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Old March 14th 04, 06:56 AM
O:P\)
 
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Default power vs sail

I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail? Do I need extra skills for sail boats? One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.



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Old March 14th 04, 07:32 AM
Gould 0738
 
Posts: n/a
Default power vs sail

I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail?


Do I need extra skills for sail boats?


Yup. In addition to knowing how to run a power boat, (which is what you would
likely be doing the majority of time for local jaunts on most sailboats..) you
need to learn how to sail.

Sailing fits well with folks who aren't in a hurry, and enjoy a more natural
experience. If you're the type who likes to backpack into the woods with a
poncho, a tarp, and a pound of granola you might make a great sailor. If your
idea of getting back to nature is to putt slowly through Yellowstone in a
Winnebago.......you're a powerboater.

Sailing will have you on deck in all kinds of weather, but powerboating can
make you feel isolated from the water.

1000 different boaters will give you 999 different answers. One option is a
power boat with a sailing dinghy. You need a dinghy anyway, might as well have
one rigged for sailing and you can enjoy being blown around by the wind a bit.

Here's an idea: Find two friends with boats.
One a powerboater, and the other a sailor.
Tell them each you will help wash the boat some Saturday if they will take you
out for the afternoon. That should get you a ride. :-)

Then, compare.

It's all boating, it's all having fun on the water. There are those who see
each school of boating as a "divine calling" and sneer at boaters in the
opposite category.
And yes, that's just as ignorant and prejudiced as it seems.

Any kind of boating can be fun.


One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.


Some of the Provinces require boaters to complete and education course. I know
BC does. Not sure about Ontario.


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Old March 14th 04, 03:50 PM
Rosalie B.
 
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Default power vs sail

x-no-archive:yes

"O:P\)" wrote:

I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail? Do I need extra skills for sail boats? One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.

I don't know if you need a license in Toronto or not. In some places
one has to take an elementary course of some kind in order to operate
a boat if you are younger than a certain age.

Yes you do need extra skills for a sailboat, although there are some
sailboats that never sail, so they are basically motor boats that
can't go under low fixed bridges. But even though there are folks
that have no motors on their sailboats and sail everywhere, usually if
you have a sailboat you also need to know about motor boats too.

There are quite a few different ways of getting into sailing in
Toronto.

Showing up at the sailing clubs on their race days and learn as you go
- by crewing for folks who have boats. Sailing OP (other people's)
boats is a real cheap way to go sailing. Be aware that some people
who race are really into winning and will not be amused if you drop
the sail in the water or commit some other faux pas - if you fall in,
they may not leave the race to come and get you.

There are many folks in the Toronto area who live aboard their boats,
even in the winter. I've also met some going down the ICW - folks from
Toronto and other places in Canada who want to escape the cold. For
some time, even before we had a boat, I belonged to an email list that
is run out of the University of Toronto computer, called the
Live-Aboard List.
___________________________________
|| The Live-Aboard List : send a "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" request ||
|| in body of message to: ||

You can talk to some of those folks.

Or you can take lessons from one of the sailing schools. These are
about $1200 CAD for your first 4 levels but each club/school
structures their programs differently and rates vary considerably.

grandma Rosalie
http://www12.virtualtourist.com/m/4a9c6/
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Old March 14th 04, 05:13 PM
Charles T. Low
 
Posts: n/a
Default power vs sail

Wow - that's a little like saying I would like some place to live, should I
choose an apartment or a house or a condo or a cottage or a mobile home or
trailer, or cardboard box in a ditch, with or without covered parking, one
bedroom or six, maybe a fireplace, what type of heating, rural or urban...
you get my drift.

However, the important thing is that boating is the most important activity
in the world, so you're on the right track.

Licensing in Canada is federal, not provincial, so it's the same everywhere
in the country. (Actually, not quite the same - there are exceptions for
some northern regions). It depends i) how old you are vs. what power the
boat has and ii) how long it is. Those are two separate, unrelated
requirements - if either apply, you need a "card" - they're actually quite
careful _not_ to call it a licence. The regs are he
www.ccg-gcc.gc.ca/obs-bsn/sbg-gsn/age_e.htm and
www.ccg-gcc.gc.ca/obs-bsn/courses_e.htm.

I'm a proponent of the card whether you need it legally or not, but that's a
controversial issue. Check www.boatdocking.com/other/Licence.html.

Your general questions fit in well here or on rec.boats, and your
specifically Canadian ones could also go to can.rec.boating. Tell a little
more about yourself and about why boating interests you, for more specific
replies.

Charles

====

Charles T. Low
- remove "UN"
www.boatdocking.com/BDPhoto.html - Photo Contest
www.boatdocking.com
www.ctlow.ca/Trojan26 - my boat

====

"O:P)" wrote in message
ble.rogers.com...
I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail? Do I need extra skills for sail boats?

One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.




  #5   Report Post  
Old March 14th 04, 05:21 PM
O:P\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default power vs sail

Thank you for your replies. I think I will be going with sail boat, I just
wanted to hear what others had to say about it and if there are any major
issues to consider. My reasons a
1.the price of the boats, I want a roomy boat, when I look at power boats,
they go for 25-50 thousand when over 25', sail boats are much less
expensive, I've seen 25-27 footers on ebay for 6-12 thousand. I'm sure that
the condition of the boat makes a huge difference in the price (like
anything else, for sure).
2.safety, I think that if a power boat fails to start in the middle of the
lake you are dead in the water (kind of hard to row back to shore a 25-30',
x-thousand pound boat), with the sail boat, you can always catch the wind,
no engine no problem.
3.time. I have my own enterprise and my time is kind of limited (the money
too), but I know I can make time for a boat, here and there couple of days.
So this is something else to consider for me. If I'm going to buy a boat, I
prefer to tide 15 thousand as opposed to 50 thousand on a boat that I'll use
5-6 times a year.
What are you opinions? Please, I need as much info as you folks can provide
from you past experiences.
I don't want to make any more mistakes than what I have to when buying a
boat. Any good surveyors in Toronto area? Should I look for a private deal
or I'm better of with a broker? If I tell a broker that I want to spend
around 10 thousand, will he take me seriously? (his commission will be much
lower than if I'm looking to spend 250, right?)
Eventually, I would like to take the boat to Florida (Miami area), how long
should I plan for a trip like that on a sail boat?
As for sailing/boating schools, any suggestions?




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Old March 14th 04, 05:52 PM
Don White
 
Posts: n/a
Default power vs sail


O:P) wrote in message
ble.rogers.com...
I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail? Do I need extra skills for sail boats?

One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.

Unless you feel the 'need for speed', I'd go sail. After all, half the fun
is getting there, not to mention the sound of the water against your
hull/wind in your rigging etc.
Newer 4 cycle outboards are getting a lot quieter and fresher smelling so
the difference isn't as drastic as on an older boat with a large 2 cycle
infernal engine.

As for courses, I'd recommend the Canadian Power & Sail Squadron. Take the
'boating Course' which is a good start and
will give you your operators card. (compulsory by 2009).
Next, I'd look for a keelboat course at a local yacht club/marina.
From what I've seen on the internet, Toronto is a good place to sail..with
lots of clubs and a good choice of 2nd hand boats.
Don't forget about the lakes north of you.
I have a trip planned up your way in May to shop for a 19' trailerable
mini-cruiser. If you see any good ones...let me know.


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Old March 14th 04, 06:10 PM
Gerry Wolfe
 
Posts: n/a
Default power vs sail

On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 05:56:07 GMT, "O:P\)" wrote:

I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail? Do I need extra skills for sail boats? One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.

1. Check out the basic / intro course at a local Power Squadron.
Canadian Yachting Assoc also has certification & courses from intro
thru offshore passagemaking.
2. In Toronto, you require an "operator's permit" for any motorized
boat within the downtown area (basically from Bluffer's Park to Humber
River, within a couple miles of shore). Testing is on basic
rules-of-the-road and a short practical test (back off the dock, pick
up a life-jacket, c'mon back). Marine police check pretty regularly
within the inner harbour (if you've got a powerboat especially).
3. I think you also need a Coast Guard licence. At one time, if you
had the Toronto Port Authority "operator's permit" you could also get
the CG one without further testing; maybe even vice-versa.
4. If your boat has a VHF radio (pretty well a necessity) you need a
"base station" permit and an "operator's permit".

Some of the local yacht clubs provide basic intro sailing lessons --
either on a dinghy (geared towards racing) altho a few also have
keelboat lessons (my club, Ashbridge's Bay Yacht Club, for example).
Clubs also tend to have prep courses for licencing and sometimes even
administer the testing. ABYC is putting together a membership
category that includes timesharing a 25ft sailboat (a blatant plug )

I dunno of any lessons available on operating a powerboat.

Hope this helps,
g.
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Old March 14th 04, 08:13 PM
Parallax
 
Posts: n/a
Default power vs sail

(Gould 0738) wrote in message ...
I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail?


Do I need extra skills for sail boats?


Yup. In addition to knowing how to run a power boat, (which is what you would
likely be doing the majority of time for local jaunts on most sailboats..) you
need to learn how to sail.

Sailing fits well with folks who aren't in a hurry, and enjoy a more natural
experience. If you're the type who likes to backpack into the woods with a
poncho, a tarp, and a pound of granola you might make a great sailor. If your
idea of getting back to nature is to putt slowly through Yellowstone in a
Winnebago.......you're a powerboater.

Sailing will have you on deck in all kinds of weather, but powerboating can
make you feel isolated from the water.

1000 different boaters will give you 999 different answers. One option is a
power boat with a sailing dinghy. You need a dinghy anyway, might as well have
one rigged for sailing and you can enjoy being blown around by the wind a bit.

Here's an idea: Find two friends with boats.
One a powerboater, and the other a sailor.
Tell them each you will help wash the boat some Saturday if they will take you
out for the afternoon. That should get you a ride. :-)

Then, compare.

It's all boating, it's all having fun on the water. There are those who see
each school of boating as a "divine calling" and sneer at boaters in the
opposite category.
And yes, that's just as ignorant and prejudiced as it seems.

Any kind of boating can be fun.


One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.


Some of the Provinces require boaters to complete and education course. I know
BC does. Not sure about Ontario.



Maybe a motorsailor like a Nauticat. Then either sail or power with
performance simuilar to a trawler but the draft problems of a
sailboat.
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Old March 14th 04, 08:16 PM
Parallax
 
Posts: n/a
Default power vs sail

(Gould 0738) wrote in message ...
I am playing with the idea of a boat. I'm new to boating. What would you
folks recommend, power or sail?


Do I need extra skills for sail boats?


Yup. In addition to knowing how to run a power boat, (which is what you would
likely be doing the majority of time for local jaunts on most sailboats..) you
need to learn how to sail.

Sailing fits well with folks who aren't in a hurry, and enjoy a more natural
experience. If you're the type who likes to backpack into the woods with a
poncho, a tarp, and a pound of granola you might make a great sailor. If your
idea of getting back to nature is to putt slowly through Yellowstone in a
Winnebago.......you're a powerboater.

Sailing will have you on deck in all kinds of weather, but powerboating can
make you feel isolated from the water.



1000 different boaters will give you 999 different answers. One option is a
power boat with a sailing dinghy. You need a dinghy anyway, might as well have
one rigged for sailing and you can enjoy being blown around by the wind a bit.

Here's an idea: Find two friends with boats.
One a powerboater, and the other a sailor.
Tell them each you will help wash the boat some Saturday if they will take you
out for the afternoon. That should get you a ride. :-)

Then, compare.

It's all boating, it's all having fun on the water. There are those who see
each school of boating as a "divine calling" and sneer at boaters in the
opposite category.
And yes, that's just as ignorant and prejudiced as it seems.

Any kind of boating can be fun.


One
more question, do I need a license? and if yes, where do I get it? I'm in
Toronto.


Some of the Provinces require boaters to complete and education course. I know
BC does. Not sure about Ontario.


A LICENSE TO SAIL???, makes my blood run cold. Once, I went sailing
with a German friend and he innocently asked if I needed a license to
sail. I was appalled into speechlessness but ducked below and got the
shotgun and said "Heres my license".


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