It's a PR piece for a new product. "Articles" like this is very common in
all boating magazines. Normally they agree to run so many ads if the
magazine agrees to run the piece.


"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On 15 Oct 2004 20:22:41 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

Double the Power, or Half the Space?


We recently dropped by Boat Electric (on Westlake Avenue in Seattle) to
visit
with Harris Allen, of Meridian Marine Progressive Products. Meridian
Marine
Progressive Products is the marine distribution and marketing arm of the
Northstar Battery Company. Boat Electric has been selling the Meridian
Marine
batteries, and business is so brisk that employees have resorted hooking
the
Meridian batteries on display together with zip ties.
"We had a lot of people tearing apart the display to get to the
batteries,"
said a Boat Electric spokesperson. "We were having to rebuild the display
all
the time, and we would really rather sell a battery out of our store
room."

We wanted to know why these batteries are becoming so popular with NW
boaters,
and Harris Allen proved to be very informative. Harris shared a general
outline
of the company history and the specific battery technology employed in the
Meridian Marine battery.

*****

What can you tell us about the company itself?

"Northstar Battery was formed three or three and a half years ago by an
international group of battery company executives. Many of them were from
Europe. They had an idea that they wanted to build a better battery. They
went
out and raised $60-million in venture capital, and built the most advanced
battery-manufacturing plant in the world in Springfield, Missouri. They
built
the plant in Missouri because the two largest lead mines in the US are
located
there."

"The founders realized that if they were going to build an improved
battery,
they would have to go outside the traditional manufacturing processes used
by
all the other manufacturers. A new approach was required, and they adapted
technology from aerospace, automotive, and other industries to get the
robotics
that they needed to assemble these batteries."

With all of the batteries on the market, why would a Northwest boater want
to
specifically consider yours?

"One of the most remarkable things about the Meridian Marine battery is
that my
unit with amp-hour capacity equivalent with a traditional 8D battery is
only
about half the size. It is slightly taller, but our battery is only
5-inches
wide. We can effectively put two of these in the space of a single 8D. In
fact,
many people put two new Meridians into the same battery box that
previously
held only one 8D. I ask prospective customers whether they would prefer
to
recover half the space currently used by batteries, or enjoy double the
power.
It's a win-win decision, no matter how a boater decides."

"The Meridian Marine battery is a premium product. They cost a lot more to
manufacture, and to buy, than some battery purchased off the shelf in an
auto
parts store. Although the initial cost is higher than an off-the-shelf 8D,
the
Meridian battery will have a service life that is almost four times as
long as
the cheaper product."


Is it correct to assume that your batteries utilize AGM technology?


"Yes, that's correct. You can call it AGM, for 'absorbed glass mat', but
it is
also referred to as a 'starved electrolyte' battery. Layers of lead plates
are
separated by layers of glass mat, and the mat is soaked with electrolyte.
Once
assembled into a bundle, the alternating lead and glass bundles are
compressed
as part of the manufacturing process. Most manufacturers achieve about a
ten-
percent compression. Through the use of robotics, Northstar Battery has
been
able to come up with over a thirty- percent compression. This means that
we can
get a huge amount of plate area into a smaller space. The critical
consideration is the amount of plate area in contact with the electrolyte,
so
the bundle can be compressed without loss of capacity."

"Another advantage of a Meridian Battery is that if you should split the
case,
the battery isn't going to leak. All the electrolyte is contained in the
glass
mat."


Isn't it true that an AGM battery can be installed in any position, except
maybe upside down?

"You can't install one upside down. You'll notice on these particular
batteries
that there's a unique feature. Any sealed battery has valves in it, and
falls
into a class we call 'valve regulated lead-acid batteries'. If you reach a
case
pressure of, (in our case at least) 5 psi then the vents open. It takes a
serious overcharge to reach a case pressure of 5 psi, but when you do
you're
venting hydrogen gas. On our particular battery, if the valves should ever
open
the gas will go into this vent chamber, here on the top of the battery.
The
vent chamber is an excellent feature, and we go a step beyond that. We
have two
plastic nipples on the vent chamber so we can install plastic tubing. We
can
use the tubing to daisy chain the batteries together, and then drain the
gasses
overboard anywhere we want."

"In Fort Lauderdale, we do a lot of Feadships and other big boats. Most of
them
fall under SOLAS, GMDSS requirements which means they have to have a
back-up
battery bank for their electronics. Typically, that's under the helm,
where all
the electronics are.
When we have batteries under the electronics, we don't want to run the
risk of
the battery charger going crazy and venting corrosive gas onto the
electronics.
In a case like that, we use the remote venting feature and vent the
batteries
out the side of the boat.

Are the vent tube fittings fairly well exclusive to the Meridian Marine
product
line?

"Yes, it's a very unique solution. It allows us to do rack mount
installations.
Rather than have batteries stuck all around the engine room, we just weld
up a
stainless rack, install a number of batteries on their sides, and use a
single
vent for all of them."


Do Meridians make good starting batteries?

"Yes, because of the compression factor we have a tremendous amount of
plate
area in the battery and that gives them excellent starting power. Take a
look
at our 115-amp model for example. Most people would consider that a very
compact battery, it's 4 ¼ inches wide, and 15 inches long. We just did a
refit
on a 150-foot Trinity, with a 53-litre, 1800 HP, 3512 Cat. The starting
bank
consists of two of these batteries combined to create 24-volts."

"Take a look at our 210-amp model. As you can see, it is rated at 1830
cold
cranking amps, and most 8D's are rated at about 1200. We have about 50%
more
cranking power, in a battery that occupies only half the space."

What are the sizes most commonly purchased by pleasure boaters?

"We just follow the standard marine ratings. We sell a lot of 115-amp,
130-amp,
and 210-amp batteries to boaters. By putting two of those 210-amp
batteries
into a 8D box, all of a sudden you have created a 420-amp battery. Most of
the
8D's are 200, 210 or 225 amps, depending upon who built the battery. The
term
8D refers to case size. Our 210-amp battery is sort of in the middle,
capacity
wise, with most of the 8D batteries on the market, but it's only half the
size.
Putting two of these into the space traditionally occupied by an 8D
creates a
battery that is about double most 8D units. That's why I ask people
whether
they would prefer to have twice the power, or only use up half the space."

How about deep-cycle durability?

"Consider the typical, off-the-shelf flooded cell 8D battery. At 50%
discharge,
you're looking at 200 to 250 recharge cycles before that battery is done.
With
a Meridian, you can get over 800 cycles from 50% discharge. The deeper you
discharge a battery, the fewer cycles you are going to get. A standard 8D
discharged to 80% would be lucky to survive more than about 100 cycles. A
Meridian discharged to 80% will last for over 500 recharges."

How has the marine market responded to your product so far?

"Well, Boat Electric is a good example. They waited a little while and
studied
the idea before they turned in their first stocking order. Sales in the
Pacific
Northwest have exploded, with batteries all but flying out the door.
Boaters
love these. We're now the OEM battery for Hinckley, Palmer Johnson,
Direktor
Shipyards, Lyman Morse, and nearly all the high-speed, custom sport fish
guys.

***

While most Pacific Northwest boaters won't be purchasing a Hinckley in the
immediate future, it's fun to realize that our boats could rather
realistically
have a battery in common with such a prestigious craft. Next time the
batteries
wear out, it might be well to consider a newly relevant question when
replacing
them, "Do I want to use half the space, or enjoy double the power?"



Chuck, was that an advertisement? I read a lot of nice words, but didn't
see any
test results or other statistics to support the claims.


John H

On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD,
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

There are 10 kinds of people in the world,
those who can do binary and those who can't!

It's a PR piece for a new product. "Articles" like this is very common in
all boating magazines. Normally they agree to run so many ads if the
magazine agrees to run the piece.

You don't know a goddam thing about boats, and don't even begin to insinuate
you know anything about boating magazines.

Pick up any issue of any boating magazine, and if it is reasonably successful
you can go through the magazine and say, "Oh, look! Here's an ad for that
company or brand of boat that was featured in an article this month. Must be
something fu'd going on here." Of course the fact that the same company or
product may have advertised regularly for years means nothing....

Now count the dozens, scores, or in some of the largest publications the
*hundreds* of ads for companies that do not have articles appearing in the
issue. Any explanation for those?

Add the publishing business to the list of things you need to learn more about.

Did I say something to offend you? If so, I must have missed it.

I do know about Boating Mags and all magazines because I worked for a
marketing company and we used to "buy" these PR pieces all the time.

What did offend you about my comment? It was a PR fluff piece, nothing
wrong with that.




"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
It's a PR piece for a new product. "Articles" like this is very common
in
all boating magazines. Normally they agree to run so many ads if the
magazine agrees to run the piece.

You don't know a goddam thing about boats, and don't even begin to
insinuate
you know anything about boating magazines.

Pick up any issue of any boating magazine, and if it is reasonably
successful
you can go through the magazine and say, "Oh, look! Here's an ad for that
company or brand of boat that was featured in an article this month. Must
be
something fu'd going on here." Of course the fact that the same company or
product may have advertised regularly for years means nothing....

Now count the dozens, scores, or in some of the largest publications the
*hundreds* of ads for companies that do not have articles appearing in the
issue. Any explanation for those?

Add the publishing business to the list of things you need to learn more
about.

Did I say something to offend you? If so, I must have missed it.

I do know about Boating Mags and all magazines because I worked for a
marketing company and we used to "buy" these PR pieces all the time.



You presumed to declare a motivation behind the article. You were wrong.

You presumed to declare that there is an advertising deal in the works between
my publisher and the battery company. You are wrong again. There is no
quid-pro-quo as you insisted.(The company that retails this product in town
*does* advertise in my publisher's magazine, and all other regional
publications, and has done so every month for about 20 years. Odds are good
that they will advertise for another 20 whether we ever mentioned their name
outside of their ad space, or not. Our revenue from that account will not
increase, or decrease ten cents as a result of the interview).

When you run a specialty publication addressing a narrow field of interest,
there will certainly be many instances when an article features a company that
is also an advertiser. I suppose to be really uptight about it, we could adopt
a policy that read,
"We will refuse to accept any advertising from your firm for one issue prior
and two issues beyond the month any editorial regarding your company appears."
Not likely to happen. We try not to be whores, but by the same token there's no
point in being a self righteous martyr.

On 16 Oct 2004 01:51:52 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

When you run a specialty publication addressing a narrow field of interest,
there will certainly be many instances when an article features a company that
is also an advertiser. I suppose to be really uptight about it, we could adopt
a policy that read,

"We will refuse to accept any advertising from your firm for one issue prior
and two issues beyond the month any editorial regarding your company appears."
Not likely to happen. We try not to be whores, but by the same token there's no
point in being a self righteous martyr.

Interesting you should mention that. When I was slowly transitioning
out of the world of corporate piracy and back stabbing, I worked for a
year with the ARRL as a Technical Editor for their main magazine "QST"
and was the de-facto editor of "QEX" which was their heavy theory and
experimental magazine.

I asked that question one time at an Editorial meeting - it was when
several manufacturers were introducing DSP into their products and we
were testing the products - how do we avoid conflicts with brand
loyalty (I was a Yaesu guy for example), etc., personal preference and
still continue to accept ads from the companies.

It was interesting how the ARRL did it. First they would buy the
radios at various retail establishments at retail. Right off the
shelf. Then, they would farm the radios out to individuals by random
lot - some of them went overseas believe it or not. There were two
random reviewers and they were given a week to play with the gear,
write a review and return the radio to HQ. It was then given to a
staffer by random lot (you had to be a minimum Advanced to get one),
given a week and write a review. Then it came to the Technical
Editors who would read the reviews, play with the rigs to see what was
what, then the review was written.

What happened was very enlightening. Once you eliminated all the "my
Kenwood does this well, but...." and "Yaesu sucks because" and "Icom
does this better than..." you got a fairly accurate view of how the
radio preformed, what the faults were and a general impression of the
quality level - a very good picture of what the equipment did, looked
and operated like.

It was very fair.

My problem with boating and fishing mags is that they depend on the
ads for a living, thus saying something like "The Ranger T-top is
undersized and didn't quite fit the center console properly causing
vibrations and their unwanted side effects" is translated into "The
Ranger T-top, while somewhat under engineered, looks good on the boat
and has four rod holders". :)

All the best,

Tom
--------------

"What the hell's the deal with this newsgroup...
is there a computer terminal in the day room of
some looney bin somewhere?"

Bilgeman - circa 2004

Tom,
What it would really read much more positive than that. Something along the
lines of:
The beautiful lines of the Ranger T-Top will protect you from UV rays while
you troll for those monster fish using the built in rod holders. The T-Top
utilizes a unique process that allows Ranger to keep the weight as low as
possible, an important consideration for anyone who tows his boat using the
family car.



"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
The Ranger T-top is
undersized and didn't quite fit the center console properly causing
vibrations and their unwanted side effects" is translated into "The
Ranger T-top, while somewhat under engineered, looks good on the boat
and has four rod holders". :)

All the best,

Tom
--------------

"What the hell's the deal with this newsgroup...
is there a computer terminal in the day room of
some looney bin somewhere?"

Bilgeman - circa 2004

On Sat, 16 Oct 2004 10:49:07 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

My problem with boating and fishing mags is that they depend on the
ads for a living

=============================================

Its worse than that. They also depend on the builders and dealers for
test boats since they can't afford to buy them at retail. If they
start making unfavorable comments, the supply of test boats will dry
up very quickly.

On Sat, 16 Oct 2004 10:49:07 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

I worked for a
year with the ARRL as a Technical Editor for their main magazine "QST"
and was the de-facto editor of "QEX" which was their heavy theory and
experimental magazine.

=============================

Interesting. Now I know where the "Short Wave Sportfishing" handle
comes from. One of the highlights of my ham career was working Doug
DeMaw on 80 CW while he was running one of his famous QRP rigs. That
was back in the early 70s when he was Tech Editor of QST.

Gould,
I have no problems about Boating Mags lack of real reporting. No one
expects them to honestly review any product. I was talking to someone who
reviewed boats and he told me if they really come across a piece of ****
boat, in which they can not find anything good to say about the boat, they
just won't review it. They don't want to do anything to **** off their
bread and butter.


"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
Did I say something to offend you? If so, I must have missed it.

I do know about Boating Mags and all magazines because I worked for a
marketing company and we used to "buy" these PR pieces all the time.



You presumed to declare a motivation behind the article. You were wrong.

You presumed to declare that there is an advertising deal in the works
between
my publisher and the battery company. You are wrong again. There is no
quid-pro-quo as you insisted.(The company that retails this product in
town
*does* advertise in my publisher's magazine, and all other regional
publications, and has done so every month for about 20 years. Odds are
good
that they will advertise for another 20 whether we ever mentioned their
name
outside of their ad space, or not. Our revenue from that account will not
increase, or decrease ten cents as a result of the interview).

When you run a specialty publication addressing a narrow field of
interest,
there will certainly be many instances when an article features a company
that
is also an advertiser. I suppose to be really uptight about it, we could
adopt
a policy that read,
"We will refuse to accept any advertising from your firm for one issue
prior
and two issues beyond the month any editorial regarding your company
appears."
Not likely to happen. We try not to be whores, but by the same token
there's no
point in being a self righteous martyr.

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...

You presumed to declare a motivation behind the article. You were wrong.

Well, I certainly don't know the circumstances behind the article, but is
sure has all the classic signs of a paid advertisement in disguise. You let
the manufacturer lead the discussion, talk only about the strong points,
don't provide any real facts or figures, include several statements that are
misleading, and don't ask any of the obvious questions the "inquiring minds"
would like to know.

This happens all the time. Many, if not all, magazines will trade an
article for either a direct payment or an agreement to run advertising, or
perhaps some other form of sponsership. I have created a new consumer
product and have been through all this. You pay the radio talk show host to
mention the product. You give Oprah one for herself, one for all her
friends, and one to give away on her show to get her to mention it. You pay
NBC big bucks to include one on their sit-com show and even write a show
that works it into the plot.

The marketing department writes "press releases" and sends them out to all
the relevant publications. We would write "articles" and send them out, and
they would get published word for word. We would even write our own
"interviews" and buy space in certain magazines.

Did your magazine actually conduct the interview, or did you just take copy
from the manufacturer? If you are really in a position to know, then I will
take it at your word. But don't be surprised if others doubt your story.

Rod