"Mark Browne" wrote in message
news:P5evc.6277$sI.466@attbi_s52...

"P.Fritz" wrote in message
...

"NOYB" wrote in message
hlink.net...
I can empathize with Mr. ex-Navy. There's no reasoning with people
like
Ms.
Kneisler because they lack logic and reason. It's like trying to
debate
with a 2 year old. However, you don't get angry with the two year
old,
because he/she doesn't know any better. A grown woman like Ms.
Kneisler
should know better...and that's where the frustration sets in.

She probably does, but it is all politics......11,000 deaths, as she
cites,
would equal between 88 and 158 days of deaths of innocents that
Hussein
averaged. (depnding on whois doing the count) In reality, the US, in
the
last year, has saved up to 35,000 in the last year

much snipage

Hmmm,

I think your numbers may not tell the whole story.

Just like the liebral's sign didn't


How much of the Saddam death toll is the folks we left twist in the wind
after they thought we would support them in thier uprising?

One reason the numbers vary from 88 to 158......depends on who is doing
the counting and who is counted .


Further, how many Iraqi deaths were due to fallout from the brutal
embargo?

None.


Mark Browne

How much of the Saddam death toll is the folks we left twist in the wind
after they thought we would support them in thier uprising?

Quite a bit.

Further, how many Iraqi deaths were due to fallout from the brutal embargo?

Oh, oh. Not so fast. Saddam managed to live in a state of unfettered opulence
throughout the embargo. Remember when one of his sons loaded a 40' trailer with
$US and lit out for Iran as the invasion closed in on Baghdad? Even if the
average
denomination was a $20, a trailer-full has got to be tens of millions. That
money could have purchased a 20 pound bag of rice for every family in Iraq,
every month, for one hell of a long time. But, it didn't.

Saddam was a *******. Any ruler who will live in luxury out of the national
purse (rather than personal wealth) while kids are commonly dying from
starvation is a *******. No serious person will lament that he has been
removed- the legitimately debatable point is whether the end justified the
means.

Whether the embargo was right, or not, is less important than the established
fact Hussein did far less than he could or should have done to ease the
suffering of his people. A significant portion of the embargo deaths *are* his
fault.

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
How much of the Saddam death toll is the folks we left twist in the wind
after they thought we would support them in thier uprising?

Quite a bit.

Further, how many Iraqi deaths were due to fallout from the brutal
embargo?

Oh, oh. Not so fast. Saddam managed to live in a state of unfettered
opulence
throughout the embargo. Remember when one of his sons loaded a 40' trailer
with
$US and lit out for Iran as the invasion closed in on Baghdad? Even if the
average
denomination was a $20, a trailer-full has got to be tens of millions.
That
money could have purchased a 20 pound bag of rice for every family in
Iraq,
every month, for one hell of a long time. But, it didn't.

Saddam was a *******. Any ruler who will live in luxury out of the
national
purse (rather than personal wealth) while kids are commonly dying from
starvation is a *******. No serious person will lament that he has been
removed- the legitimately debatable point is whether the end justified the
means.

Whether the embargo was right, or not, is less important than the
established
fact Hussein did far less than he could or should have done to ease the
suffering of his people. A significant portion of the embargo deaths *are*
his
fault.


This is one of the rare cases where somebody said something that changed my
mind on a newsgroup.

Thanks.

Mark Browne

"Mark Browne" wrote in message news:P5evc.6277$sI.466@attbi_s52...
"P.Fritz" wrote in message
...

"NOYB" wrote in message
hlink.net...
I can empathize with Mr. ex-Navy. There's no reasoning with people like
Ms.
Kneisler because they lack logic and reason. It's like trying to debate
with a 2 year old. However, you don't get angry with the two year old,
because he/she doesn't know any better. A grown woman like Ms.
Kneisler
should know better...and that's where the frustration sets in.

She probably does, but it is all politics......11,000 deaths, as she
cites,
would equal between 88 and 158 days of deaths of innocents that Hussein
averaged. (depnding on whois doing the count) In reality, the US, in the
last year, has saved up to 35,000 in the last year

much snipage

Hmmm,

I think your numbers may not tell the whole story.

How much of the Saddam death toll is the folks we left twist in the wind
after they thought we would support them in thier uprising?

We should have supported them. However I would love for you to
explain the logic used to transfer blame from Saddam to the U.S. for
the thing he did.

Further, how many Iraqi deaths were due to fallout from the brutal embargo?

Who made the emabargo so brutal? Not the U.S. There was more than
enough money going into Iraq to keep everyone sustained. That money
was going through a UNITED NATIONS operated program. Saddam lived
large off that money - and it appears that official from other
countries also engaged in personally profiting from that program.

"Curtis CCR" wrote in message
m...
"Mark Browne" wrote in message
news:P5evc.6277$sI.466@attbi_s52...
"P.Fritz" wrote in message
...

"NOYB" wrote in message
hlink.net...
I can empathize with Mr. ex-Navy. There's no reasoning with people
like
Ms.
Kneisler because they lack logic and reason. It's like trying to
debate
with a 2 year old. However, you don't get angry with the two year
old,
because he/she doesn't know any better. A grown woman like Ms.
Kneisler
should know better...and that's where the frustration sets in.

She probably does, but it is all politics......11,000 deaths, as she
cites,
would equal between 88 and 158 days of deaths of innocents that
Hussein
averaged. (depnding on whois doing the count) In reality, the US, in
the
last year, has saved up to 35,000 in the last year

much snipage

Hmmm,

I think your numbers may not tell the whole story.

How much of the Saddam death toll is the folks we left twist in the wind
after they thought we would support them in thier uprising?

We should have supported them. However I would love for you to
explain the logic used to transfer blame from Saddam to the U.S. for
the thing he did.

Further, how many Iraqi deaths were due to fallout from the brutal
embargo?

Who made the emabargo so brutal? Not the U.S. There was more than
enough money going into Iraq to keep everyone sustained. That money
was going through a UNITED NATIONS operated program. Saddam lived
large off that money - and it appears that official from other
countries also engaged in personally profiting from that program.

You have to remember part of the dem's campaign strategy is "Blame America
first"