"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 17 May 2005 12:47:21 -0400, "Harry.Krause"
wrote:

Capt John wrote:
On your point number two, check the resale on their twin engine powered
boats 25 feet and larger after ten years, their a hard sell. The cost
of repower makes them hard to justify.

On number three, with the exception of very high Hp to weight engines
you can still expect to get high hours out of just about all diesels
today. Look at the extended warrenty periods, five years is not
uncommon. How long can you expect them to back an outboard? And
outboards have had very checkered past when pushing heavy boats, if
your running in heavy seas frequently, at less say 4000 RPM, those
engines are hurting themselves.

On your second number three, much of the desirable sea keeping ability
of an inboard is derived from that shaft angle that you point out. That
tends to keep the hull in the water, as you flatten that angle out they
start comming out of the water at the top of waves. This is one of the
reasons that outboards are fast on flat days and very slow on the not
so nice ones. You see the outboard boats, some of them good size, lined
up like a mother duck with her ducklings behind bigger boats, they just
can't run in a good sea without beating you up. This boat will be the
same, your just paying a lot more for the beating.

If you think the outboards won't be a problem you've never fought a big
fish. A boat like this will be used for large game fish like Tuna and
billfish. Tuna are straight up and down fighters, this is even more so
with Bluefins. With billfish, the real fun starts when they get near
the boat, and you have to be able to change positions fast, outboards
get in the way. As far as tag and release, most anglers are using
larger tackle to "land" fish they intend to release in good condition.
Light tackle tends to lower the chances of the fish being released in
good shape, they just don't survive as often. The only problem with the
larger tackle, the fish tend to come to the boat very green, making
them even more difficult to handle boat side. The engines get in the
way even more so on a green fish fighting for it's life. Can it be
done, yes, but for almost the same money you can get a better boat with
more fishing room, easier to fish from, better ride, better resale,
burn less fuel and be faster on those nasty days.

As far as puking, it wouldn't be fishing if someone isn't hanging over
the side at some point in the day Half the fun is trying to figure out
early on who it'll be.



Whatever floats your boats. I've been fishing for large and small
species for 50 years, on outboards, inboards, I/O's, rowboats, canoes,
kayaks and inflatables. I adapt my techniques to accommodate the boat I
am on, and rarely run into problems because of the type of drive it has.

Once when fishing for big species, we caught something, felt like a
large shark, that went under the boat and did its best to stay there,
until it used the inboard props or rudders to saw through the line. On
an outboard boat, I would have raised the lower units completely out of
the water.

Sorry, I really don't see outboards as a problem in fishing.

They aren't a problem - never have been.

Later,


Any engine configuration has its plusses and minuses. One thing that turned
us away from inboard diesels is the noise. 4-stroke outboards are so
blessedly quiet and make for a much more enjoyable day of fishing or
cruising.

--
Peter Aitken

On Wed, 18 May 2005 12:01:41 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

Any engine configuration has its plusses and minuses. One thing that turned
us away from inboard diesels is the noise. 4-stroke outboards are so
blessedly quiet and make for a much more enjoyable day of fishing or
cruising.

The E-TEC engine I have on the Contender are even quieter. I wouldn't
have thought it possible for a two stroke, but they are.

A nice soft steady purr. :)

Later,

Tom

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 18 May 2005 12:01:41 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

Any engine configuration has its plusses and minuses. One thing that
turned
us away from inboard diesels is the noise. 4-stroke outboards are so
blessedly quiet and make for a much more enjoyable day of fishing or
cruising.

The E-TEC engine I have on the Contender are even quieter. I wouldn't
have thought it possible for a two stroke, but they are.

A nice soft steady purr. :)

Later,

Tom\\

Interesting! Technology marches onward.

--
Peter Aitken

Tom said:
The E-Tec engines I have on the Contender are even quieter. snip
.................................................. .............
Tom,
Do you have any hours on them E-Tec's yet ?

I'm wondering just how pleased you are with them..

Any pro's or con's yet ?

I've heard that the required E-Tec Oil is quite pricey, but haven't
heard anything else negative on these engines yet.

Haven't seen any of them in my area yet.

Joe in SW FL

On Wed, 18 May 2005 14:11:09 -0400, (JK) wrote:

Tom said:
The E-Tec engines I have on the Contender are even quieter. snip
................................................. .............
Tom,
Do you have any hours on them E-Tec's yet ?

I have test hours - all three of them. :) I know some local bass
tournament types who have 90's and 200/300 hours a piece - not a
problem so far.

For the time I have on mine, I've been impressed so far. You would
just not believe how quiet they are - it's quite startling. As to
accelerations - whoa momma, it's quite the ride. Fuel efficiency
seems to be on the money as well, but I really haven't the hours on
them to give you a totally honest answer.

I'm wondering just how pleased you are with them.

Based on my experience with FICHT technology, I don't anticipate any
serious problems with them. If I don't sell my Ranger this summer,
and I'm not really trying hard to do so, I'll probably trade in the
FICHT and put a 225 E-TEC on it at the end of the season.

When I did the sea trial, I didn't coddle or baby them at all and the
response was terrific. No smell, quiet, unbelievable accelerations
and at cruise, no joke, the only sound was the radio, the wind and the
three of us talking under the T-top.

Any pro's or con's yet ?

The only issue that I am aware of was a one-time problem with a trim
and tilt motor on my engines. No problem on replacing it.

They are getting rave reviews from users - even some of the FICHT
skeptics are relaying positive reports. You are always going to get
the boo birds, most of it based on the unfortunate problems OMC had
developing the technology, but so far the boo birds I talk to and deal
with are slowly coming around. There is a difference between FICHT and
E-TEC, although I wouldn't hesitate to put a new FICHT on any of my
boats either.

I've heard that the required E-Tec Oil is quite pricey, but haven't
heard anything else negative on these engines yet.

Ok, it's not "required". The engine will run on any TCW-3 spec oil.
You just won't get the efficiency that you will get with the E-TEC
oil. It balances out in the long run - you use less of the E-TEC
spec'd oil (considerably less) so the price per tank is about what you
would pay on a regular or FICHT two stroke. Sounds odd, I know, but
that's the way of it.

Haven't seen any of them in my area yet.

There are about 25 of them - mostly 40 and 90 hp - around the
immediate area in New England and I know that a dealer in Connecticut
has sold another 10 or so in the higher horsepowers.

I'm convinced that this is the wave of the future. I might be proven
wrong, but I've put my money where my mouth is and so far, I haven't
had my faith shaken in Bombardier.

I owned three FICHTS, one 200 and two 225, and liked them a lot. I
still have the 200. I had one problem with the 200 which was very
unusual, but Bombardier was on the ball and it didn't cost me a dime.

I'm convinced. :)


Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 18 May 2005 14:11:09 -0400, (JK) wrote:

Tom said:
The E-Tec engines I have on the Contender are even quieter. snip
................................................ ..............
Tom,
Do you have any hours on them E-Tec's yet ?

I have test hours - all three of them. :) I know some local bass
tournament types who have 90's and 200/300 hours a piece - not a
problem so far.

For the time I have on mine, I've been impressed so far. You would
just not believe how quiet they are - it's quite startling. As to
accelerations - whoa momma, it's quite the ride. Fuel efficiency
seems to be on the money as well, but I really haven't the hours on
them to give you a totally honest answer.

I'm wondering just how pleased you are with them.

Based on my experience with FICHT technology, I don't anticipate any
serious problems with them. If I don't sell my Ranger this summer,
and I'm not really trying hard to do so, I'll probably trade in the
FICHT and put a 225 E-TEC on it at the end of the season.

When I did the sea trial, I didn't coddle or baby them at all and the
response was terrific. No smell, quiet, unbelievable accelerations
and at cruise, no joke, the only sound was the radio, the wind and the
three of us talking under the T-top.

Any pro's or con's yet ?

The only issue that I am aware of was a one-time problem with a trim
and tilt motor on my engines. No problem on replacing it.

They are getting rave reviews from users - even some of the FICHT
skeptics are relaying positive reports. You are always going to get
the boo birds, most of it based on the unfortunate problems OMC had
developing the technology, but so far the boo birds I talk to and deal
with are slowly coming around. There is a difference between FICHT and
E-TEC, although I wouldn't hesitate to put a new FICHT on any of my
boats either.

I've heard that the required E-Tec Oil is quite pricey, but haven't
heard anything else negative on these engines yet.

Ok, it's not "required". The engine will run on any TCW-3 spec oil.
You just won't get the efficiency that you will get with the E-TEC
oil. It balances out in the long run - you use less of the E-TEC
spec'd oil (considerably less) so the price per tank is about what you
would pay on a regular or FICHT two stroke. Sounds odd, I know, but
that's the way of it.

Haven't seen any of them in my area yet.

There are about 25 of them - mostly 40 and 90 hp - around the
immediate area in New England and I know that a dealer in Connecticut
has sold another 10 or so in the higher horsepowers.

I'm convinced that this is the wave of the future. I might be proven
wrong, but I've put my money where my mouth is and so far, I haven't
had my faith shaken in Bombardier.

I owned three FICHTS, one 200 and two 225, and liked them a lot. I
still have the 200. I had one problem with the 200 which was very
unusual, but Bombardier was on the ball and it didn't cost me a dime.

I'm convinced. :)


Later,

Tom

Any take on reliability? I have heard some pretty nasty comments about
Evinrude reliability, with Yamaha considered vastly superior.

--
Peter Aitken

On Wed, 18 May 2005 21:11:07 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:



Any take on reliability? I have heard some pretty nasty comments about
Evinrude reliability, with Yamaha considered vastly superior.

Yamaha's are good engines, but vastly superior is a stretch. The
reason that they are so "popular" is that they are making sweetheart
deals with boat builders and forcing choices towards Yamaha.

Evinrude did have several problems with FICHT technology in the
midrange engines and it was the ruin of OMC - drove the company into
bankruptcy in fact. However, in engines 175 hp and above, the
problems were non-existant. Most of the problems surrounded the 150
hp engines and the failures weren't as catastrophic as some would
claim.

So the "myth" is that Evinrude FICHT is unreliable. In fact, they
aren't unreliable at all. Talk to people who own them and you hear a
completely different story. I had three of them, one 200 which I
still own and two 225s.

I had a problem that most people don't ordinarily see with the 200. I
had a stator failure which cascaded into the EMM. Bombardier stepped
up to the plate even though this was an OMC engine and did a complete
replacement of engine electronics along with a new wiring harness. I
might add that the 200 was a demo engine and didn't have all the
upgrades installed at the time I purchased it and Bombardier took care
of that at the same time.

I have no complaints about FICHT or Bombardier. The Contender I sold
has two 225s and is run almost daily by a commercial/charter
operation. When I sold it I had almost 850 hours on each engine and
if I were guessing, they are probably up into the 1,200 hour mark now.
The last time I spoke to the owner which was about a week or so ago,
he was happy and pleased with his purchase.

At my marina, Yamaha isn't considered "superior" by any stretch of the
imagination. Parts can also be problematic and it's my understanding
that the situation hasn't improved any.

As I said earlier, E-TEC is the technology of the future and has it
all over four stroke tech. I'm convinced and as I said, I'm putting
my money where my mouth is. :)

Thanks for asking.

Later,

Tom

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 18 May 2005 21:11:07 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:



Any take on reliability? I have heard some pretty nasty comments about
Evinrude reliability, with Yamaha considered vastly superior.

Yamaha's are good engines, but vastly superior is a stretch. The
reason that they are so "popular" is that they are making sweetheart
deals with boat builders and forcing choices towards Yamaha.

Evinrude did have several problems with FICHT technology in the
midrange engines and it was the ruin of OMC - drove the company into
bankruptcy in fact. However, in engines 175 hp and above, the
problems were non-existant. Most of the problems surrounded the 150
hp engines and the failures weren't as catastrophic as some would
claim.

So the "myth" is that Evinrude FICHT is unreliable. In fact, they
aren't unreliable at all. Talk to people who own them and you hear a
completely different story. I had three of them, one 200 which I
still own and two 225s.

I had a problem that most people don't ordinarily see with the 200. I
had a stator failure which cascaded into the EMM. Bombardier stepped
up to the plate even though this was an OMC engine and did a complete
replacement of engine electronics along with a new wiring harness. I
might add that the 200 was a demo engine and didn't have all the
upgrades installed at the time I purchased it and Bombardier took care
of that at the same time.

I have no complaints about FICHT or Bombardier. The Contender I sold
has two 225s and is run almost daily by a commercial/charter
operation. When I sold it I had almost 850 hours on each engine and
if I were guessing, they are probably up into the 1,200 hour mark now.
The last time I spoke to the owner which was about a week or so ago,
he was happy and pleased with his purchase.

At my marina, Yamaha isn't considered "superior" by any stretch of the
imagination. Parts can also be problematic and it's my understanding
that the situation hasn't improved any.

As I said earlier, E-TEC is the technology of the future and has it
all over four stroke tech. I'm convinced and as I said, I'm putting
my money where my mouth is. :)

Thanks for asking.

Later,

Tom

Am I right that E-TEC is available only up to 90HP? The technology does look
compelling (I looked at the Evinrude web site) and the lack of cams, chains,
etc. can only improve reliability. In any event, the dealers for both boats
we are considering are definitely Yamaha shops so we have some limitations
because of warranty and service considerations.

--
Peter Aitken

On Thu, 19 May 2005 12:23:33 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:

Am I right that E-TEC is available only up to 90HP? The technology does look
compelling (I looked at the Evinrude web site) and the lack of cams, chains,
etc. can only improve reliability. In any event, the dealers for both boats
we are considering are definitely Yamaha shops so we have some limitations
because of warranty and service considerations.

No - E-TEC runs up to 250 hp in both fresh and sal****er versions.

If you are limited to Yamaha, then I would recommend maxing out the
boat with HPDI series Yamaha vs the four stroke.

Later,

Tom

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 May 2005 12:23:33 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
wrote:

Am I right that E-TEC is available only up to 90HP? The technology does
look
compelling (I looked at the Evinrude web site) and the lack of cams,
chains,
etc. can only improve reliability. In any event, the dealers for both
boats
we are considering are definitely Yamaha shops so we have some limitations
because of warranty and service considerations.

No - E-TEC runs up to 250 hp in both fresh and sal****er versions.

If you are limited to Yamaha, then I would recommend maxing out the
boat with HPDI series Yamaha vs the four stroke.

Later,

Tom


Why do you recommend that?


--
Peter Aitken