I'm probably not alone with this as there are probably more novice boaters
getting just as fed up as me with these money hungry things
Get ready for a bit of a story!

I have an old Johnson 90HP V4, about 1981....
A couple of weeks ago I went to start it (after probably about 2 months
without touching it) and it wouldn't start (surprise surprise) I thought
the battery was just dead as there was only a click when I tried to start it
(like what used to happen a lot with my old battery). So I put it down to
that and started disconnecting the battery to go and charge it.....

Then i smelt a real bad stink... Took the cover off... smoke
everywhere...... and black stuff coming out of the top of the starter
motor.. blown transformer smell. That was 23/12/04

Rang around a few places on 24/12/04 thought everythign would be closed...
but luckily one place was open and that had spares.... I took the boat to
them.....
They had a look at it, and found my flywheel was jammed... (not a good
feeling).
They put a big spanner onto it and got it free.... that was a bit of a
relief....
They also checked the spark plugs... they'd gone rusty Which I'm told
is due to water in the fuel...
So I bought a fuel filter... (havn't put that in yet)
So got new spark plugs, new starter motor..... Off to the boat ramp.....
Tried to start it a few times... rrrrrrr rrrrr rrrrr then I
stopped and turn the key off.....
Heard a noise from the engine and I took the cover off.... the starter motor
still had power on it... it was still spinning.... about about another
minute it stopped. (It wasn't touching the fly wheel while it was doing
this)
Tried starting it again and eventually away it went....

We went out for a few hours and all was fine.... although I didn't have as
much power as normal.... one of the other guys I was with said the choke
isn't coming off fully... they fiddled a bit and I got power back....

A couple of days later I took it away on a holiday (on the trailer).
First day of use it was fine...Pulling people on a donut thing and all.
Second day was ok most of the time but I was losing power a bit sometimes...
Third day it wouldn't start.... just a click.... ARGH! Tried about 10
times... check fly wheel, that was ok.... but all I get was a click from
somewhere......
Fiddled with the gears etc.. nothing.... eventually it started....off we
went.... about a 1 hour boat trip up the river....
It was fine most of the time, but I hit a log in the water and I lost power
after that.....I couldn't get much grunt out of it...
(I've been told this could be due to the propeller getting bent, but I
checked this later and it doesn't appear to be bent).
Anyway... we pulled over... didn't about and hour of fishing...then went
back. Started ok....
The next day I took it out again, back closer to home....
Same problem as before.... just a click when trying to start it....
Luckily there was another boat at the ramp which was having problems
starting.... and they had a cousin there who was a boat mechanic He
jumped onto the boat.. checked a few things, then he used my portable jump
starter thing directly on the starter motor while I turned the key....after
about 30-60 seconds of trying, it started....
So he said my solenoid was faulty.....
Took the boat out for about half an hour.... couple of hours fishing.. and
it started first go.
Pulled the boat out of the water.... I didn't get to wash the boat till
abotu 5 hours later... but same problem when trying to flush the
engine.... couldn't start.....
Use the jumper started on the starter motor and awy she goes after a
while...

Now for my questions
Initally I said the starter motor wouldn't stop spinning...... Could that
have something to do with the solenoid not letting go??? I'm hoping, if the
solenoid is replaced, it will fix that problem and the starting problem....
but just wondering if there could be any other things wrong....The solenoid
thing must work a bit cause the engine does start by itself if it has been
started in the last couple of hours....Does the solenoid thingy do any work
once the engine is running? Just thought that if we had to bypass it to
start the stater motor, then it never really gets used, therefore why does
it start it when the engine might be a little warmer?

On that last day out, I started using Unleaded petrol (the days previous to
that I was still using leaded). Some people say I may need a tune up once I
start using unleaded?

I'm really just trying to prepare before I contact the repair guy to fix
some stuff
The person that helped me start the engine is a mobile mechanic (doesn't
have a shop), I will probably call him to fix up the problems..... The
starting thing might be something that he can do on land.... but a tune up
and loss of power etc, that would have to be done in the water, is that
right?
Any views or help would be most appreciated

Regards
Glen

GC wrote:
I'm probably not alone with this as there are probably more novice boaters
getting just as fed up as me with these money hungry things
Get ready for a bit of a story!

I have an old Johnson 90HP V4, about 1981....
A couple of weeks ago I went to start it (after probably about 2 months
without touching it) and it wouldn't start (surprise surprise) I thought
the battery was just dead as there was only a click when I tried to start it
(like what used to happen a lot with my old battery). So I put it down to
that and started disconnecting the battery to go and charge it.....

Then i smelt a real bad stink... Took the cover off... smoke
everywhere...... and black stuff coming out of the top of the starter
motor.. blown transformer smell. That was 23/12/04

Rang around a few places on 24/12/04 thought everythign would be closed...
but luckily one place was open and that had spares.... I took the boat to
them.....
They had a look at it, and found my flywheel was jammed... (not a good
feeling).
They put a big spanner onto it and got it free.... that was a bit of a
relief....
They also checked the spark plugs... they'd gone rusty Which I'm told
is due to water in the fuel...
So I bought a fuel filter... (havn't put that in yet)
So got new spark plugs, new starter motor..... Off to the boat ramp.....
Tried to start it a few times... rrrrrrr rrrrr rrrrr then I
stopped and turn the key off.....
Heard a noise from the engine and I took the cover off.... the starter motor
still had power on it... it was still spinning.... about about another
minute it stopped. (It wasn't touching the fly wheel while it was doing
this)
Tried starting it again and eventually away it went....

We went out for a few hours and all was fine.... although I didn't have as
much power as normal.... one of the other guys I was with said the choke
isn't coming off fully... they fiddled a bit and I got power back....

A couple of days later I took it away on a holiday (on the trailer).
First day of use it was fine...Pulling people on a donut thing and all.
Second day was ok most of the time but I was losing power a bit sometimes...
Third day it wouldn't start.... just a click.... ARGH! Tried about 10
times... check fly wheel, that was ok.... but all I get was a click from
somewhere......
Fiddled with the gears etc.. nothing.... eventually it started....off we
went.... about a 1 hour boat trip up the river....
It was fine most of the time, but I hit a log in the water and I lost power
after that.....I couldn't get much grunt out of it...
(I've been told this could be due to the propeller getting bent, but I
checked this later and it doesn't appear to be bent).
Anyway... we pulled over... didn't about and hour of fishing...then went
back. Started ok....
The next day I took it out again, back closer to home....
Same problem as before.... just a click when trying to start it....
Luckily there was another boat at the ramp which was having problems
starting.... and they had a cousin there who was a boat mechanic He
jumped onto the boat.. checked a few things, then he used my portable jump
starter thing directly on the starter motor while I turned the key....after
about 30-60 seconds of trying, it started....
So he said my solenoid was faulty.....
Took the boat out for about half an hour.... couple of hours fishing.. and
it started first go.
Pulled the boat out of the water.... I didn't get to wash the boat till
abotu 5 hours later... but same problem when trying to flush the
engine.... couldn't start.....
Use the jumper started on the starter motor and awy she goes after a
while...

Now for my questions
Initally I said the starter motor wouldn't stop spinning...... Could that
have something to do with the solenoid not letting go??? I'm hoping, if the
solenoid is replaced, it will fix that problem and the starting problem....
but just wondering if there could be any other things wrong....The solenoid
thing must work a bit cause the engine does start by itself if it has been
started in the last couple of hours....Does the solenoid thingy do any work
once the engine is running? Just thought that if we had to bypass it to
start the stater motor, then it never really gets used, therefore why does
it start it when the engine might be a little warmer?


Yes the starter staying on does sound like a stuck solenoid, but the
"click" symptom may or may not be related to the solenoid. It's almost
certainly a bad connection in the heavy starter wiring from the battery,
+ &/or -. You can sorta isolate the likely place by checking the voltage
(with a cheap $10 multimeter) progressively along the route (where ever
you can get access at heavy lead connecting points) commencing at the
battery & ending at the starter itself. Do this while someone holds the
key on start for you. Also feel where ever there's a connection, the
offending connection(s) will get warm to hot very quickly. Of course you
can just go through all of them, clean & re-tighten one by one.

Once running the solenoid does nothing, only on cranking.

It's probably got a bit of rust or grunge etc, try giving it a good
clean & activate it a few times with the starter wire disconnected, to
satisfy yourself it's operating feely etc. A "little" say WD40 is OK to
encourage it but don't overdo it, you don't want oil on the heavy load
contacts.


On that last day out, I started using Unleaded petrol (the days previous to
that I was still using leaded). Some people say I may need a tune up once I
start using unleaded?

The unleaded fuel shouldn't effect the starting.


I'm really just trying to prepare before I contact the repair guy to fix
some stuff
The person that helped me start the engine is a mobile mechanic (doesn't
have a shop), I will probably call him to fix up the problems..... The
starting thing might be something that he can do on land.... but a tune up
and loss of power etc, that would have to be done in the water, is that
right?

He should be able to tune it OK not in the water, but you should prefer
a water test to make sure you're happy. An 81 engine is not young as of
a week ago it's what 23-24 yrs old??? it will probably be a bit down on
power but still serviceable if cared for.

When you stop using it for any long amount of time say months, consider
letting some protective oil remain in it. You can get spray cans of
fogging oil (or just buy light oil & use a household trigger sprayer),
with the engine idling just spray a little in each carb (air silencer
off) or till the engine stalls on account of it. This will coat the
needle roller & ball bearings with oil, then squirt a little down each
plug hole & finger tight only put the plugs back in leaving the leads
off. When you want to start using it again, take the plugs out & give it
a crank or two to make sure any excess oil has been thrown out , plugs
in, leads & it'll last much longer.

K

Any views or help would be most appreciated

Regards
Glen

Replace the solenoid!

--
Bill
Chesapeake, Va


"GC" wrote in message
...
I'm probably not alone with this as there are probably more novice boaters
getting just as fed up as me with these money hungry things
Get ready for a bit of a story!

I have an old Johnson 90HP V4, about 1981....
A couple of weeks ago I went to start it (after probably about 2 months
without touching it) and it wouldn't start (surprise surprise) I thought
the battery was just dead as there was only a click when I tried to start
it
(like what used to happen a lot with my old battery). So I put it down to
that and started disconnecting the battery to go and charge it.....

Then i smelt a real bad stink... Took the cover off... smoke
everywhere...... and black stuff coming out of the top of the starter
motor.. blown transformer smell. That was 23/12/04

Rang around a few places on 24/12/04 thought everythign would be closed...
but luckily one place was open and that had spares.... I took the boat to
them.....
They had a look at it, and found my flywheel was jammed... (not a good
feeling).
They put a big spanner onto it and got it free.... that was a bit of a
relief....
They also checked the spark plugs... they'd gone rusty Which I'm told
is due to water in the fuel...
So I bought a fuel filter... (havn't put that in yet)
So got new spark plugs, new starter motor..... Off to the boat ramp.....
Tried to start it a few times... rrrrrrr rrrrr rrrrr then I
stopped and turn the key off.....
Heard a noise from the engine and I took the cover off.... the starter
motor
still had power on it... it was still spinning.... about about another
minute it stopped. (It wasn't touching the fly wheel while it was doing
this)
Tried starting it again and eventually away it went....

We went out for a few hours and all was fine.... although I didn't have as
much power as normal.... one of the other guys I was with said the choke
isn't coming off fully... they fiddled a bit and I got power back....

A couple of days later I took it away on a holiday (on the trailer).
First day of use it was fine...Pulling people on a donut thing and all.
Second day was ok most of the time but I was losing power a bit
sometimes...
Third day it wouldn't start.... just a click.... ARGH! Tried about 10
times... check fly wheel, that was ok.... but all I get was a click from
somewhere......
Fiddled with the gears etc.. nothing.... eventually it started....off we
went.... about a 1 hour boat trip up the river....
It was fine most of the time, but I hit a log in the water and I lost
power
after that.....I couldn't get much grunt out of it...
(I've been told this could be due to the propeller getting bent, but I
checked this later and it doesn't appear to be bent).
Anyway... we pulled over... didn't about and hour of fishing...then went
back. Started ok....
The next day I took it out again, back closer to home....
Same problem as before.... just a click when trying to start it....
Luckily there was another boat at the ramp which was having problems
starting.... and they had a cousin there who was a boat mechanic He
jumped onto the boat.. checked a few things, then he used my portable jump
starter thing directly on the starter motor while I turned the
key....after
about 30-60 seconds of trying, it started....
So he said my solenoid was faulty.....
Took the boat out for about half an hour.... couple of hours fishing.. and
it started first go.
Pulled the boat out of the water.... I didn't get to wash the boat till
abotu 5 hours later... but same problem when trying to flush the
engine.... couldn't start.....
Use the jumper started on the starter motor and awy she goes after a
while...

Now for my questions
Initally I said the starter motor wouldn't stop spinning...... Could that
have something to do with the solenoid not letting go??? I'm hoping, if
the
solenoid is replaced, it will fix that problem and the starting
problem....
but just wondering if there could be any other things wrong....The
solenoid
thing must work a bit cause the engine does start by itself if it has been
started in the last couple of hours....Does the solenoid thingy do any
work
once the engine is running? Just thought that if we had to bypass it to
start the stater motor, then it never really gets used, therefore why does
it start it when the engine might be a little warmer?

On that last day out, I started using Unleaded petrol (the days previous
to
that I was still using leaded). Some people say I may need a tune up once
I
start using unleaded?

I'm really just trying to prepare before I contact the repair guy to fix
some stuff
The person that helped me start the engine is a mobile mechanic (doesn't
have a shop), I will probably call him to fix up the problems..... The
starting thing might be something that he can do on land.... but a tune
up
and loss of power etc, that would have to be done in the water, is that
right?
Any views or help would be most appreciated

Regards
Glen

Initally I said the starter motor wouldn't stop spinning...... Could that
have something to do with the solenoid not letting go???

I second the notion..

replace the solonoid switch, and also see if the teeth on the flywheel are worn
on the bottom side where the drive clutch will enguage it. sometimes the
blunted flywheel has the gear worn where the drive clutch can't engage because
it's "jamming" in the teeth, and can't engage smoothly and will "lock up" the
drive clutch so the mmotor cant't spin properly.

Tim

Tim

Thanks for your help....
I had a read of a service manual and I understand a little more about how it
works, and yeah it keeps pointing out that it could be a loose or dirty
cable....
I'll get the pro to look at it anyway

Thanks again!



"K. Smith" wrote in message
...
GC wrote:
I'm probably not alone with this as there are probably more novice
boaters
getting just as fed up as me with these money hungry things
Get ready for a bit of a story!

I have an old Johnson 90HP V4, about 1981....
A couple of weeks ago I went to start it (after probably about 2 months
without touching it) and it wouldn't start (surprise surprise) I
thought
the battery was just dead as there was only a click when I tried to
start it
(like what used to happen a lot with my old battery). So I put it down
to
that and started disconnecting the battery to go and charge it.....

Then i smelt a real bad stink... Took the cover off... smoke
everywhere...... and black stuff coming out of the top of the starter
motor.. blown transformer smell. That was 23/12/04

Rang around a few places on 24/12/04 thought everythign would be
closed...
but luckily one place was open and that had spares.... I took the boat
to
them.....
They had a look at it, and found my flywheel was jammed... (not a good
feeling).
They put a big spanner onto it and got it free.... that was a bit of a
relief....
They also checked the spark plugs... they'd gone rusty Which I'm
told
is due to water in the fuel...
So I bought a fuel filter... (havn't put that in yet)
So got new spark plugs, new starter motor..... Off to the boat
ramp.....
Tried to start it a few times... rrrrrrr rrrrr rrrrr then
I
stopped and turn the key off.....
Heard a noise from the engine and I took the cover off.... the starter
motor
still had power on it... it was still spinning.... about about another
minute it stopped. (It wasn't touching the fly wheel while it was doing
this)
Tried starting it again and eventually away it went....

We went out for a few hours and all was fine.... although I didn't have
as
much power as normal.... one of the other guys I was with said the
choke
isn't coming off fully... they fiddled a bit and I got power back....

A couple of days later I took it away on a holiday (on the trailer).
First day of use it was fine...Pulling people on a donut thing and all.
Second day was ok most of the time but I was losing power a bit
sometimes...
Third day it wouldn't start.... just a click.... ARGH! Tried about 10
times... check fly wheel, that was ok.... but all I get was a click from
somewhere......
Fiddled with the gears etc.. nothing.... eventually it started....off we
went.... about a 1 hour boat trip up the river....
It was fine most of the time, but I hit a log in the water and I lost
power
after that.....I couldn't get much grunt out of it...
(I've been told this could be due to the propeller getting bent, but I
checked this later and it doesn't appear to be bent).
Anyway... we pulled over... didn't about and hour of fishing...then went
back. Started ok....
The next day I took it out again, back closer to home....
Same problem as before.... just a click when trying to start it....
Luckily there was another boat at the ramp which was having problems
starting.... and they had a cousin there who was a boat mechanic
He
jumped onto the boat.. checked a few things, then he used my portable
jump
starter thing directly on the starter motor while I turned the
key....after
about 30-60 seconds of trying, it started....
So he said my solenoid was faulty.....
Took the boat out for about half an hour.... couple of hours fishing..
and
it started first go.
Pulled the boat out of the water.... I didn't get to wash the boat till
abotu 5 hours later... but same problem when trying to flush the
engine.... couldn't start.....
Use the jumper started on the starter motor and awy she goes after a
while...

Now for my questions
Initally I said the starter motor wouldn't stop spinning...... Could
that
have something to do with the solenoid not letting go??? I'm hoping, if
the
solenoid is replaced, it will fix that problem and the starting
problem....
but just wondering if there could be any other things wrong....The
solenoid
thing must work a bit cause the engine does start by itself if it has
been
started in the last couple of hours....Does the solenoid thingy do any
work
once the engine is running? Just thought that if we had to bypass it to
start the stater motor, then it never really gets used, therefore why
does
it start it when the engine might be a little warmer?


Yes the starter staying on does sound like a stuck solenoid, but the
"click" symptom may or may not be related to the solenoid. It's almost
certainly a bad connection in the heavy starter wiring from the battery,
+ &/or -. You can sorta isolate the likely place by checking the voltage
(with a cheap $10 multimeter) progressively along the route (where ever
you can get access at heavy lead connecting points) commencing at the
battery & ending at the starter itself. Do this while someone holds the
key on start for you. Also feel where ever there's a connection, the
offending connection(s) will get warm to hot very quickly. Of course you
can just go through all of them, clean & re-tighten one by one.

Once running the solenoid does nothing, only on cranking.

It's probably got a bit of rust or grunge etc, try giving it a good
clean & activate it a few times with the starter wire disconnected, to
satisfy yourself it's operating feely etc. A "little" say WD40 is OK to
encourage it but don't overdo it, you don't want oil on the heavy load
contacts.


On that last day out, I started using Unleaded petrol (the days previous
to
that I was still using leaded). Some people say I may need a tune up
once I
start using unleaded?

The unleaded fuel shouldn't effect the starting.


I'm really just trying to prepare before I contact the repair guy to fix
some stuff
The person that helped me start the engine is a mobile mechanic
(doesn't
have a shop), I will probably call him to fix up the problems..... The
starting thing might be something that he can do on land.... but a tune
up
and loss of power etc, that would have to be done in the water, is that
right?

He should be able to tune it OK not in the water, but you should prefer
a water test to make sure you're happy. An 81 engine is not young as of
a week ago it's what 23-24 yrs old??? it will probably be a bit down on
power but still serviceable if cared for.

When you stop using it for any long amount of time say months, consider
letting some protective oil remain in it. You can get spray cans of
fogging oil (or just buy light oil & use a household trigger sprayer),
with the engine idling just spray a little in each carb (air silencer
off) or till the engine stalls on account of it. This will coat the
needle roller & ball bearings with oil, then squirt a little down each
plug hole & finger tight only put the plugs back in leaving the leads
off. When you want to start using it again, take the plugs out & give it
a crank or two to make sure any excess oil has been thrown out , plugs
in, leads & it'll last much longer.

K

Any views or help would be most appreciated

Regards
Glen