In article ,
says...

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article 1493745639376183490.518525bmckeenospam-
, says...

JustWait wrote:
On 12/2/2012 12:59 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.


Even if it was a zero sum home. Those that can afford a 4000'+ home
should
be able to afford electricity. Part of our housing problem is all these
middle class or lower people who just needed a large mansion. Hang the
cost vs. income, I got a cheap loan!

Affording electricity has NOTHING to do with it.


--------------------------

It has lots to do with it in this case.

No, it doesn't.

In article ,
says...

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 15:12:00 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.

You fail to get the point, and the rest of the article.

"Two weeks ago, he bought land for the first Zero Energy America
Village, a prototype community just south of the Pinellas-Pasco border
on East Lake Road.

The project will feature 1,600- to 1,800-square-foot homes with a
target
price of $250,000.

"They will be amazingly healthy, totally green, and the homeowner will
have no electric bills," said Rutenberg. "The village will be the
proudest moment of our company to date."

Considering a 1600 sq/ft house is going for less than $200k up there
in cow country if it is a real nice one (granite and hardwood kitchen
sort of thing) it is still putting $150k down against future electric
bills.

Are you saying that a 1600 square foot home outside of Tampa is going
for $50k???? Are you nuts?
I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the maintenance costs
are and how well these collectors hold up to being hit by lightning,
100 MPH winds and flying debris.

I am still thinking about doing it myself but as long as this is a
high 5 figure or 6 figure investment, I can't make financial sense out
of it.

Yes, you and other right wingers have shown your disdain for anything
innovative and on the technological forefront.


------------------------------

You and the other left wingers have shown your distain for any financial
responsibility.

I have plenty of "financial responsibility". And where do you get the
notion that I'm a "left winger"?


---------------------------

You argue the left's side. and the left seems to lack any financial
responsibility.

I argue MY side, the sane side.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article 1493745639376183490.518525bmckeenospam-
, says...

JustWait wrote:
On 12/2/2012 12:59 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.


Even if it was a zero sum home. Those that can afford a 4000'+ home
should
be able to afford electricity. Part of our housing problem is all these
middle class or lower people who just needed a large mansion. Hang the
cost vs. income, I got a cheap loan!

Affording electricity has NOTHING to do with it.


--------------------------

It has lots to do with it in this case.

No, it doesn't.

Please enlighten us as to why being able to afford the electricity is
not relevant?

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 3 Dec 2012 08:33:42 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

The project will feature 1,600- to 1,800-square-foot homes with a target
price of $250,000.

"They will be amazingly healthy, totally green, and the homeowner will
have no electric bills," said Rutenberg. "The village will be the
proudest moment of our company to date."

Considering a 1600 sq/ft house is going for less than $200k up there
in cow country if it is a real nice one (granite and hardwood kitchen
sort of thing) it is still putting $150k down against future electric
bills.

Are you saying that a 1600 square foot home outside of Tampa is going
for $50k???? Are you nuts?

We both appear to suck at math today

The $50k is the down payment on your future electric bill (not $150k
as I said)

I am not sure how you got to the price being $50k
250 - 150 is 100.

BTW the Pasco County line is not really "just outside of Tampa" in any
meaningful sense. It is 20-30 miles and if they are not near the
Veterans toll road, it is not an easy ride.
If you are not on a lake or a salt water canal up there, houses are
cheap. For that matter Tampa is not really that expensive either.

I am only amazed that Rutenburg is selling anything for $250k. His
houses usually run in the $750-1m range and are those 4000-5000 sq/ft
McMansions at the top of the article.
These days they do go a bit cheaper particularly in the wilds of Pasco
County. (if you go there you will think this is where rednecks come
from).


I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the maintenance costs
are and how well these collectors hold up to being hit by lightning,
100 MPH winds and flying debris.

I am still thinking about doing it myself but as long as this is a
high 5 figure or 6 figure investment, I can't make financial sense out
of it.

Yes, you and other right wingers have shown your disdain for anything
innovative and on the technological forefront.

I take it you haven't been to the area. The area of the Hillsboro county
line is now called.... "New Tampa". I have a cousin who lives in
Zephyrhills, FL which is now really just a suburb of Tampa.

http://www.trulia.com/home_prices/Fl...unty-heat_map/

Now, you said that at $200k you were putting $150 down toward "future
electric bills". That leaves $50k.

I remember Z-Hills fondly. Riding the various DC-3's with 40 om my
friends and doing 40 way sequential skydiving. Great place for a respite
from the cold winters of the north.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article ,
says...

On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 15:12:00 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.

You fail to get the point, and the rest of the article.

"Two weeks ago, he bought land for the first Zero Energy America
Village, a prototype community just south of the Pinellas-Pasco border
on East Lake Road.

The project will feature 1,600- to 1,800-square-foot homes with a target
price of $250,000.

"They will be amazingly healthy, totally green, and the homeowner will
have no electric bills," said Rutenberg. "The village will be the
proudest moment of our company to date."

Considering a 1600 sq/ft house is going for less than $200k up there
in cow country if it is a real nice one (granite and hardwood kitchen
sort of thing) it is still putting $150k down against future electric
bills.

Are you saying that a 1600 square foot home outside of Tampa is going
for $50k???? Are you nuts?
I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the maintenance costs
are and how well these collectors hold up to being hit by lightning,
100 MPH winds and flying debris.

I am still thinking about doing it myself but as long as this is a
high 5 figure or 6 figure investment, I can't make financial sense out
of it.

Yes, you and other right wingers have shown your disdain for anything
innovative and on the technological forefront.


------------------------------

You and the other left wingers have shown your distain for any financial
responsibility.

I have plenty of "financial responsibility". And where do you get the
notion that I'm a "left winger"?

Look in the mirror.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 15:12:00 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.

You fail to get the point, and the rest of the article.

"Two weeks ago, he bought land for the first Zero Energy America
Village, a prototype community just south of the Pinellas-Pasco border
on East Lake Road.

The project will feature 1,600- to 1,800-square-foot homes with a target
price of $250,000.

"They will be amazingly healthy, totally green, and the homeowner will
have no electric bills," said Rutenberg. "The village will be the
proudest moment of our company to date."

Considering a 1600 sq/ft house is going for less than $200k up there
in cow country if it is a real nice one (granite and hardwood kitchen
sort of thing) it is still putting $150k down against future electric
bills.

Are you saying that a 1600 square foot home outside of Tampa is going
for $50k???? Are you nuts?

http://www.realtor.com/soldhomeprice...rice-na-100000

I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the maintenance costs
are and how well these collectors hold up to being hit by lightning,
100 MPH winds and flying debris.

I am still thinking about doing it myself but as long as this is a
high 5 figure or 6 figure investment, I can't make financial sense out
of it.

Yes, you and other right wingers have shown your disdain for anything
innovative and on the technological forefront.

Innovation has to have a pay-off.

ESAD wrote:
On 12/2/12 4:58 PM, JustWait wrote:
On 12/2/2012 12:59 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.



I thought you and Loogie were bosom buddies, and that you were in
touch with his sickly wife and so on and so forth. Don't you get weary
of this?

(Not that I care. I don't.)

**** off Krause. Come back after you have paid the IRS and the
penalties. At least they can't take her house from you!

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

"iBoaterer" wrote in message
...

In article 1493745639376183490.518525bmckeenospam-
, says...

JustWait wrote:
On 12/2/2012 12:59 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.


Even if it was a zero sum home. Those that can afford a 4000'+ home
should
be able to afford electricity. Part of our housing problem is all these
middle class or lower people who just needed a large mansion. Hang the
cost vs. income, I got a cheap loan!

Affording electricity has NOTHING to do with it.


--------------------------

It has lots to do with it in this case.

No, it doesn't.

Please enlighten us as to why being able to afford the electricity is
not relevant?

Because that simply NOT the point of the zero sum home. Are you really
that stupid, or just acting like it for attention?

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 3 Dec 2012 08:33:42 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

The project will feature 1,600- to 1,800-square-foot homes with a target
price of $250,000.

"They will be amazingly healthy, totally green, and the homeowner will
have no electric bills," said Rutenberg. "The village will be the
proudest moment of our company to date."

Considering a 1600 sq/ft house is going for less than $200k up there
in cow country if it is a real nice one (granite and hardwood kitchen
sort of thing) it is still putting $150k down against future electric
bills.

Are you saying that a 1600 square foot home outside of Tampa is going
for $50k???? Are you nuts?

We both appear to suck at math today

The $50k is the down payment on your future electric bill (not $150k
as I said)

I am not sure how you got to the price being $50k
250 - 150 is 100.

BTW the Pasco County line is not really "just outside of Tampa" in any
meaningful sense. It is 20-30 miles and if they are not near the
Veterans toll road, it is not an easy ride.
If you are not on a lake or a salt water canal up there, houses are
cheap. For that matter Tampa is not really that expensive either.

I am only amazed that Rutenburg is selling anything for $250k. His
houses usually run in the $750-1m range and are those 4000-5000 sq/ft
McMansions at the top of the article.
These days they do go a bit cheaper particularly in the wilds of Pasco
County. (if you go there you will think this is where rednecks come
from).


I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the maintenance costs
are and how well these collectors hold up to being hit by lightning,
100 MPH winds and flying debris.

I am still thinking about doing it myself but as long as this is a
high 5 figure or 6 figure investment, I can't make financial sense out
of it.

Yes, you and other right wingers have shown your disdain for anything
innovative and on the technological forefront.

I take it you haven't been to the area. The area of the Hillsboro county
line is now called.... "New Tampa". I have a cousin who lives in
Zephyrhills, FL which is now really just a suburb of Tampa.

http://www.trulia.com/home_prices/Fl...unty-heat_map/

Now, you said that at $200k you were putting $150 down toward "future
electric bills". That leaves $50k.

I remember Z-Hills fondly. Riding the various DC-3's with 40 om my
friends and doing 40 way sequential skydiving. Great place for a respite
from the cold winters of the north.

Mr. Douglas was the blue one with blue tinted windows, sweet plane.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 15:12:00 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 12:43:53 -0500, iBoaterer wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/crdb3z9

If you really think this will be a net zero home you are delusional.
That tiny solar array won't even run the A/C for a 4500 sq/ft house.

You can pay a lot of electric bills for the half million extra this
house costs over the garden variety megabuck Rutenburg house.

You fail to get the point, and the rest of the article.

"Two weeks ago, he bought land for the first Zero Energy America
Village, a prototype community just south of the Pinellas-Pasco border
on East Lake Road.

The project will feature 1,600- to 1,800-square-foot homes with a target
price of $250,000.

"They will be amazingly healthy, totally green, and the homeowner will
have no electric bills," said Rutenberg. "The village will be the
proudest moment of our company to date."

Considering a 1600 sq/ft house is going for less than $200k up there
in cow country if it is a real nice one (granite and hardwood kitchen
sort of thing) it is still putting $150k down against future electric
bills.

Are you saying that a 1600 square foot home outside of Tampa is going
for $50k???? Are you nuts?

http://www.realtor.com/soldhomeprice...rice-na-100000

I am still waiting for someone to tell me what the maintenance costs
are and how well these collectors hold up to being hit by lightning,
100 MPH winds and flying debris.

I am still thinking about doing it myself but as long as this is a
high 5 figure or 6 figure investment, I can't make financial sense out
of it.

Yes, you and other right wingers have shown your disdain for anything
innovative and on the technological forefront.

Innovation has to have a pay-off.

Immediately? You do realize that most innovation is at first, not
financially feasible don't you? Do you think Orville and Wilbur's plane
on Kitty Hawk was immediately a financial success? Henry Ford's car?