On 12/6/14 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment. Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.�

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...


Sorta like you, eh?

--
I feel no need to explain my politics to stupid right-wingers.
After all, I am *not* the Jackass Whisperer.

On 12/6/2014 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment. Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.�

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...

Only 22 arrests were for crimes other than selling outlawed cigarettes.
Do you happen to know what those crimes were?

On 12/6/2014 8:12 AM, F*O*A*D wrote:
On 12/6/14 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked
one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment. Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.�

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...


Sorta like you, eh?

Did your whining complaint to his hometown police result in an arrest?

On 12/6/2014 9:01 AM, Let it snowe wrote:
On 12/6/2014 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked
one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment. Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.�

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...

Only 22 arrests were for crimes other than selling outlawed cigarettes.
Do you happen to know what those crimes were?


All misdemeanors. Driving without a license. Possession of a small
amount of pot.

A very dangerous threat to his community.

On 12/6/2014 9:08 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/6/2014 9:01 AM, Let it snowe wrote:
On 12/6/2014 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked
one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was
supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment.
Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.�

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...

Only 22 arrests were for crimes other than selling outlawed cigarettes.
Do you happen to know what those crimes were?


All misdemeanors. Driving without a license. Possession of a small
amount of pot.

A very dangerous threat to his community.

The city of New Yawk thinks thinks selling cigarettes without a city tax
stamp is a very serious crime. It also thinks diverting police resources
to go after these petty criminals is preventing said crims from moving
into larger criminal enterprises. I am torn between applauding New York
for being so progressive in their approach to crime prevention, and
condemning them for being overly nannyish.

PS: You remember when they tried to ban soda pop, don't you?

On Sat, 06 Dec 2014 09:08:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/6/2014 9:01 AM, Let it snowe wrote:
On 12/6/2014 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked
one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment. Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.”

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...

Only 22 arrests were for crimes other than selling outlawed cigarettes.
Do you happen to know what those crimes were?


All misdemeanors. Driving without a license. Possession of a small
amount of pot.

A very dangerous threat to his community.

===

I think you'd have to admit that 22 arrests does not exactly make for
a model citizen. How many crimes did he commit and did not get
caught? Would you want him for a neighbor or hanging out in front of
your business? People are supposed to learn from their mistakes.

On 12/6/2014 9:40 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Sat, 06 Dec 2014 09:08:59 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/6/2014 9:01 AM, Let it snowe wrote:
On 12/6/2014 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked
one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment. Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.”

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...

Only 22 arrests were for crimes other than selling outlawed cigarettes.
Do you happen to know what those crimes were?


All misdemeanors. Driving without a license. Possession of a small
amount of pot.

A very dangerous threat to his community.

===

I think you'd have to admit that 22 arrests does not exactly make for
a model citizen. How many crimes did he commit and did not get
caught? Would you want him for a neighbor or hanging out in front of
your business? People are supposed to learn from their mistakes.


And 9 more arrests for selling cancer sticks. I wouldn't want him in my
neighborhood, trying to get me started on that steeenkin habit again.

On Sat, 06 Dec 2014 09:27:39 -0500, Let it snowe
wrote:

I am torn between applauding New York
for being so progressive in their approach to crime prevention, and
condemning them for being overly nannyish.

===

I share the same sentiment but the two activities are unrelated.
There's no question that NYC has made huge progress on controling
crime. I moved there in the late 60s when things were totally out of
control and there has been a huge improvement since then. Arresting a
guy for selling untaxed cigarettes may seem petty but the reality is
that he was a street hustler looking to make a buck anyway he could.

On 12/6/2014 9:01 AM, Let it snowe wrote:
On 12/6/2014 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked
one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment. Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.�

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...

Only 22 arrests were for crimes other than selling outlawed cigarettes.
Do you happen to know what those crimes were?

I heard a list of them the other night, they seemed very minor but may
have included resisting arrest. Either way I am not saying I heard
anything to that, but I am asking if possibly they had seen him act like
this before. These responders get pretty used to some folks when they
deal with them on a weekly basis and the court system keeps throwing
them right back out on the street....

On 12/6/2014 9:27 AM, Let it snowe wrote:
On 12/6/2014 9:08 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/6/2014 9:01 AM, Let it snowe wrote:
On 12/6/2014 8:10 AM, KC wrote:
On 12/6/2014 12:47 AM, wrote:
On Fri, 05 Dec 2014 19:49:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/5/2014 7:28 PM, Poco Loco wrote:
On Fri, 5 Dec 2014 19:14:43 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

CNN ran a long video a little while ago that recorded the
aftermath of
the take down of Garner and the activities of the EMT personnel
and
movement of him to an ambulance.

The video showed the EMT checking him for a pulse. It's not clear
what
she said but it appears she indicated he had a pulse.

As they loaded him on a gurney for transport a bystander asked
one of
the cops why they didn't perform CPR. The cop answered that
Garner was
breathing.

If this is all true, it sorta changes the whole story about the
cop
choking him to death.

You do know that there was a black female Sargent who was
supervising
the arrest of Garner. Why wasn't she subject to indictment for
allowing
a death to occur during her watch?

It does seem like a whole bunch of folks just skipped over that.



“Pantaleo is the only NYPD member facing possible indictment.
Others at
the scene, including two sergeants, were offered immunity for their
testimony to the grand jury.�

...NBC news

CNN was reporting today that the EMTs are in trouble. I was just
passing through but I think I heard them say 2 are suspended and 2
were fired.
Considering the death was partially blamed on the position he was held
down in and the fact that cops other than Pantaleo were sitting on
him. I can see why they didn't indict.
Far too much reasonable doubt about any one person causing his death.
It does look like EMS could have done a lot more to keep this guy
alive. They seemed to think he was not in any particular trouble or
they would have AT LEAST put an oxygen mask on him and pumped some O2
into his lungs. That might have fixed him up right then.
My bet is everyone was happy that this guy was docile and they didn't
want to wake him up. That was the crime if there was one.

At a certain point I am starting to think they did not value his life
enough but that was long after the take down.


Or they had seen this act before from this guy. He was well known in
the
area to the cops, with 31 previous arrests...

Only 22 arrests were for crimes other than selling outlawed cigarettes.
Do you happen to know what those crimes were?


All misdemeanors. Driving without a license. Possession of a small
amount of pot.

A very dangerous threat to his community.

The city of New Yawk thinks thinks selling cigarettes without a city tax
stamp is a very serious crime. It also thinks diverting police resources
to go after these petty criminals is preventing said crims from moving
into larger criminal enterprises. I am torn between applauding New York
for being so progressive in their approach to crime prevention, and
condemning them for being overly nannyish.

It's all part of a well proven policy of taking out the little crims,
turns out a lot of them are the ones doing big stuff too... That's what
a lot of this "protest" is about is getting rid of policies like this
and stop and frisk that saved lives and property and made Ny in
particular, a livable place, unlike Chicago or Detroit...

PS: You remember when they tried to ban soda pop, don't you?

That is like apples and oranges...