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#1
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
12:10 PMPoco Deplorevole On Mon, 1 May 2017 09:51:41 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: So delorto evidently used the save carb for different apps, excusing the needle and jetting. That's interesting. Using the same CFM Venturi carburation for the wide of a genre cc engines. I can't see it but it must have worked... When I bought the Mille, it was jetted for the USA. Very soon after buying it, I bought a European jetting kit for both carbs. Also put competition pipes on it at the same time. Turned it into a real screamer. ..... I thought of looking up performance stuff for my v11, but I figure it's good enough the way it is. Still comptimplating an MV though... |
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#2
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
On Mon, 1 May 2017 10:16:47 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote:
12:10 PMPoco Deplorevole On Mon, 1 May 2017 09:51:41 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: So delorto evidently used the save carb for different apps, excusing the needle and jetting. That's interesting. Using the same CFM Venturi carburation for the wide of a genre cc engines. I can't see it but it must have worked... When I bought the Mille, it was jetted for the USA. Very soon after buying it, I bought a European jetting kit for both carbs. Also put competition pipes on it at the same time. Turned it into a real screamer. .... I thought of looking up performance stuff for my v11, but I figure it's good enough the way it is. Still comptimplating an MV though... The pipes, jetting and K&N air filters made a hell of a difference in the way mine ran. |
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#3
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
12:45 PMPoco Deplorevole - show quoted text - The pipes, jetting and K&N air filters made a hell of a difference in the way mine ran. .... Oh yes I'm sure it would. I'm limited in mine to what I can do. Seeing mine is electronic fuel injected, anout the only things available is through Harpers, there's some "performance" mufflers. And also available is a $300.00 computer box, and that's about it.. http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 https://store.58cycle.com/product_p/...FRYbgQodK0oD8g |
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#4
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
On 5/1/2017 2:15 PM, Tim wrote:
12:45 PMPoco Deplorevole - show quoted text - The pipes, jetting and K&N air filters made a hell of a difference in the way mine ran. ... Oh yes I'm sure it would. I'm limited in mine to what I can do. Seeing mine is electronic fuel injected, anout the only things available is through Harpers, there's some "performance" mufflers. And also available is a $300.00 computer box, and that's about it.. http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 https://store.58cycle.com/product_p/...FRYbgQodK0oD8g Do you really think K&N air filters make a difference? I've tried them on two different vehicles, one with a carb and one that was fuel injected. Other than being a bit louder under full throttle, I didn't see any performance difference. Isn't it true that a stock air filter is designed to pass the maximum amount of air that the intake can handle? If so, of what benefit is a K&N? They may be capable of more air passing through them under test conditions but if the intake only demands what a stock filter can handle, what's the point? |
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#5
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
On Mon, 1 May 2017 14:27:26 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 5/1/2017 2:15 PM, Tim wrote: 12:45 PMPoco Deplorevole - show quoted text - The pipes, jetting and K&N air filters made a hell of a difference in the way mine ran. ... Oh yes I'm sure it would. I'm limited in mine to what I can do. Seeing mine is electronic fuel injected, anout the only things available is through Harpers, there's some "performance" mufflers. And also available is a $300.00 computer box, and that's about it.. http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 https://store.58cycle.com/product_p/...FRYbgQodK0oD8g Do you really think K&N air filters make a difference? I've tried them on two different vehicles, one with a carb and one that was fuel injected. Other than being a bit louder under full throttle, I didn't see any performance difference. Isn't it true that a stock air filter is designed to pass the maximum amount of air that the intake can handle? If so, of what benefit is a K&N? They may be capable of more air passing through them under test conditions but if the intake only demands what a stock filter can handle, what's the point? I don't know if the K&Ns pass more air or not. With the three changes I made to my bike it accelerated much faster. I do know that I can dismount, clean, oil, and replace the K&Ns in about a half hour. The stock air filter would take at least an hour just to get to it...buried under the gas tank between frame members with tubes going everywhere. Here's what the stock filter looks like: https://www.harpermoto.com/images/pl...air-filter.jpg Here's a pic showing how it's mounted, but you have to look very closely. It's under the top center frame member, between the two side frame members, snuggled down between the two cylinders. http://image.wikifoundry.com/image/1...3686/GW448H336 Here's the K&N installation: http://www.spedizione.nl/wp-content/...-3-2015-41.jpg |
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#6
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
2:17 PMPoco Deplorevole
- show quoted text - I don't know if the K&Ns pass more air or not. With the three changes I made to my bike it accelerated much faster. I do know that I can dismount, clean, oil, and replace the K&Ns in about a half hour. The stock air filter would take at least an hour just to get to it...buried under the gas tank between frame members with tubes going everywhere. Here's what the stock filter looks like: https://www.harpermoto.com/images/pl...air-filter.jpg Here's a pic showing how it's mounted, but you have to look very closely. It's under the top center frame member, between the two side frame members, snuggled down between the two cylinders. http://image.wikifoundry.com/image/1...3686/GW448H336 ---- That's one thing I liked about my old ambassador. It had a simple paper element in a tin box full of vents. Changing the filter was a snap. That was then and this is now... |
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#7
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
On 5/1/2017 3:17 PM, Poco Deplorevole wrote:
On Mon, 1 May 2017 14:27:26 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 5/1/2017 2:15 PM, Tim wrote: 12:45 PMPoco Deplorevole - show quoted text - The pipes, jetting and K&N air filters made a hell of a difference in the way mine ran. ... Oh yes I'm sure it would. I'm limited in mine to what I can do. Seeing mine is electronic fuel injected, anout the only things available is through Harpers, there's some "performance" mufflers. And also available is a $300.00 computer box, and that's about it.. http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 https://store.58cycle.com/product_p/...FRYbgQodK0oD8g Do you really think K&N air filters make a difference? I've tried them on two different vehicles, one with a carb and one that was fuel injected. Other than being a bit louder under full throttle, I didn't see any performance difference. Isn't it true that a stock air filter is designed to pass the maximum amount of air that the intake can handle? If so, of what benefit is a K&N? They may be capable of more air passing through them under test conditions but if the intake only demands what a stock filter can handle, what's the point? I don't know if the K&Ns pass more air or not. With the three changes I made to my bike it accelerated much faster. I do know that I can dismount, clean, oil, and replace the K&Ns in about a half hour. The stock air filter would take at least an hour just to get to it...buried under the gas tank between frame members with tubes going everywhere. Here's what the stock filter looks like: https://www.harpermoto.com/images/pl...air-filter.jpg Here's a pic showing how it's mounted, but you have to look very closely. It's under the top center frame member, between the two side frame members, snuggled down between the two cylinders. http://image.wikifoundry.com/image/1...3686/GW448H336 Here's the K&N installation: http://www.spedizione.nl/wp-content/...-3-2015-41.jpg I never tried a K&N on any of my motorcycles so I have no personal experience. However, I was curious and ran across this explanation in a motorcycle forum. Guy seems to know what he's talking about: "Several years ago a bunch of BMW motorcycle enthusiasts decided to test the claims. They dyno tested several bikes with factory air filters, K&N filters, and NO filter, and made several runs. There was exactly zero measurable power increase. The claims tend to work like this: -Factory air filter produces 1.5" H2O pressure drop. -Wonder filter produces only 0.5" H2O pressure drop. Wonder filter is 300% better!!! This ignores the fact that atmospheric pressure is about 384"H2O. Therefore a 1.5" pressure drop represents, at most, a 0.3% power loss. If the improvement were directly proportional to pressure, then the wonder filter might produce a 0.2% power increase, which is completely buried in the noise of temperature variations and barometric pressure changes. But this is not the case. Mass flow varies as the square root of pressure drop, so that difference in pressure allows only 0.1% more mass flow. The actual difference is even less than that though. Because the filter is only part of the total pressure drop between open atmosphere and the inside of the cylinders. Most of the drop is still going to be getting past the intake valve(s). Tuned intakes can mitigate this over narrow rpm ranges, and this is of course where peak torque is measured, so really sensitive measurements may pick up an improvement in peak torque, but anywere else the pressure loss across the filter is meaningless. |
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#8
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
On Mon, 1 May 2017 16:21:35 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 5/1/2017 3:17 PM, Poco Deplorevole wrote: On Mon, 1 May 2017 14:27:26 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 5/1/2017 2:15 PM, Tim wrote: 12:45 PMPoco Deplorevole - show quoted text - The pipes, jetting and K&N air filters made a hell of a difference in the way mine ran. ... Oh yes I'm sure it would. I'm limited in mine to what I can do. Seeing mine is electronic fuel injected, anout the only things available is through Harpers, there's some "performance" mufflers. And also available is a $300.00 computer box, and that's about it.. http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detai...zi/jackal-1100 https://store.58cycle.com/product_p/...FRYbgQodK0oD8g Do you really think K&N air filters make a difference? I've tried them on two different vehicles, one with a carb and one that was fuel injected. Other than being a bit louder under full throttle, I didn't see any performance difference. Isn't it true that a stock air filter is designed to pass the maximum amount of air that the intake can handle? If so, of what benefit is a K&N? They may be capable of more air passing through them under test conditions but if the intake only demands what a stock filter can handle, what's the point? I don't know if the K&Ns pass more air or not. With the three changes I made to my bike it accelerated much faster. I do know that I can dismount, clean, oil, and replace the K&Ns in about a half hour. The stock air filter would take at least an hour just to get to it...buried under the gas tank between frame members with tubes going everywhere. Here's what the stock filter looks like: https://www.harpermoto.com/images/pl...air-filter.jpg Here's a pic showing how it's mounted, but you have to look very closely. It's under the top center frame member, between the two side frame members, snuggled down between the two cylinders. http://image.wikifoundry.com/image/1...3686/GW448H336 Here's the K&N installation: http://www.spedizione.nl/wp-content/...-3-2015-41.jpg I never tried a K&N on any of my motorcycles so I have no personal experience. However, I was curious and ran across this explanation in a motorcycle forum. Guy seems to know what he's talking about: "Several years ago a bunch of BMW motorcycle enthusiasts decided to test the claims. They dyno tested several bikes with factory air filters, K&N filters, and NO filter, and made several runs. There was exactly zero measurable power increase. The claims tend to work like this: -Factory air filter produces 1.5" H2O pressure drop. -Wonder filter produces only 0.5" H2O pressure drop. Wonder filter is 300% better!!! This ignores the fact that atmospheric pressure is about 384"H2O. Therefore a 1.5" pressure drop represents, at most, a 0.3% power loss. If the improvement were directly proportional to pressure, then the wonder filter might produce a 0.2% power increase, which is completely buried in the noise of temperature variations and barometric pressure changes. But this is not the case. Mass flow varies as the square root of pressure drop, so that difference in pressure allows only 0.1% more mass flow. The actual difference is even less than that though. Because the filter is only part of the total pressure drop between open atmosphere and the inside of the cylinders. Most of the drop is still going to be getting past the intake valve(s). Tuned intakes can mitigate this over narrow rpm ranges, and this is of course where peak torque is measured, so really sensitive measurements may pick up an improvement in peak torque, but anywere else the pressure loss across the filter is meaningless. My use of K&Ns on the Guzzi is purely convenience...and they're cheap. The two on their now have lasted over 25 years. Can't bitch about that. |
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#9
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
1:27 PMMr. Luddite
- show quoted text - Do you really think K&N air filters make a difference? I've tried them on two different vehicles, one with a carb and one that was fuel injected. Other than being a bit louder under full throttle, I didn't see any performance difference. Isn't it true that a stock air filter is designed to pass the maximum amount of air that the intake can handle? If so, of what benefit is a K&N? They may be capable of more air passing through them under test conditions but if the intake only demands what a stock filter can handle, what's the point? ...... Richard, I believe the KN is made for more extreme measures like dirt racing. Possibly giving better filtration but also more air flow while half clogged compared to OE when new... |
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#10
posted to rec.boats
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Yo Tim...FWIW
On 5/1/2017 3:52 PM, Tim wrote:
1:27 PMMr. Luddite - show quoted text - Do you really think K&N air filters make a difference? I've tried them on two different vehicles, one with a carb and one that was fuel injected. Other than being a bit louder under full throttle, I didn't see any performance difference. Isn't it true that a stock air filter is designed to pass the maximum amount of air that the intake can handle? If so, of what benefit is a K&N? They may be capable of more air passing through them under test conditions but if the intake only demands what a stock filter can handle, what's the point? ..... Richard, I believe the KN is made for more extreme measures like dirt racing. Possibly giving better filtration but also more air flow while half clogged compared to OE when new... Maybe. But something bothers me about that logic also. The K&N filters are treated with oil and thus can be cleaned and re-used. That's about the only advantage I can see and it would make sense in dirt racing. You wouldn't have to buy a new filter every race. |
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