as it is today: nasty,
brutish and shortsighted. Good riddance

By Mark Morford, SF Gate Columnist
Wednesday, June 16, 2004



I love it when a biased, myopic, and totally clueless liberal shows
their true colors. They are truly the champions of mean spirited
rhetoric, and groundless accusations.

I'll make a prediction that when Bill Clinton's time finally comes
that he won't be remembered with the same fond reverence as RR, but
you also won't hear the same level of deprecating speech from those on
the right, who have every reason to say those things, but still have
the class and decency not to.

Remember what your mother taught you? If you can't say something
nice.....

Dave

"Dave Hall" wrote in message

Remember what your mother taught you? If you can't say something
nice.....

Remember the Olympia Dukakis line from Steel Magnolias? "If you can't say
something
nice..... come sit by me."