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#51
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On Fri, 05 Jan 2018 00:04:40 -0500, wrote:
On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 22:50:19 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: Harry's playing outside, four wheeling in his driveway in 4 inches of snow. Ny niece posted a picture on Facebook of a measured 6" a few miles south of Harry. He may have more than 4" of snow. I think Harry said he got 6", but the official record puts him between 2-4". http://www.weatherstreet.com/city_sn...snow-depth.htm We got about an inch. |
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#53
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On Fri, 5 Jan 2018 08:32:51 -0500 (EST), justan wrote:
Wrote in message: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 22:45:25 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/4/2018 7:43 PM, Alex wrote: Mr. Luddite wrote: On 1/4/2018 1:07 PM, John H wrote: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 12:42:29 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/4/2018 12:20 PM, wrote: On Thu, 04 Jan 2018 08:54:03 -0500, John H wrote: On Wed, 3 Jan 2018 17:19:35 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/3/2018 2:28 PM, Its Me wrote: Light flurries now, the predictions range from a dusting to 1-2 inches. Worse the closer to the coast you get. My BIL at James Island (Charleston) sent a picture earlier of maybe 1/4 inch and still falling. Very unusual for them. It's out of here in a few hours and headed up the coast. Good luck! Damn. I was hoping it would dump a foot in Mt. Pleasant, just to shut my son up. Last I heard it is supposed to "explode" as it comes up the coast, becoming essentially a winter hurricane. "Bombogenesis" is the technical term, and the popular "bomb cyclone" is a shortened version of it, according to our weather folks. They do seem to just make up names for things these days. I think the classic was "Super Storm Sandy" to talk about something that was not even a hurricane, it was just "super" for people who were not used to tropical weather. It is far from unprecedented tho. There was a real Cat 3 there in the 30s. I have certainly seen that weather pattern in DC tho and this is not even the worst case. The snow would actually be more of a problem if the "eye" of that low was farther west so your wind was drawing wet gulf stream air up into the cold front north of you. That is what gives DC over a foot of snow a day and if it stalls, you "Knickerbocker" snow. Up here a Cat 1 hurricane in the summer might be preferable over what is going on right now. When you look at this storm on radar it is developing a very defined rotation as it is winding up and getting bigger. Snowfall rate here is 2-3 inches/hr and the temp is dropping like a rock since this morning. Pretty much a white-out out there. Major flooding in Justin's former town with 4 disabled cars with people trapped inside, one a woman with 2 kids. Water is over the wheel wells. Fire and National Guard are responding. My old stomping grounds in Scituate is really getting clobbered ... worst in over 30 years despite improvements in sea walls, etc. A TV reporter nut was standing on the porch of a house about 30 feet from the seawall and he was getting soaked with spray, along with dodging sea ice that is being thrown up onto the roofs of houses. So far we haven't had any power glitches here but I fully expect we'll lose it in the next hour or so. Wind where I am is gusting 55-60 mph. Best of luck in all that. I think I'd be getting out the extension cords and prioritizing my electricity requirements! Did that yesterday ... that's why I was firing up the Honda to test. I have a new plan. If power goes out I am going to shut off the main breaker and then backfeed the generator output through a 15 amp outlet that's in the shed. It's on the same branch of the split 240v house supply as the furnace and a couple of rooms. All my lighting is LED, so that's a tiny load. The generator will run those plus the furnace system with no problem and I don't need to have extension cords running anywhere. Only problem with that is it's hard to tell when the power is back on. Turn off the breaker that feeds the shed, turn the main back on and see if your lights work. If so, shut off and unplug the generator then turn the breaker that feeds the shed back on. When Wilma hit in Florida I had a much bigger contractor's generator that had a 240 volt split phase output. I wired it into the power panel (illegally) on the load side of the main breaker and just made damn sure I didn't forget and turn the main back on. It worked fine except it burned so much gas I would have run out of my supply in a matter of a couple of days. Only used it for about an hour or less a day to run the well pump and the water heater so I could take showers. Other than that, I used the little Honda for the refrig, couple of lights, the TV and Direct TV receiver. My 5.5 KW burned about 0.5-0.6 GPH gasoline and more like 8 on propane running pretty much 24 hours a day at close to full load. Once I started running propane, it never turned off. I did trip the breaker now and then when the loads ganged up on me. ;-) 8 what? What is involved in converting to propane? A place to start: http://www.uscarburetion.com/simple_explanation.htm |
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#54
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On 1/5/2018 8:32 AM, justan wrote:
Wrote in message: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 22:45:25 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/4/2018 7:43 PM, Alex wrote: Mr. Luddite wrote: On 1/4/2018 1:07 PM, John H wrote: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 12:42:29 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/4/2018 12:20 PM, wrote: On Thu, 04 Jan 2018 08:54:03 -0500, John H wrote: On Wed, 3 Jan 2018 17:19:35 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/3/2018 2:28 PM, Its Me wrote: Light flurries now, the predictions range from a dusting to 1-2 inches. Worse the closer to the coast you get. My BIL at James Island (Charleston) sent a picture earlier of maybe 1/4 inch and still falling. Very unusual for them. It's out of here in a few hours and headed up the coast. Good luck! Damn. I was hoping it would dump a foot in Mt. Pleasant, just to shut my son up. Last I heard it is supposed to "explode" as it comes up the coast, becoming essentially a winter hurricane. "Bombogenesis" is the technical term, and the popular "bomb cyclone" is a shortened version of it, according to our weather folks. They do seem to just make up names for things these days. I think the classic was "Super Storm Sandy" to talk about something that was not even a hurricane, it was just "super" for people who were not used to tropical weather. It is far from unprecedented tho. There was a real Cat 3 there in the 30s. I have certainly seen that weather pattern in DC tho and this is not even the worst case. The snow would actually be more of a problem if the "eye" of that low was farther west so your wind was drawing wet gulf stream air up into the cold front north of you. That is what gives DC over a foot of snow a day and if it stalls, you "Knickerbocker" snow. Up here a Cat 1 hurricane in the summer might be preferable over what is going on right now. When you look at this storm on radar it is developing a very defined rotation as it is winding up and getting bigger. Snowfall rate here is 2-3 inches/hr and the temp is dropping like a rock since this morning. Pretty much a white-out out there. Major flooding in Justin's former town with 4 disabled cars with people trapped inside, one a woman with 2 kids. Water is over the wheel wells. Fire and National Guard are responding. My old stomping grounds in Scituate is really getting clobbered ... worst in over 30 years despite improvements in sea walls, etc. A TV reporter nut was standing on the porch of a house about 30 feet from the seawall and he was getting soaked with spray, along with dodging sea ice that is being thrown up onto the roofs of houses. So far we haven't had any power glitches here but I fully expect we'll lose it in the next hour or so. Wind where I am is gusting 55-60 mph. Best of luck in all that. I think I'd be getting out the extension cords and prioritizing my electricity requirements! Did that yesterday ... that's why I was firing up the Honda to test. I have a new plan. If power goes out I am going to shut off the main breaker and then backfeed the generator output through a 15 amp outlet that's in the shed. It's on the same branch of the split 240v house supply as the furnace and a couple of rooms. All my lighting is LED, so that's a tiny load. The generator will run those plus the furnace system with no problem and I don't need to have extension cords running anywhere. Only problem with that is it's hard to tell when the power is back on. Turn off the breaker that feeds the shed, turn the main back on and see if your lights work. If so, shut off and unplug the generator then turn the breaker that feeds the shed back on. When Wilma hit in Florida I had a much bigger contractor's generator that had a 240 volt split phase output. I wired it into the power panel (illegally) on the load side of the main breaker and just made damn sure I didn't forget and turn the main back on. It worked fine except it burned so much gas I would have run out of my supply in a matter of a couple of days. Only used it for about an hour or less a day to run the well pump and the water heater so I could take showers. Other than that, I used the little Honda for the refrig, couple of lights, the TV and Direct TV receiver. My 5.5 KW burned about 0.5-0.6 GPH gasoline and more like 8 on propane running pretty much 24 hours a day at close to full load. Once I started running propane, it never turned off. I did trip the breaker now and then when the loads ganged up on me. ;-) 8 what? What is involved in converting to propane? I don't know what Greg meant by "8" on propane. Maybe point 8 gals/hr? Anyway, there are many conversion kits that can be found on Amazon and eBay to allow a generator to run on either gas or propane. I read a do it yourself method using an old carb but even the guy that did it warned that unlike the conversion kits, his doesn't automatically shut the propane flow off if the engine stalls. Probably dangerous. The kits I found ranged in price from under $20 to about $50. |
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#55
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
wrote:
On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 22:50:19 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: Harry's playing outside, four wheeling in his driveway in 4 inches of snow. Ny niece posted a picture on Facebook of a measured 6" a few miles south of Harry. He may have more than 4" of snow. I measured 4”+ on two deck tables that aren’t subject to snow drifts. Main streets were plowed by the time I ventured out. Subdivision streets snowy and icey. Some empty shelves at supermarket, as is usual when a storm hits. Power hasn’t fluttered yet...propane tank was filled last week by supplier. -- Posted with my iPhone 8+. |
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#56
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On 1/4/18 10:50 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 1/4/2018 7:52 PM, Alex wrote: John H wrote: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 15:23:28 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/4/2018 2:53 PM, John H wrote: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 13:16:34 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/4/2018 1:07 PM, John H wrote: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 12:42:29 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/4/2018 12:20 PM, wrote: On Thu, 04 Jan 2018 08:54:03 -0500, John H wrote: On Wed, 3 Jan 2018 17:19:35 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 1/3/2018 2:28 PM, Its Me wrote: Light flurries now, the predictions range from a dusting to 1-2 inches.* Worse the closer to the coast you get.* My BIL at James Island (Charleston) sent a picture earlier of maybe 1/4 inch and still falling.* Very unusual for them. It's out of here in a few hours and headed up the coast. Good luck! Damn.* I was hoping it would dump a foot in Mt. Pleasant, just to shut my son up. Last I heard it is supposed to "explode" as it comes up the coast, becoming essentially a winter hurricane. "Bombogenesis" is the technical term, and the popular "bomb cyclone" is a shortened version of it, according to our weather folks. They do seem to just make up names for things these days. I think the classic was "Super Storm Sandy" to talk about something that was not even a hurricane, it was just "super" for people who were not used to tropical weather. It is far from unprecedented tho. There was a real Cat 3 there in the 30s. I have certainly seen that weather pattern in DC tho and this is not even the worst case. The snow would actually be more of a problem if the "eye" of that low was farther west so your wind was drawing wet gulf stream air up into the cold front north of you. That is what gives DC over a foot of snow a day and if it stalls, you "Knickerbocker" snow. Up here a Cat 1 hurricane in the summer might be preferable over what is going on right now. When you look at this storm on radar it is developing a very defined rotation as it is winding up and getting bigger.* Snowfall rate here is 2-3 inches/hr and the temp is dropping like a rock since this morning.* Pretty much a white-out out there. Major flooding in Justin's former town with 4 disabled cars with people trapped inside, one a woman with 2 kids.* Water is over the wheel wells. *** Fire and National Guard are responding. My old stomping grounds in Scituate is really getting clobbered ... worst in over 30 years despite improvements in sea walls, etc. A TV reporter nut was standing on the porch of a house about 30 feet from the seawall and he was getting soaked with spray, along with dodging sea ice that is being thrown up onto the roofs of houses. So far we haven't had any power glitches here but I fully expect we'll lose it in the next hour or so. Wind where I am is gusting 55-60 mph. Best of luck in all that. I think I'd be getting out the extension cords and prioritizing my electricity requirements! Did that yesterday ... that's why I was firing up the Honda to test. I have a new plan.* If power goes out I am going to shut off the main breaker and then backfeed the generator output through a 15 amp outlet that's in the shed.* It's on the same branch of the split 240v house supply as the furnace and a couple of rooms.* All my lighting is LED, so that's a tiny load.* The generator will run those plus the furnace system with no problem and I don't need to have extension cords running anywhere. Well, you know more about electricity than I do. That's something I'd never try. Came across this while looking for info. Don't know if it'll help or you already have it down. http://www.tcscooters.com/backfeed.htm I like steps 1-3: If you are going to backfeed your home, you must be very carefully and follow the directions below. If you fail to follow them you can kill a line worker, kill yourself or blow up your generator. Again I'll say, get a licensed electrician. Step One, the most important step of all is to turn off the main breakers. Step two, turn off the main breakers. Step three, turn off the main breakers. Do you get the idea? Step four, remember to plug the generator end in last. If the generator is running and you are using two male ends the house end plug is live! I definitely agree that not everyone should do this.* The best way is to have an automatic transfer box installed to code by a licensed electrician. That said, I've done this several times, including the house we had in Florida after Wilma.* I have sufficient knowledge of what I am doing but even so, I stop, check and re-check before firing up the generator and throwing the breaker that it backfeeds through. It's illegal, but safe if you pay attention and know something about house wiring. Here's a little test that I've even tried on licensed electricians to see how knowledgeable they a Your house service is usually 240vac, split phase.* Split phase means two "hot" leads, a neutral (used with both hot legs) and a ground (which really is tied to the neutral leg.* Across the two "hot" leads you have 240 volts which is used for stoves, large AC units, etc.* Between either hot lead and neutral you have 120 volts which is used for your outlets, lighting, refrig and small appliances.* Your panel box is supposed to be wired to balance the loads as best as possible.* So, here's the question.* Let's say: Leg "A" of the 120 volt supply is drawing* 40 amps. Leg "B" of the 120 volt supply is drawing* 30 amps. How much current is flowing through the common neutral leg that is used for both legs? The answer is 10 amps. Many people assume it is the sum of both current draws or 70 amps in this example and it's amazing how many "electricians" don't know that. They don't realize that the two "hot" legs are 180 degrees out of phase, so the current in the neutral adds algebraically. That's why the neutral feed from the street to your power panel is the same size wire as the two hot leads.* It will never carry more than what one hot leg is rated to draw. I would have guessed 35. But, that's just proof of how little I know about electricity, off the top of my head. Harry would have got it right. Maybe not.* It's probably not an easy Google search and his union buddies wouldn't know the answer. Harry's playing outside, four wheeling in his driveway in 4 inches of snow. I don't read posts from Herring unless a bit of them is quoted in someone else's post. Whatever the question was, if I had the information Herring needed, I'd go make a sandwich instead. |
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#57
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On Fri, 5 Jan 2018 05:34:25 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: I agree the harmonic problem is just on wye but that is the most common configuration, 208 or 480. I think the problem first showed up on 480/277 wye systems where they had a building full of 277v electronic ballasts. Then it started showing up in those 208 systems that were feeding 120v lines in cubicles through the internal wiring with a 5 wire feeder as PCs started replacing terminals with ferro power supplies and space heaters. Delta is always funny stuff, depending on where or even if you land the ground. Corner grounded is probably the easiest to confuse the novice. It will look just like single phase until you get your meter out. (2 pole breakers, white wires etc) Not familiar with that. The majority of the systems we built were designed to run on 480v, 3 phase. All the main breakers, fused disconnects, motor starters, etc. were three pole. Ground was run separately. We used a dedicated control transformer in each power cabinet to generate whatever the low voltage control wiring was ... 120v in the early days but later 24 volt. IIRC, the control transformer on the 120v systems was a 480v/240v step down with a center tap, providing a neutral. Did you ground your 480 delta at all? If so where did the ground land? I understand your control circuit voltage can be 120 if you want. That is just a class 1 control circuit. Most people are familiar with class 2 but they are both controlled by the same article in the NEC. Class 1 just looks like regular line voltage circuits because it is not voltage or current limited like class 2 and 3. The center tapped 240 delta is commonly called "red leg" or "wild leg"because the corner between the center tapped windings will be 208v to ground. "Red" is a misnomer tho because the NEC requires the wire to be orange. That is very common in places where they want discount 3 phase and have a significant amount of single phase loads like those small industrial bays. The PoCo can do it with 2 transformers, generally the wild leg will be on a much smaller one. One "winding" is actually open. hence another name, "Delta Veep". http://gfretwell.com/electrical/red%...ansformers.jpg 99.99% of the time, if you see 3 transformers on the pole, it will be wye. but I have seen one place in Key West where they had red leg delta with 3 transformers. The only tip off was one was bigger than the other two and it was confirmed by analysing the wiring. http://gfretwell.com/electrical/Tran...%20_breath.jpg Yeah my wife thinks I am crazy too, taking pictures of transformers. |
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#58
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On Fri, 05 Jan 2018 08:11:57 -0500, John H
wrote: On Fri, 05 Jan 2018 00:04:40 -0500, wrote: On Thu, 4 Jan 2018 22:50:19 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: Harry's playing outside, four wheeling in his driveway in 4 inches of snow. Ny niece posted a picture on Facebook of a measured 6" a few miles south of Harry. He may have more than 4" of snow. I think Harry said he got 6", but the official record puts him between 2-4". http://www.weatherstreet.com/city_sn...snow-depth.htm We got about an inch. Just going on the picture my niece posted from her marina in Ridge. (Ruler stuck in the snow) |
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#59
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On Fri, 5 Jan 2018 08:32:51 -0500 (EST), justan wrote:
Wrote in message: My 5.5 KW burned about 0.5-0.6 GPH gasoline and more like 8 on propane running pretty much 24 hours a day at close to full load. Once I started running propane, it never turned off. I did trip the breaker now and then when the loads ganged up on me. ;-) 8 what? gallons of propane an hour What is involved in converting to propane? You remove the carb, install longer studs, slip the propane venturi over the studs and reinstall the carb. Then you mount the regulator, hook up the hoses and you are ready to rock. The whole thing takes less than an hour the first time and I bet I can do it in 15 minutes now. They give you the initial setting on the control block for nat gas or propane and you dial it in from there once you get it running. I may be able to improve the fuel consumption a little but I would rather be too rich than too lean. I have it pretty close tho. |
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#60
posted to rec.boats
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Flurries
On Fri, 05 Jan 2018 08:47:56 -0500, John H
wrote: On Fri, 5 Jan 2018 08:32:51 -0500 (EST), justan wrote: Wrote in message: My 5.5 KW burned about 0.5-0.6 GPH gasoline and more like 8 on propane running pretty much 24 hours a day at close to full load. Once I started running propane, it never turned off. I did trip the breaker now and then when the loads ganged up on me. ;-) 8 what? What is involved in converting to propane? A place to start: http://www.uscarburetion.com/simple_explanation.htm That is the place where I got mine. They are great on the phone if you need help. I was OK but it just sounded too simple and I wanted to be sure I did everything right before I fired it up. |
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