http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath

On Saturday, January 17, 2015 at 3:55:10 AM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath

My Audi A6 has the start-stop system on it. Fortunately, it also has a button that allows you to disable it, which I did. The article points out one reason, additional wear and tear on the battery. The second reason that they didn't point out is the wear on the starter and engine itself. With the type of driving I do the fuel savings would be insignificant anyway, and would never come close to paying for the added maintenance.

On 1/17/2015 8:04 AM, wrote:

On Saturday, January 17, 2015 at 3:55:10 AM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath

My Audi A6 has the start-stop system on it. Fortunately, it also has a button that allows you to disable it, which I did. The article points out one reason, additional wear and tear on the battery. The second reason that they didn't point out is the wear on the starter and engine itself. With the type of driving I do the fuel savings would be insignificant anyway, and would never come close to paying for the added maintenance.



Yup. Unfortunately the automakers are being forced to employ any and
all means to meet increasing federal fuel economy requirements.
The article points out that very soon half or more cars sold in the USA
will be equipped with start-stop systems.

It's crazy in a way. Sometimes the efforts to meet required standards
simply produce new, more serious environmental problems like the safe
disposal of dangerous chemicals and, in this case, environmentally
unfriendly batteries that wear out faster than normal.

CFL light bulbs contain mercury. How many people actually follow the
disposal instructions when they go bad? How many people follow the
environmental hazard precautions when they dispose of lithium/ion
batteries? Not many, I'll bet.

On 1/17/2015 3:55 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath

My neighbor had her Z4 stop dead on I75 in the middle of Atlanta. She
was terrified. This is the 4th BMW she has gotten rid of, in the past
year and a half, for various reasons. Technology seems to have ruined
the brand.

--
My sig file appears to be empty.
Howd dat happen?

Respectfully submitted by Justan

On 1/17/2015 8:04 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, January 17, 2015 at 3:55:10 AM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath

My Audi A6 has the start-stop system on it. Fortunately, it also has a button that allows you to disable it, which I did. The article points out one reason, additional wear and tear on the battery. The second reason that they didn't point out is the wear on the starter and engine itself. With the type of driving I do the fuel savings would be insignificant anyway, and would never come close to paying for the added maintenance.


Back in the 80's when we were discussing this we assumed by now there
would be no starters... The computer would just fire the next cylinder
in line is how we thought it would work...

On Saturday, January 17, 2015 at 9:21:33 AM UTC-5, Justan Olphart wrote:
On 1/17/2015 3:55 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath

My neighbor had her Z4 stop dead on I75 in the middle of Atlanta. She
was terrified. This is the 4th BMW she has gotten rid of, in the past
year and a half, for various reasons. Technology seems to have ruined
the brand.

--
My sig file appears to be empty.
Howd dat happen?

Respectfully submitted by Justan

BMW's are great cars, but are notoriously unreliable compared to most other cars.

I have a 5 year, 100k mile warranty on the Audi. I probably won't keep it past that period. It's a great car, but extremely complex. I've seen one at the dealer with the dash torn apart. Multiple controllers, tons of wiring, and even fiber optic connections. The day of the shade tree mechanic is long gone.

On 1/17/2015 11:27 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 17 Jan 2015 10:06:02 -0500, KC wrote:

Back in the 80's when we were discussing this we assumed by now there
would be no starters... The computer would just fire the next cylinder
in line is how we thought it would work...

How would that work? To start an engine you need fuel, air, spark and
compression. If the car had sat more than a minute, there would be no
compression and most injected engines cut the fuel off before the
engine stops spinning these days to mitigate "making oil" so the "next
cylinder" would be dry.



I don't think Scott understands what "start-stop" is.

He's probably thinking of the attempts to cut fuel and ignition to 2 or
more cylinders once a car had reached cruising speed. GM had a system
that cut an 8 cylinder back to 6 or 4 in the 1980's. Didn't really
work out very well.

Some modern engines have a system whereby if the engine starts to
overheat, a couple of cylinders will shut down and just pump air, adding
additional cooling. The engine in my truck is supposed to do that but
it has never had a reason to.

On 1/17/2015 9:21 AM, Justan Olphart wrote:
On 1/17/2015 3:55 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath


My neighbor had her Z4 stop dead on I75 in the middle of Atlanta. She
was terrified. This is the 4th BMW she has gotten rid of, in the past
year and a half, for various reasons. Technology seems to have ruined
the brand.



I ditched the two BMW M5's for the same reason. German engineering is
great except for the software. Both M5's had issues with the "red cog
of death" whereby nothing works. Can't shift, can't do anything other
than call a flatbed and haul it back to the dealership for re-programming.

On 1/17/2015 11:27 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 17 Jan 2015 10:06:02 -0500, KC wrote:

Back in the 80's when we were discussing this we assumed by now there
would be no starters... The computer would just fire the next cylinder
in line is how we thought it would work...

How would that work? To start an engine you need fuel, air, spark and
compression. If the car had sat more than a minute, there would be no
compression and most injected engines cut the fuel off before the
engine stops spinning these days to mitigate "making oil" so the "next
cylinder" would be dry.


We weren't sure how it was gonna' work, that's why we are not rich I
am just telling you where the industry was back then in the beginning of
computer controlled cars...

On 1/17/2015 10:07 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, January 17, 2015 at 9:21:33 AM UTC-5, Justan Olphart wrote:
On 1/17/2015 3:55 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1094588_will-ultracapacitors-save-start-stop-systems-from-consumer-wrath

My neighbor had her Z4 stop dead on I75 in the middle of Atlanta. She
was terrified. This is the 4th BMW she has gotten rid of, in the past
year and a half, for various reasons. Technology seems to have ruined
the brand.

--
My sig file appears to be empty.
Howd dat happen?

Respectfully submitted by Justan

BMW's are great cars, but are notoriously unreliable compared to most other cars.

I have a 5 year, 100k mile warranty on the Audi. I probably won't keep it past that period. It's a great car, but extremely complex. I've seen one at the dealer with the dash torn apart. Multiple controllers, tons of wiring, and even fiber optic connections. The day of the shade tree mechanic is long gone.



When we were in Florida for the winters my wife had a BMW X5. It was
less than a year old when the A/C stopped working properly. I figured
it had a leak in the system and just needed to be fixed and recharged,
but n-o-o-o-o-o-o. It was something to do with the control system that
mixes hot and cold air that was screwed up. They had to completely
disassemble the dash to get to whatever was bad.

Sometimes things are made too complicated.