On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 16:44:05 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 15:22:50 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left.


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion, but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing". The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not. I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do. Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.

Would restricting their sale make the anti-gun crowd happier? Yes. It's not a matter of prevention,
it's a matter of perception.

How do you really restrict the sale of existing guns? If you simply
say they are not legally transferable, a lot of people would sell them
under the table. Most people are not going to just throw away several
hundred dollars for an AK/AR or well over a thousand for my M1A.
Actually there are AR platforms that are well over a thousand too.

On Thursday, February 22, 2018 at 10:43:30 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 16:44:05 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 15:22:50 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left.


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion, but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing". The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not. I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do. Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.

Would restricting their sale make the anti-gun crowd happier? Yes. It's not a matter of prevention,
it's a matter of perception.

How do you really restrict the sale of existing guns? If you simply
say they are not legally transferable, a lot of people would sell them
under the table. Most people are not going to just throw away several
hundred dollars for an AK/AR or well over a thousand for my M1A.
Actually there are AR platforms that are well over a thousand too.

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:42:43 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

The M&P Sport model is their least expensive and it retails for $739, with a street price of $600+. Rural King seems to be selling them for less than anyone else I've seen.

On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 06:04:07 -0800 (PST), Its Me wrote:

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:42:43 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

The M&P Sport model is their least expensive and it retails for $739, with a street price of $600+. Rural King seems to be selling them for less than anyone else I've seen.

https://gunprime.com/product/smith-w...16-30rd-black/

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 9:44:30 AM UTC-5, John H wrote:
On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 06:04:07 -0800 (PST), Its Me wrote:

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:42:43 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

The M&P Sport model is their least expensive and it retails for $739, with a street price of $600+. Rural King seems to be selling them for less than anyone else I've seen.

https://gunprime.com/product/smith-w...16-30rd-black/

Wow. That's a deal.

On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 06:04:07 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:42:43 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

The M&P Sport model is their least expensive and it retails for $739, with a street price of $600+. Rural King seems to be selling them for less than anyone else I've seen.

I think Walmart matches their price or is very close. I really have no
interest in ARs so I don't pay that much attention.
In that regard I almost agree with Richard but I also realize it is
none of my business what others want to do. I understand a homicidal
maniac can buy a prettier gun, like a ranch rifle and do exactly the
same damage. (same ammo, same rate of fire, same size magazines)
We keep forgetting, the first "school shooter" most people remember
killed 14 people and wounded 31 with a bolt action Remington 700.
(Charles Whitman)

On 2/23/2018 12:13 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 06:04:07 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:42:43 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

The M&P Sport model is their least expensive and it retails for $739, with a street price of $600+. Rural King seems to be selling them for less than anyone else I've seen.

I think Walmart matches their price or is very close. I really have no
interest in ARs so I don't pay that much attention.
In that regard I almost agree with Richard but I also realize it is
none of my business what others want to do. I understand a homicidal
maniac can buy a prettier gun, like a ranch rifle and do exactly the
same damage. (same ammo, same rate of fire, same size magazines)
We keep forgetting, the first "school shooter" most people remember
killed 14 people and wounded 31 with a bolt action Remington 700.
(Charles Whitman)



For some reason the ability to run down to WalMart to buy an AR-15 type
rifle blows my mind.

On 2/23/18 12:59 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/23/2018 12:13 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 06:04:07 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:42:43 AM UTC-5,
wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500.Â* You have to assemble it (the
lower).Â* A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy.Â* Once you've done it, you can build a lower
in ~20 minutes.Â* The upper, if you have the couple of tools
required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

The M&P Sport model is their least expensive and it retails for $739,
with a street price of $600+.Â* Rural King seems to be selling them
for less than anyone else I've seen.

I think Walmart matches their price or is very close. I really have no
interest in ARs so I don't pay that much attention.
In that regard I almost agree with Richard but I also realize it is
none of my business what others want to do. I understand a homicidal
maniac can buy a prettier gun, like a ranch rifle and do exactly the
same damage. (same ammo, same rate of fire, same size magazines)
We keep forgetting, the first "school shooter" most people remember
killed 14 people and wounded 31 with a bolt action Remington 700.
(Charles Whitman)



For some reason the ability to run down to WalMart to buy an AR-15 type
rifleÂ* blows my mind.



It's perfect. You can get your Duck Dynasty tee-shirt there, I am sure,
plus a raffle ticket with a chance to marry Bristol Palin.

On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 12:59:44 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/23/2018 12:13 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Feb 2018 06:04:07 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:42:43 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 20:44:53 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

A basic "starter kit" AR is $400-500. You have to assemble it (the lower). A good assembled AR is about $1000.

Building one is easy. Once you've done it, you can build a lower in ~20 minutes. The upper, if you have the couple of tools required, shouldn't take more than that.

Rural King will sell you a S&W M&P for $500 ready to go, no assembly
necessary. I even see them less on sale occasionally.

The M&P Sport model is their least expensive and it retails for $739, with a street price of $600+. Rural King seems to be selling them for less than anyone else I've seen.

I think Walmart matches their price or is very close. I really have no
interest in ARs so I don't pay that much attention.
In that regard I almost agree with Richard but I also realize it is
none of my business what others want to do. I understand a homicidal
maniac can buy a prettier gun, like a ranch rifle and do exactly the
same damage. (same ammo, same rate of fire, same size magazines)
We keep forgetting, the first "school shooter" most people remember
killed 14 people and wounded 31 with a bolt action Remington 700.
(Charles Whitman)



For some reason the ability to run down to WalMart to buy an AR-15 type
rifle blows my mind.


There is a background check tho. Why shouldn't you be able to buy a
rifle if you can buy any other kind of gun?