On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 16:53:34 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 4/1/2020 4:37 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 13:39:59 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 4/1/20 11:45 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 08:09:02 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

If the USA really clamps down on its reliance on Chinese
manufactured items (as it should) the Chinese economy
could be in for a free-fall. If it does, there's no
turning back. The Chinese Communist government opened
a Pandora's box about 30 years ago when they started
embracing their government controlled version of
capitalism and "free markets". Once a significant
portion of their population start benefiting from
this, there's no way to close the Pandora's box
again.

===

It's important to remember that the western world has become more or
less addicted to buying cheap manufactured goods from China. That is
a major reason why we have enjoyed low inflation for the last 30 years
or so. China has become the low cost producer for just about
everything we consume and it will be extremely difficult to unwind
that without major disruptions to our economy and standard of living.
China has many millions of people willing to work at low wage factory
jobs and we do not.


Corporations here offshored manufacturing to countries paying near-slave
wages and in the process increased their profit margins by hundreds of
percentage points on many items. American workers want decent wages and
benefits, and these are disappearing. You aren't going to see serious
levels of manufacturing that went offshore coming back here and, of
course, for the most part, we don't have the technology anymore to do
most of the work.

The American consumer is as much to blame as the corporations. They
are just giving us what we want. When there was a choice, in the 90s,
people voted with their wallets and bought the cheaper offshore goods
leaving the American made stuff sitting there. With no market for
American made stuff, the factories moved or closed. Clinton made it
financially advantageous with trade policies and multinational
agreements like NAFTA and GATT. We actually rewarded companies who
moved offshore.
We also accepted lower quality with that lower cost.
IBM (Gerstner) called it "Market Driven Quality". I still have the
hat.
http://gfretwell.com/electrical/mdq.jpg
They went from emulating Sony to emulating WalMart (absolutely true).
We went from quality circles and 6 sigma to "give nothing more than
they are willing to pay for". Unfortunately for guys like me, we found
out they were not willing to pay for quality and I was unwilling to do
a ****ty job.



That be all true but if there is anything to be learned from this
covid-19 thing, we need to pay attention to the items we rely upon
others to make and sell to us.

Anything to do with national security should be made here with
some licensing authority for other "friendly" nations or allies.

Same with pharmaceuticals. They need to be made here. It
friggin' amazes me that the VA buys most of it's medications
from China.

China and others can make television sets, cheap computers and
cell phones if they want. Some car parts also. They are not
a threat to national security.

No argument from me. It used to be that any critical military part had
to be made here. That was the excuse they made for some of the DoD
budget. It is true that a big part of our DoD budget goes to white
collar jobs and a lot of high paid manufacturing jobs. It is the
little widgets that seem to come in from offshore. When it was just
dumb chips there was only the sourcing issue but as chips became
smarter (on board software), we should be concerned about what is in
there.

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 19:03:23 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 4/1/20 4:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


That be all true but if there is anything to be learned from this
covid-19 thing, we need to pay attention to the items we rely upon
others to make and sell to us.

Anything to do with national security should be made here with
some licensing authority for other "friendly" nations or allies.

Same with pharmaceuticals.Â* They need to be made here.Â* It
friggin' amazes me that the VA buys most of it's medications
from China.

China and others can make television sets, cheap computers and
cell phones if they want.Â* Some car parts also.Â* They are not
a threat to national security.

"National Security" is far from the only "issue" of importance. We spend
at least a trillion dollars, including on budget and hidden budget
items, on "National Security," and the amount we are spending is only
going up. We spend multiples of any our possible military adversaries
spend. Do you military acolytes really believe the Russians or the
Chinese have their eyes on Topeka?

A big part of that budget is all of those Davis Bacon jobs.


I wonder how this "Golden Rebirth of U.S. Manufacturing" you advocate
will come about, in the absence of serious governmental regulations,
controls, and additional tariffs, and those will result in smaller
markets for our products. Mind you, I'm all in favor of American workers
being able to get and hold high-paying jobs with good benefits, but just
how is it supposed to happen? Do you presume U.S. corporations will give
up their enormous profits and exec benefits?

I am not surprised you don't want to admit it but your buddy who wipes
his dick on intern's dresses after he ****s them in the face is the
one who established the policies that promote this. NAFTA, WTO etc.
That is not surprising tho. Lots of things that made corporate CEOs
filthy rich got started in the 90s. You folks called it "The Clinton
Prosperity". That lasted until we figured out how much was shady
bookkeeping and pure fraud.

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 19:05:02 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 4/1/2020 5:28 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 11:48:28 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 1, 2020 at 7:43:02 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/1/2020 7:28 AM, John wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 21:00:41 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

On Tuesday, March 31, 2020 at 8:56:37 PM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 20:20:18 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:49:04 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:26:38 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 13:46:45 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 12:44:21 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 11:36:04 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:



While GM dragged their feet over contract issues, Ford in
partnership with GE Health got to work making ventilators.

Interesting concept.

After consultation with GE and with consideration to the
type of locations they will be used, they are going to
focus on a simple, proven design that is air powered
rather than by electricity. Reduces the complexity
and permits the ventilator to be used with a tank
of oxygen only.

Ford engineers visited GE and worked out some
manufacturing improvements that will allow GE
to also ramp up production.

Ford is setting up a manufacturing facility in
Michigan and expects to produce 50,000 ventilators
over the next 100 days.

Ford executive says it's the perfect combination of
company strengths and capabilities. GE has a
proven ventilator design and Ford has the expertise
in mass production.

Ford also said production rates will go up as required.

I think our biggest problem will be what to do with a half of a
million ventilators in a year or so when this blows over. Maybe Oprah
can give them away on her show. I bet there will be a glut of n-95
masks on the market too. That is a good thing tho. I was paying at
least, a couple bucks each for them last year.

Do you really think that will be our biggest problem? You sound much like Harry
with that kind of crap. As Trump said, if we have extras, there are lots of
countries in need.

I am trying not to think about the global financial collapse. People
have been telling me for a month that I was crazy even suggesting it.

BTW when this is over, the excessive need will be gone. I think we are
going to flood the world with this stuff once they get tooled up to
make it and the government is printing money to get it out the door.

Half a million ventilators will surely not cause a global financial collapse.
Will there be a financial collapse? Maybe. If so, you can say you predicted it
months ago. I don't remember you suggesting it, but if you say you did, and it
happens, you deserve the credit for predicting it.

I'm surprised Harry hasn't beat you to that prediction and blames it on Trump.

I am not seeing anything that looks any other possibility. Whether it
is an unrecoverable collapse is the only question.
With no end in sight of keeping our foot on the throat on the western
economy we have to consider the consequences. South Europe was
dragging down the Euro in a food economy with Germany propping it up.
The German finance minister just killed himself. You have to wonder
what that was all about.
I bet UK is happy they Brexited.
The big winner here is going to be China. Whether they have actually
controlled this virus or not, their official story is they are back
open for business.
The US, not so much and the predictions here are far fewer than half
of small business is going to survive. Bigger companies are likely to
be in trouble too if they can't make something the government is
buying. Other than that, if you can't buy it in a grocery store, drug
store or a liquor store, we are not buying it. The businesses are all
closed. I still think real unemployment is about 30% and I may be
guessing low once employers stop paying furloughed workers.


And you predicted all this a month ago?

Greg is driving the scary train. In a couple of months we'll all be breathing easier and and the Dow will be on the mend.

I think he's on retainer from MSNBC, CNN, NBC, etc...

I'm surprised he's not telling us to stock up on ammunition and canned goods.


Hey, don't pick on Greg. I get a kick out of some of his philosophies
and "preparations" for when the world ends.

He may be the only one breathing easy in a month using his home-made
oxygen delivery system using a homemade ventilator powered by his
homemade propane conversion generator. :-)

It was just a little innocenr fun. He's the happiest pessimist I know!

I am OK.
What the hell, John has calculations that say Covid will get me before
the world collapses and I still have that LAD thing nobody seems to
worry about. Statistically I will be dead in 6 years anyway.

I just keep on keeping on.




Hope you are grooming another generation of pessimists to carry on
your work. :-)

My daughter is pretty tough but more optimistic than me. She is still
young. Lets see how she feels in 2030 after all of the entitlements go
broke.

On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 19:48:04 -0400, John wrote:

On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 17:28:04 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 11:48:28 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 1, 2020 at 7:43:02 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/1/2020 7:28 AM, John wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 21:00:41 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

On Tuesday, March 31, 2020 at 8:56:37 PM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 20:20:18 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:49:04 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:26:38 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 13:46:45 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 12:44:21 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 11:36:04 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:



While GM dragged their feet over contract issues, Ford in
partnership with GE Health got to work making ventilators.

Interesting concept.

After consultation with GE and with consideration to the
type of locations they will be used, they are going to
focus on a simple, proven design that is air powered
rather than by electricity. Reduces the complexity
and permits the ventilator to be used with a tank
of oxygen only.

Ford engineers visited GE and worked out some
manufacturing improvements that will allow GE
to also ramp up production.

Ford is setting up a manufacturing facility in
Michigan and expects to produce 50,000 ventilators
over the next 100 days.

Ford executive says it's the perfect combination of
company strengths and capabilities. GE has a
proven ventilator design and Ford has the expertise
in mass production.

Ford also said production rates will go up as required.

I think our biggest problem will be what to do with a half of a
million ventilators in a year or so when this blows over. Maybe Oprah
can give them away on her show. I bet there will be a glut of n-95
masks on the market too. That is a good thing tho. I was paying at
least, a couple bucks each for them last year.

Do you really think that will be our biggest problem? You sound much like Harry
with that kind of crap. As Trump said, if we have extras, there are lots of
countries in need.

I am trying not to think about the global financial collapse. People
have been telling me for a month that I was crazy even suggesting it.

BTW when this is over, the excessive need will be gone. I think we are
going to flood the world with this stuff once they get tooled up to
make it and the government is printing money to get it out the door.

Half a million ventilators will surely not cause a global financial collapse.
Will there be a financial collapse? Maybe. If so, you can say you predicted it
months ago. I don't remember you suggesting it, but if you say you did, and it
happens, you deserve the credit for predicting it.

I'm surprised Harry hasn't beat you to that prediction and blames it on Trump.

I am not seeing anything that looks any other possibility. Whether it
is an unrecoverable collapse is the only question.
With no end in sight of keeping our foot on the throat on the western
economy we have to consider the consequences. South Europe was
dragging down the Euro in a food economy with Germany propping it up.
The German finance minister just killed himself. You have to wonder
what that was all about.
I bet UK is happy they Brexited.
The big winner here is going to be China. Whether they have actually
controlled this virus or not, their official story is they are back
open for business.
The US, not so much and the predictions here are far fewer than half
of small business is going to survive. Bigger companies are likely to
be in trouble too if they can't make something the government is
buying. Other than that, if you can't buy it in a grocery store, drug
store or a liquor store, we are not buying it. The businesses are all
closed. I still think real unemployment is about 30% and I may be
guessing low once employers stop paying furloughed workers.


And you predicted all this a month ago?

Greg is driving the scary train. In a couple of months we'll all be breathing easier and and the Dow will be on the mend.

I think he's on retainer from MSNBC, CNN, NBC, etc...

I'm surprised he's not telling us to stock up on ammunition and canned goods.


Hey, don't pick on Greg. I get a kick out of some of his philosophies
and "preparations" for when the world ends.

He may be the only one breathing easy in a month using his home-made
oxygen delivery system using a homemade ventilator powered by his
homemade propane conversion generator. :-)

It was just a little innocenr fun. He's the happiest pessimist I know!

I am OK.
What the hell, John has calculations that say Covid will get me before
the world collapses and I still have that LAD thing nobody seems to
worry about. Statistically I will be dead in 6 years anyway.

I just keep on keeping on.


No, you won't be dead. Your pessimism will keep you alive to bitch about things!


That is my plan.

Keyser Soze wrote:
On 4/1/20 4:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


That be all true but if there is anything to be learned from this
covid-19 thing, we need to pay attention to the items we rely upon
others to make and sell to us.

Anything to do with national security should be made here with
some licensing authority for other "friendly" nations or allies.

Same with pharmaceuticals.Â* They need to be made here.Â* It
friggin' amazes me that the VA buys most of it's medications
from China.

China and others can make television sets, cheap computers and
cell phones if they want.Â* Some car parts also.Â* They are not
a threat to national security.

"National Security" is far from the only "issue" of importance. We spend
at least a trillion dollars, including on budget and hidden budget
items, on "National Security," and the amount we are spending is only
going up. We spend multiples of any our possible military adversaries
spend. Do you military acolytes really believe the Russians or the
Chinese have their eyes on Topeka?

I wonder how this "Golden Rebirth of U.S. Manufacturing" you advocate
will come about, in the absence of serious governmental regulations,
controls, and additional tariffs, and those will result in smaller
markets for our products. Mind you, I'm all in favor of American workers
being able to get and hold high-paying jobs with good benefits, but just
how is it supposed to happen? Do you presume U.S. corporations will give
up their enormous profits and exec benefits?


If the executives all went to work for a dollar a year, we still could not
pay what you think any high paying job would garner. You want high pay
for low production. If the job is flipping burgers, why should it be a
high pay? We used to pay about 3x what foreign countries paid in wages.
Now, probably more like 20x. Certain industries should be only legally in
the US. 95% of Printed circuit boards are made in China. What happens
if we need boards for high tech weapons? Ban buying any PC board for
government equipment from foreign sources. Some exceptions, phones, TV’s,
etc. but no critical equipment. Also instead of the government mandated
excess minimum wage, price it to cost of product.

wrote:
On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 19:48:04 -0400, John wrote:

On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 17:28:04 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 11:48:28 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 1, 2020 at 7:43:02 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/1/2020 7:28 AM, John wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 21:00:41 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

On Tuesday, March 31, 2020 at 8:56:37 PM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 20:20:18 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:49:04 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:26:38 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 13:46:45 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 12:44:21 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 11:36:04 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:



While GM dragged their feet over contract issues, Ford in
partnership with GE Health got to work making ventilators.

Interesting concept.

After consultation with GE and with consideration to the
type of locations they will be used, they are going to
focus on a simple, proven design that is air powered
rather than by electricity. Reduces the complexity
and permits the ventilator to be used with a tank
of oxygen only.

Ford engineers visited GE and worked out some
manufacturing improvements that will allow GE
to also ramp up production.

Ford is setting up a manufacturing facility in
Michigan and expects to produce 50,000 ventilators
over the next 100 days.

Ford executive says it's the perfect combination of
company strengths and capabilities. GE has a
proven ventilator design and Ford has the expertise
in mass production.

Ford also said production rates will go up as required.

I think our biggest problem will be what to do with a half of a
million ventilators in a year or so when this blows over. Maybe Oprah
can give them away on her show. I bet there will be a glut of n-95
masks on the market too. That is a good thing tho. I was paying at
least, a couple bucks each for them last year.

Do you really think that will be our biggest problem? You sound much like Harry
with that kind of crap. As Trump said, if we have extras, there are lots of
countries in need.

I am trying not to think about the global financial collapse. People
have been telling me for a month that I was crazy even suggesting it.

BTW when this is over, the excessive need will be gone. I think we are
going to flood the world with this stuff once they get tooled up to
make it and the government is printing money to get it out the door.

Half a million ventilators will surely not cause a global financial collapse.
Will there be a financial collapse? Maybe. If so, you can say you predicted it
months ago. I don't remember you suggesting it, but if you say you did, and it
happens, you deserve the credit for predicting it.

I'm surprised Harry hasn't beat you to that prediction and blames it on Trump.

I am not seeing anything that looks any other possibility. Whether it
is an unrecoverable collapse is the only question.
With no end in sight of keeping our foot on the throat on the western
economy we have to consider the consequences. South Europe was
dragging down the Euro in a food economy with Germany propping it up.
The German finance minister just killed himself. You have to wonder
what that was all about.
I bet UK is happy they Brexited.
The big winner here is going to be China. Whether they have actually
controlled this virus or not, their official story is they are back
open for business.
The US, not so much and the predictions here are far fewer than half
of small business is going to survive. Bigger companies are likely to
be in trouble too if they can't make something the government is
buying. Other than that, if you can't buy it in a grocery store, drug
store or a liquor store, we are not buying it. The businesses are all
closed. I still think real unemployment is about 30% and I may be
guessing low once employers stop paying furloughed workers.


And you predicted all this a month ago?

Greg is driving the scary train. In a couple of months we'll all
be breathing easier and and the Dow will be on the mend.

I think he's on retainer from MSNBC, CNN, NBC, etc...

I'm surprised he's not telling us to stock up on ammunition and canned goods.


Hey, don't pick on Greg. I get a kick out of some of his philosophies
and "preparations" for when the world ends.

He may be the only one breathing easy in a month using his home-made
oxygen delivery system using a homemade ventilator powered by his
homemade propane conversion generator. :-)

It was just a little innocenr fun. He's the happiest pessimist I know!

I am OK.
What the hell, John has calculations that say Covid will get me before
the world collapses and I still have that LAD thing nobody seems to
worry about. Statistically I will be dead in 6 years anyway.

I just keep on keeping on.


No, you won't be dead. Your pessimism will keep you alive to bitch about things!


That is my plan.

From another place:

Aging hits us all if we are lucky enough to survive. Now a study provides
clues that may insulate those of us that are hard to live with and be
around.
Quote:
Here’s the study all you grumps have been waiting for: A truly fascinating
new piece of research finds that being just a little stubborn and
argumentative may just protect against dementia and Alzheimer’s.

https://www.studyfinds.org/just-say-...zheimers-risk/

On 4/1/20 4:47 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/1/2020 4:43 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 13:46:54 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 4/1/2020 1:35 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 11:45:20 -0400,
wrote:

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 08:09:02 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

If the USA really clamps down on its reliance on Chinese
manufactured items (as it should) the Chinese economy
could be in for a free-fall.Â* If it does, there's no
turning back.Â* The Chinese Communist government opened
a Pandora's box about 30 years ago when they started
embracing their government controlled version of
capitalism and "free markets".Â* Once a significant
portion of their population start benefiting from
this, there's no way to close the Pandora's box
again.

===

It's important to remember that the western world has become more or
less addicted to buying cheap manufactured goods from China.Â* That is
a major reason why we have enjoyed low inflation for the last 30 years
or so.Â* China has become the low cost producer for just about
everything we consume and it will be extremely difficult to unwind
that without major disruptions to our economy and standard of living.
China has many millions of people willing to work at low wage factory
jobs and we do not.

China's form of government and culture makes it easier for them to
tell their people to suck it up and get back to work. I think they
still have a much worse Covid problem than they are willing to admit
but it is also easier for them to isolate the cases and protect the
factories. They also have a lot more control over the news. You don't
have anyone on TV there saying Xi is an incompetent fool or that their
situation is being mishandled. It is easier for the average coolie to
think all that can be done is being done.



There have been reports (true or not?) that leaks by people
within China indicates the real death toll there so far
exceeds 84,000.

Are we surprised. As I said when they declared the crisis was over.
they understand they have a business to run and they are going to get
back to work. What's a half a million dead people to them?
There are plenty more where they came from.
I do believe they are doing better at containing the infection but
guys walking around with AKs and clubs are far more effective than
people on TV saying "please stay home".



LOL


Until a couple of days ago, literally, the asswipe governors of Florida
and Texas exempted attending church from the "stay at home" advice.
After all, what could you contract in church other than superstition and
stupidity?

On Thu, 2 Apr 2020 02:44:43 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 19:48:04 -0400, John wrote:

On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 17:28:04 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 11:48:28 -0700 (PDT), Its Me
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 1, 2020 at 7:43:02 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/1/2020 7:28 AM, John wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 21:00:41 -0700 (PDT), Its Me wrote:

On Tuesday, March 31, 2020 at 8:56:37 PM UTC-4, John H wrote:
On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 20:20:18 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:49:04 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 17:26:38 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 13:46:45 -0400, John wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 12:44:21 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 31 Mar 2020 11:36:04 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:



While GM dragged their feet over contract issues, Ford in
partnership with GE Health got to work making ventilators.

Interesting concept.

After consultation with GE and with consideration to the
type of locations they will be used, they are going to
focus on a simple, proven design that is air powered
rather than by electricity. Reduces the complexity
and permits the ventilator to be used with a tank
of oxygen only.

Ford engineers visited GE and worked out some
manufacturing improvements that will allow GE
to also ramp up production.

Ford is setting up a manufacturing facility in
Michigan and expects to produce 50,000 ventilators
over the next 100 days.

Ford executive says it's the perfect combination of
company strengths and capabilities. GE has a
proven ventilator design and Ford has the expertise
in mass production.

Ford also said production rates will go up as required.

I think our biggest problem will be what to do with a half of a
million ventilators in a year or so when this blows over. Maybe Oprah
can give them away on her show. I bet there will be a glut of n-95
masks on the market too. That is a good thing tho. I was paying at
least, a couple bucks each for them last year.

Do you really think that will be our biggest problem? You sound much like Harry
with that kind of crap. As Trump said, if we have extras, there are lots of
countries in need.

I am trying not to think about the global financial collapse. People
have been telling me for a month that I was crazy even suggesting it.

BTW when this is over, the excessive need will be gone. I think we are
going to flood the world with this stuff once they get tooled up to
make it and the government is printing money to get it out the door.

Half a million ventilators will surely not cause a global financial collapse.
Will there be a financial collapse? Maybe. If so, you can say you predicted it
months ago. I don't remember you suggesting it, but if you say you did, and it
happens, you deserve the credit for predicting it.

I'm surprised Harry hasn't beat you to that prediction and blames it on Trump.

I am not seeing anything that looks any other possibility. Whether it
is an unrecoverable collapse is the only question.
With no end in sight of keeping our foot on the throat on the western
economy we have to consider the consequences. South Europe was
dragging down the Euro in a food economy with Germany propping it up.
The German finance minister just killed himself. You have to wonder
what that was all about.
I bet UK is happy they Brexited.
The big winner here is going to be China. Whether they have actually
controlled this virus or not, their official story is they are back
open for business.
The US, not so much and the predictions here are far fewer than half
of small business is going to survive. Bigger companies are likely to
be in trouble too if they can't make something the government is
buying. Other than that, if you can't buy it in a grocery store, drug
store or a liquor store, we are not buying it. The businesses are all
closed. I still think real unemployment is about 30% and I may be
guessing low once employers stop paying furloughed workers.


And you predicted all this a month ago?

Greg is driving the scary train. In a couple of months we'll all
be breathing easier and and the Dow will be on the mend.

I think he's on retainer from MSNBC, CNN, NBC, etc...

I'm surprised he's not telling us to stock up on ammunition and canned goods.


Hey, don't pick on Greg. I get a kick out of some of his philosophies
and "preparations" for when the world ends.

He may be the only one breathing easy in a month using his home-made
oxygen delivery system using a homemade ventilator powered by his
homemade propane conversion generator. :-)

It was just a little innocenr fun. He's the happiest pessimist I know!

I am OK.
What the hell, John has calculations that say Covid will get me before
the world collapses and I still have that LAD thing nobody seems to
worry about. Statistically I will be dead in 6 years anyway.

I just keep on keeping on.


No, you won't be dead. Your pessimism will keep you alive to bitch about things!


That is my plan.

From another place:

Aging hits us all if we are lucky enough to survive. Now a study provides
clues that may insulate those of us that are hard to live with and be
around.
Quote:
Here’s the study all you grumps have been waiting for: A truly fascinating
new piece of research finds that being just a little stubborn and
argumentative may just protect against dementia and Alzheimer’s.

https://www.studyfinds.org/just-say-...zheimers-risk/



See there is method to my madness. ;-)

On Thu, 2 Apr 2020 08:24:41 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 4/1/20 4:47 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/1/2020 4:43 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 13:46:54 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 4/1/2020 1:35 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 11:45:20 -0400,
wrote:

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 08:09:02 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

If the USA really clamps down on its reliance on Chinese
manufactured items (as it should) the Chinese economy
could be in for a free-fall.Â* If it does, there's no
turning back.Â* The Chinese Communist government opened
a Pandora's box about 30 years ago when they started
embracing their government controlled version of
capitalism and "free markets".Â* Once a significant
portion of their population start benefiting from
this, there's no way to close the Pandora's box
again.

===

It's important to remember that the western world has become more or
less addicted to buying cheap manufactured goods from China.Â* That is
a major reason why we have enjoyed low inflation for the last 30 years
or so.Â* China has become the low cost producer for just about
everything we consume and it will be extremely difficult to unwind
that without major disruptions to our economy and standard of living.
China has many millions of people willing to work at low wage factory
jobs and we do not.

China's form of government and culture makes it easier for them to
tell their people to suck it up and get back to work. I think they
still have a much worse Covid problem than they are willing to admit
but it is also easier for them to isolate the cases and protect the
factories. They also have a lot more control over the news. You don't
have anyone on TV there saying Xi is an incompetent fool or that their
situation is being mishandled. It is easier for the average coolie to
think all that can be done is being done.



There have been reports (true or not?) that leaks by people
within China indicates the real death toll there so far
exceeds 84,000.

Are we surprised. As I said when they declared the crisis was over.
they understand they have a business to run and they are going to get
back to work. What's a half a million dead people to them?
There are plenty more where they came from.
I do believe they are doing better at containing the infection but
guys walking around with AKs and clubs are far more effective than
people on TV saying "please stay home".



LOL


Until a couple of days ago, literally, the asswipe governors of Florida
and Texas exempted attending church from the "stay at home" advice.
After all, what could you contract in church other than superstition and
stupidity?

Most of the churches are doing their thing online. It is only the real
snake handlers and the commercially aggressive ones who want their
parishioners to show up and throw a buck in the plate. Government
orders wouldn't stop them anyway. Other than that the stay at home
order is pretty silly since there is nothing open to go do.


All things considered I don't think Desantis is doing that bad. I do
see his point that why should he pretend to lock down counties a New
Yorker couldn't point to on a map. Our problems are all in the dark
blue counties. The virus map looks like if you voted for Hillary, you
are going to get Corona.
I suspect it is just because those New Yorkers can't make up their
mind if they want to be here or there but they are swapping germs
along the way.

On 4/2/2020 5:07 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 2 Apr 2020 08:24:41 -0400, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 4/1/20 4:47 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 4/1/2020 4:43 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 13:46:54 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 4/1/2020 1:35 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 01 Apr 2020 11:45:20 -0400,
wrote:

On Wed, 1 Apr 2020 08:09:02 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

If the USA really clamps down on its reliance on Chinese
manufactured items (as it should) the Chinese economy
could be in for a free-fall.Â* If it does, there's no
turning back.Â* The Chinese Communist government opened
a Pandora's box about 30 years ago when they started
embracing their government controlled version of
capitalism and "free markets".Â* Once a significant
portion of their population start benefiting from
this, there's no way to close the Pandora's box
again.

===

It's important to remember that the western world has become more or
less addicted to buying cheap manufactured goods from China.Â* That is
a major reason why we have enjoyed low inflation for the last 30 years
or so.Â* China has become the low cost producer for just about
everything we consume and it will be extremely difficult to unwind
that without major disruptions to our economy and standard of living.
China has many millions of people willing to work at low wage factory
jobs and we do not.

China's form of government and culture makes it easier for them to
tell their people to suck it up and get back to work. I think they
still have a much worse Covid problem than they are willing to admit
but it is also easier for them to isolate the cases and protect the
factories. They also have a lot more control over the news. You don't
have anyone on TV there saying Xi is an incompetent fool or that their
situation is being mishandled. It is easier for the average coolie to
think all that can be done is being done.



There have been reports (true or not?) that leaks by people
within China indicates the real death toll there so far
exceeds 84,000.

Are we surprised. As I said when they declared the crisis was over.
they understand they have a business to run and they are going to get
back to work. What's a half a million dead people to them?
There are plenty more where they came from.
I do believe they are doing better at containing the infection but
guys walking around with AKs and clubs are far more effective than
people on TV saying "please stay home".



LOL


Until a couple of days ago, literally, the asswipe governors of Florida
and Texas exempted attending church from the "stay at home" advice.
After all, what could you contract in church other than superstition and
stupidity?

Most of the churches are doing their thing online. It is only the real
snake handlers and the commercially aggressive ones who want their
parishioners to show up and throw a buck in the plate. Government
orders wouldn't stop them anyway. Other than that the stay at home
order is pretty silly since there is nothing open to go do.


All things considered I don't think Desantis is doing that bad. I do
see his point that why should he pretend to lock down counties a New
Yorker couldn't point to on a map. Our problems are all in the dark
blue counties. The virus map looks like if you voted for Hillary, you
are going to get Corona.
I suspect it is just because those New Yorkers can't make up their
mind if they want to be here or there but they are swapping germs
along the way.



DeSantis needs to really clamp down on the social distancing rules
in Florida.

Our friends who just returned from the Bahamas on their sailboat
are at a Florida marina. She said there's a ball field next to
the marina and a bunch of people are there having a softball game.

Those who are monitoring and generating models, looking for
developing hot spots are warning that Florida is becoming
a bulls-eye.



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