I Am No Longer Boatless
 

Good thought Richard. I know my boat policy has setting like that in it but really not sure. I need to review it.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 04:43:25 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I had a $2 million liability marine insurance on the last three boats I
had that would pay out something like $500K for oil/gas/fuel spill clean
up costs.

===

Friends of ours lost their boat last year (fire) and spilled an
estimated 70 gallons of diesel fuel. The environmental damages and
clean up costs were assessed at something north of $400K.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On 8/17/2015 9:44 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 04:43:25 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I had a $2 million liability marine insurance on the last three boats I
had that would pay out something like $500K for oil/gas/fuel spill clean
up costs.

===

Friends of ours lost their boat last year (fire) and spilled an
estimated 70 gallons of diesel fuel. The environmental damages and
clean up costs were assessed at something north of $400K.



When I first got into boating I had a rider on my homeowner's policy for
the boat. The more I got involved and I learned of the oil spill
laws and how it worked I started to question what exactly the
homeowner's policy covered. Turns out it didn't cover anything as far
as oil spill clean up costs. That's one of the reasons the policies are
so cheap. I switched to a true, marine insurance company.

I see insurance places like Progressive and Gieco offer boat insurance.
I wonder if their policies include oil spill liability. I doubt it.

I think BoatUS has insurance policies that cover oil spill liability.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

"Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 8/17/2015 2:08 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 14:17:08 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 12:12:35 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:

Those are 350 GMs?
That is a solid engine, particularly in fresh water but they can be
thirsty. The good news is gas is getting cheaper. Enjoy your boat.

Talking to a guy in the marina at Ganges, BC, Canada. His comment, rings
true, fuel is one of the cheaper parts of boating. And he owned an older
wooden hall trawler.

===

That's very true in my experience, and the less you use your boat, the
more true it is. Even when diesel was at $4/gallon I figured it was
about 40% of expenses while running about 500 hours per year.

Fuel is my biggest expense but my boat is fully amortized years ago,
insurance is cheap, dockage is free and the amortized cost of my last
motor ended up being about $650 a year including maintenance. (over 10
years) I spent closer to $900 on fuel last year.
The Yamaha I have cost about a grand more but I am not sure how long
it will last and what it will be worth on the back end. I paid $5600
for the Merc 60 and sold it for $1500. The big ticket maintenance
bills were $250 for a HP fuel pump and $300 for 2 seal jobs on the
lower unit. The rest was just routine oil changes and a few cheap
parts. ($50)




I wonder how many people have true marine insurance on their boats that
will cover the cost of a major oil or fuel spill clean up. The home
insurance policies "riders" don't. It may not be a high risk on a boat
like yours since you don't have a "bilge" but on a larger hulled boat
with fuel tanks (gas or diesel) and inboard engines with oil pans that
can rot it is an issue. Imagine a large fuel tank full of diesel letting
go or an engine oil pan that rots out and dumps 7 gallons (more if diesel
engine) of oil and the bilge pump dutifully pumps it overboard without your knowledge.

I had a $2 million liability marine insurance on the last three boats I
had that would pay out something like $500K for oil/gas/fuel spill clean up costs.

I have BoatUS insurance which is a yacht policy, which gives me $500k in
oil spill. You did wrong having a $2mm liability policy on the boat. I
run $300k liability on all my policies and then have a $2mm umbrella
policy. Saves money. The $2mm now goes across all the policies and is
about $275 a year. The $300k is the minimum they require for umbrella
coverage.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 04:43:25 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 8/17/2015 2:08 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 14:17:08 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 12:12:35 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:

Those are 350 GMs?
That is a solid engine, particularly in fresh water but they can be
thirsty. The good news is gas is getting cheaper. Enjoy your boat.

Talking to a guy in the marina at Ganges, BC, Canada. His comment, rings
true, fuel is one of the cheaper parts of boating. And he owned an older
wooden hall trawler.

===

That's very true in my experience, and the less you use your boat, the
more true it is. Even when diesel was at $4/gallon I figured it was
about 40% of expenses while running about 500 hours per year.

Fuel is my biggest expense but my boat is fully amortized years ago,
insurance is cheap, dockage is free and the amortized cost of my last
motor ended up being about $650 a year including maintenance. (over 10
years) I spent closer to $900 on fuel last year.
The Yamaha I have cost about a grand more but I am not sure how long
it will last and what it will be worth on the back end. I paid $5600
for the Merc 60 and sold it for $1500. The big ticket maintenance
bills were $250 for a HP fuel pump and $300 for 2 seal jobs on the
lower unit. The rest was just routine oil changes and a few cheap
parts. ($50)




I wonder how many people have true marine insurance on their boats that
will cover the cost of a major oil or fuel spill clean up. The home
insurance policies "riders" don't. It may not be a high risk on a boat
like yours since you don't have a "bilge" but on a larger hulled boat
with fuel tanks (gas or diesel) and inboard engines with oil pans that
can rot it is an issue. Imagine a large fuel tank full of diesel
letting go or an engine oil pan that rots out and dumps 7 gallons (more
if diesel engine) of oil and the bilge pump dutifully pumps it overboard
without your knowledge.

I had a $2 million liability marine insurance on the last three boats I
had that would pay out something like $500K for oil/gas/fuel spill clean
up costs.

You are right, I do not have anything like that and it is not likely I
would ever be in that spot. I just carry liability and it is about $60
a year.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 10:11:14 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 8/17/2015 9:44 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 04:43:25 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

I had a $2 million liability marine insurance on the last three boats I
had that would pay out something like $500K for oil/gas/fuel spill clean
up costs.

===

Friends of ours lost their boat last year (fire) and spilled an
estimated 70 gallons of diesel fuel. The environmental damages and
clean up costs were assessed at something north of $400K.



When I first got into boating I had a rider on my homeowner's policy for
the boat. The more I got involved and I learned of the oil spill
laws and how it worked I started to question what exactly the
homeowner's policy covered. Turns out it didn't cover anything as far
as oil spill clean up costs. That's one of the reasons the policies are
so cheap. I switched to a true, marine insurance company.

I see insurance places like Progressive and Gieco offer boat insurance.
I wonder if their policies include oil spill liability. I doubt it.

I think BoatUS has insurance policies that cover oil spill liability.

I am with Allstate. I will see.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 13:05:11 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 04:43:25 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 8/17/2015 2:08 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 14:17:08 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Aug 2015 12:12:35 -0500, Califbill billnews wrote:

Those are 350 GMs?
That is a solid engine, particularly in fresh water but they can be
thirsty. The good news is gas is getting cheaper. Enjoy your boat.

Talking to a guy in the marina at Ganges, BC, Canada. His comment, rings
true, fuel is one of the cheaper parts of boating. And he owned an older
wooden hall trawler.

===

That's very true in my experience, and the less you use your boat, the
more true it is. Even when diesel was at $4/gallon I figured it was
about 40% of expenses while running about 500 hours per year.

Fuel is my biggest expense but my boat is fully amortized years ago,
insurance is cheap, dockage is free and the amortized cost of my last
motor ended up being about $650 a year including maintenance. (over 10
years) I spent closer to $900 on fuel last year.
The Yamaha I have cost about a grand more but I am not sure how long
it will last and what it will be worth on the back end. I paid $5600
for the Merc 60 and sold it for $1500. The big ticket maintenance
bills were $250 for a HP fuel pump and $300 for 2 seal jobs on the
lower unit. The rest was just routine oil changes and a few cheap
parts. ($50)




I wonder how many people have true marine insurance on their boats that
will cover the cost of a major oil or fuel spill clean up. The home
insurance policies "riders" don't. It may not be a high risk on a boat
like yours since you don't have a "bilge" but on a larger hulled boat
with fuel tanks (gas or diesel) and inboard engines with oil pans that
can rot it is an issue. Imagine a large fuel tank full of diesel
letting go or an engine oil pan that rots out and dumps 7 gallons (more
if diesel engine) of oil and the bilge pump dutifully pumps it overboard
without your knowledge.

I had a $2 million liability marine insurance on the last three boats I
had that would pay out something like $500K for oil/gas/fuel spill clean
up costs.

You are right, I do not have anything like that and it is not likely I
would ever be in that spot. I just carry liability and it is about $60
a year.

===

There is minimal risk of fuel spill damage with outboards unless you
have large built in tanks. Some of the damage assessments that I've
heard about seem inflated and arbitrary however.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 13:24:53 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 13:05:11 -0400, wrote:


You are right, I do not have anything like that and it is not likely I
would ever be in that spot. I just carry liability and it is about $60
a year.

===

There is minimal risk of fuel spill damage with outboards unless you
have large built in tanks. Some of the damage assessments that I've
heard about seem inflated and arbitrary however.

I seldom have more than 10 gallons of gas on board and it is not
likely anyone would see the spill anyway. As bad as gasoline is, you
are not going to have dead shore birds and a ring around the harbor.

Chances are if I had that kind of casualty, the fire would burn most
of it ;-)

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On 8/17/2015 2:20 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 13:24:53 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 13:05:11 -0400, wrote:


You are right, I do not have anything like that and it is not likely I
would ever be in that spot. I just carry liability and it is about $60
a year.

===

There is minimal risk of fuel spill damage with outboards unless you
have large built in tanks. Some of the damage assessments that I've
heard about seem inflated and arbitrary however.

I seldom have more than 10 gallons of gas on board and it is not
likely anyone would see the spill anyway. As bad as gasoline is, you
are not going to have dead shore birds and a ring around the harbor.

Chances are if I had that kind of casualty, the fire would burn most
of it ;-)



I remember a few years ago the EPA tightened up on the definition of an
oil or fuel spill. Basically, any spillage that formed a sheen on the
water is considered a spill and technically is supposed to be reported.

In reality I don't think many people or marine fuel docks take this very
seriously. A couple of spilled drops of gas out of the fuel nozzle will
create a large "sheen" area. The old trick of having a spray bottle
with water and dishwashing soap usually hides the evidence, although you
can be fined if you get caught doing it.

It's pretty much impossible to completely eliminate *all* traces of
contamination from fuel. Diesels leave a small amount of unburnt fuel
in the exhaust system when they are shut down. Next time you fire the
engines up that unburnt fuel is blown out the exhaust and causes
a noticeable sheen. Every marina I've been to ignores it.

I Am No Longer Boatless
 

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 15:11:43 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 8/17/2015 2:20 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 13:24:53 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Aug 2015 13:05:11 -0400, wrote:


You are right, I do not have anything like that and it is not likely I
would ever be in that spot. I just carry liability and it is about $60
a year.

===

There is minimal risk of fuel spill damage with outboards unless you
have large built in tanks. Some of the damage assessments that I've
heard about seem inflated and arbitrary however.

I seldom have more than 10 gallons of gas on board and it is not
likely anyone would see the spill anyway. As bad as gasoline is, you
are not going to have dead shore birds and a ring around the harbor.

Chances are if I had that kind of casualty, the fire would burn most
of it ;-)



I remember a few years ago the EPA tightened up on the definition of an
oil or fuel spill. Basically, any spillage that formed a sheen on the
water is considered a spill and technically is supposed to be reported.

In reality I don't think many people or marine fuel docks take this very
seriously. A couple of spilled drops of gas out of the fuel nozzle will
create a large "sheen" area. The old trick of having a spray bottle
with water and dishwashing soap usually hides the evidence, although you
can be fined if you get caught doing it.

It's pretty much impossible to completely eliminate *all* traces of
contamination from fuel. Diesels leave a small amount of unburnt fuel
in the exhaust system when they are shut down. Next time you fire the
engines up that unburnt fuel is blown out the exhaust and causes
a noticeable sheen. Every marina I've been to ignores it.


I am usually pretty careful about spilling anything. It is still
unlikely anyone would see me if I did where I dock and where I go.