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Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
It was international news recently when a small fishing boat was found
adrift in the Atlantic Ocean, several hundred miles from the Panama town where it launched. After 28 days at sea, only one of the three men who had been onboard was still alive. The other two died from lack of water and exposure. Now there are allegations that weeks earlier, while all of the men were still alive, an American-based cruise ship, the Star Princess, spotted the drifting boat — but sailed on without stopping to help. The Star Princess is a luxury cruise ship operated by Carnival. It has four pools, a nine-hole putting green, a casino, and cabins for some 2,000 passengers. In March, on a cruise around South America, the passengers included three bird-watchers, two from Oregon and one from Ireland. They were on deck daily to watch for seabirds, using powerful binoculars and spotting telescopes. On March 10, one of the birders, Jeff Gilligan from Portland, Ore., saw something through his binoculars out on the water, more than a mile away. "We put our scopes on it," he says, "and we could see a moderate-sized boat with a person standing up in it, waving a dark piece of cloth." Telling The Ship's Crew One of the other birders on the Star Princess was Judy Meredith from Bend, Ore. She says, "We all watched him for a bit and thought, 'This guy's in distress. He's trying to get our attention. And he doesn't have a motor on his boat.' We could see that." Meredith went inside to try to place a call to the ship's bridge, to alert the crew about what they'd seen. The only crew member she could find was with the ship's sales team. "He called the bridge and I sort of talked through the story," she says. "And I was trying to have a sense or urgency in my voice — and tell them that the boat was in distress, and they were trying to get our attention." A crew member used Gilligan's telescope to look at the drifting boat. Gilligan says, at that point, "We were a bit relieved because he had confirmed that he had seen what we were describing. We expected the ship to turn back or stop or something." But soon, the bird-watchers realized that wasn't happening. Gilligan says he and the other birders could only hope that the captain of the Star Princess was taking the appropriate steps — perhaps contacting Panamanian or other authorities, who would conduct search-and-rescue operations. Meredith says they never heard back from the crew. In desperation, she marked down the ship's coordinates and sent an email to a Coast Guard website, without results. The Captain's Log When she got home, Meredith contacted Princess Cruises to see what action was taken. She says a customer relations representative told her the captain reported a different version of the incident — and that according to the captain's log, the ship had been passing through a fishing fleet. Meredith says she was told that the Star Princess contacted the boat and "that they were asking the ship to move to the west, because they didn't want their nets to be damaged. And that the ship altered course. And they were waving their shirts because they were thanking the ship." Eventually, the bird-watchers learned of a news story from Ecuador. The Ecuadorean coast guard had picked up a small fishing boat near the Galapagos Islands with just one survivor aboard: 18-year-old Adrian Vasquez. YouTube Vasquez told a harrowing tale of leaving Panama for an overnight fishing trip, then losing power and spending the next 28 days drifting. During that time, the two other fishermen with Vasquez died. It seemed improbable, but Meredith and the other bird-watchers wondered, "Could this be the boat they saw?" In Panama, reporter Don Winner with the website Panama-Guide.com tracked down Vasquez and recorded video of the interview. Winner showed Vasquez a photo the birders had taken of the fishing boat they saw. "That's us," Vasquez said. He and the other men used their orange flotation devices to try to signal to get someone's attention, he said. Winner asked him about the Princess Star. "Yes, we saw a cruise ship," Vasquez said. He said one of the other fishermen, Oropeces Betancourt, 24, died the following day. The third fisherman, Fernando Osario, 16, died five days later. 'Three People Were Alive' International maritime law clearly requires ships that come upon other vessels in distress to render assistance, if they can do so without endangering themselves. In a statement, Princess Cruises says, "We're aware of the allegations that Star Princess supposedly passed by a boat in distress that was carrying three Panamanian fishermen on March 10. At this time we cannot verify the facts as reported, and we are currently conducting an internal investigation on the matter." Princess isn't commenting on the earlier version of the story Meredith says she got from a company customer services representative. Meredith says the experience has left her feeling sick about what Vasquez, his friends and their families had to go through. "Three people were alive on the day they saw us and the day we saw them," she says. "They tried everything they could think of to signal us. And our boat went by, and his buddy died that night." The Star Princess is registered in Bermuda. An official with Bermuda's Department of Maritime Administration says his office is in contact with Princess about the incident but hasn't determined yet whether it will conduct a full investigation. http://tinyurl.com/cna2eef - - - The ship's captain called corporate and no doubt was told that stopping to help would eat into the profits... |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 07:54:56 -0400, X ` Man
wrote: It was international news recently when a small fishing boat was found adrift in the Atlantic Ocean, several hundred miles from the Panama town where it launched. After 28 days at sea, only one of the three men who had been onboard was still alive. The other two died from lack of water and exposure. Now there are allegations that weeks earlier, while all of the men were still alive, an American-based cruise ship, the Star Princess, spotted the drifting boat — but sailed on without stopping to help. The Star Princess is a luxury cruise ship operated by Carnival. It has four pools, a nine-hole putting green, a casino, and cabins for some 2,000 passengers. In March, on a cruise around South America, the passengers included three bird-watchers, two from Oregon and one from Ireland. They were on deck daily to watch for seabirds, using powerful binoculars and spotting telescopes. On March 10, one of the birders, Jeff Gilligan from Portland, Ore., saw something through his binoculars out on the water, more than a mile away. "We put our scopes on it," he says, "and we could see a moderate-sized boat with a person standing up in it, waving a dark piece of cloth." Telling The Ship's Crew One of the other birders on the Star Princess was Judy Meredith from Bend, Ore. She says, "We all watched him for a bit and thought, 'This guy's in distress. He's trying to get our attention. And he doesn't have a motor on his boat.' We could see that." Meredith went inside to try to place a call to the ship's bridge, to alert the crew about what they'd seen. The only crew member she could find was with the ship's sales team. "He called the bridge and I sort of talked through the story," she says. "And I was trying to have a sense or urgency in my voice — and tell them that the boat was in distress, and they were trying to get our attention." A crew member used Gilligan's telescope to look at the drifting boat. Gilligan says, at that point, "We were a bit relieved because he had confirmed that he had seen what we were describing. We expected the ship to turn back or stop or something." But soon, the bird-watchers realized that wasn't happening. Gilligan says he and the other birders could only hope that the captain of the Star Princess was taking the appropriate steps — perhaps contacting Panamanian or other authorities, who would conduct search-and-rescue operations. Meredith says they never heard back from the crew. In desperation, she marked down the ship's coordinates and sent an email to a Coast Guard website, without results. The Captain's Log When she got home, Meredith contacted Princess Cruises to see what action was taken. She says a customer relations representative told her the captain reported a different version of the incident — and that according to the captain's log, the ship had been passing through a fishing fleet. Meredith says she was told that the Star Princess contacted the boat and "that they were asking the ship to move to the west, because they didn't want their nets to be damaged. And that the ship altered course. And they were waving their shirts because they were thanking the ship." Eventually, the bird-watchers learned of a news story from Ecuador. The Ecuadorean coast guard had picked up a small fishing boat near the Galapagos Islands with just one survivor aboard: 18-year-old Adrian Vasquez. YouTube Vasquez told a harrowing tale of leaving Panama for an overnight fishing trip, then losing power and spending the next 28 days drifting. During that time, the two other fishermen with Vasquez died. It seemed improbable, but Meredith and the other bird-watchers wondered, "Could this be the boat they saw?" In Panama, reporter Don Winner with the website Panama-Guide.com tracked down Vasquez and recorded video of the interview. Winner showed Vasquez a photo the birders had taken of the fishing boat they saw. "That's us," Vasquez said. He and the other men used their orange flotation devices to try to signal to get someone's attention, he said. Winner asked him about the Princess Star. "Yes, we saw a cruise ship," Vasquez said. He said one of the other fishermen, Oropeces Betancourt, 24, died the following day. The third fisherman, Fernando Osario, 16, died five days later. 'Three People Were Alive' International maritime law clearly requires ships that come upon other vessels in distress to render assistance, if they can do so without endangering themselves. In a statement, Princess Cruises says, "We're aware of the allegations that Star Princess supposedly passed by a boat in distress that was carrying three Panamanian fishermen on March 10. At this time we cannot verify the facts as reported, and we are currently conducting an internal investigation on the matter." Princess isn't commenting on the earlier version of the story Meredith says she got from a company customer services representative. Meredith says the experience has left her feeling sick about what Vasquez, his friends and their families had to go through. "Three people were alive on the day they saw us and the day we saw them," she says. "They tried everything they could think of to signal us. And our boat went by, and his buddy died that night." The Star Princess is registered in Bermuda. An official with Bermuda's Department of Maritime Administration says his office is in contact with Princess about the incident but hasn't determined yet whether it will conduct a full investigation. http://tinyurl.com/cna2eef - - - The ship's captain called corporate and no doubt was told that stopping to help would eat into the profits... === That bit of fantasy no doubt dovetails nicely with your personal anti-corporation sentiments. Have you considered trying to get a job with Fidel Castro, the last of the true communists? I'm sure that you and he would see eye-to-eye on a lot of different issues. More likely the captain, almost certainly a non-US citizen, made the decision on his own, and will now find himself in deep doo doo. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/12 11:15 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 07:54:56 -0400, X ` Man wrote: It was international news recently when a small fishing boat was found adrift in the Atlantic Ocean, several hundred miles from the Panama town where it launched. After 28 days at sea, only one of the three men who had been onboard was still alive. The other two died from lack of water and exposure. Now there are allegations that weeks earlier, while all of the men were still alive, an American-based cruise ship, the Star Princess, spotted the drifting boat — but sailed on without stopping to help. The Star Princess is a luxury cruise ship operated by Carnival. It has four pools, a nine-hole putting green, a casino, and cabins for some 2,000 passengers. In March, on a cruise around South America, the passengers included three bird-watchers, two from Oregon and one from Ireland. They were on deck daily to watch for seabirds, using powerful binoculars and spotting telescopes. On March 10, one of the birders, Jeff Gilligan from Portland, Ore., saw something through his binoculars out on the water, more than a mile away. "We put our scopes on it," he says, "and we could see a moderate-sized boat with a person standing up in it, waving a dark piece of cloth." Telling The Ship's Crew One of the other birders on the Star Princess was Judy Meredith from Bend, Ore. She says, "We all watched him for a bit and thought, 'This guy's in distress. He's trying to get our attention. And he doesn't have a motor on his boat.' We could see that." Meredith went inside to try to place a call to the ship's bridge, to alert the crew about what they'd seen. The only crew member she could find was with the ship's sales team. "He called the bridge and I sort of talked through the story," she says. "And I was trying to have a sense or urgency in my voice — and tell them that the boat was in distress, and they were trying to get our attention." A crew member used Gilligan's telescope to look at the drifting boat. Gilligan says, at that point, "We were a bit relieved because he had confirmed that he had seen what we were describing. We expected the ship to turn back or stop or something." But soon, the bird-watchers realized that wasn't happening. Gilligan says he and the other birders could only hope that the captain of the Star Princess was taking the appropriate steps — perhaps contacting Panamanian or other authorities, who would conduct search-and-rescue operations. Meredith says they never heard back from the crew. In desperation, she marked down the ship's coordinates and sent an email to a Coast Guard website, without results. The Captain's Log When she got home, Meredith contacted Princess Cruises to see what action was taken. She says a customer relations representative told her the captain reported a different version of the incident — and that according to the captain's log, the ship had been passing through a fishing fleet. Meredith says she was told that the Star Princess contacted the boat and "that they were asking the ship to move to the west, because they didn't want their nets to be damaged. And that the ship altered course. And they were waving their shirts because they were thanking the ship." Eventually, the bird-watchers learned of a news story from Ecuador. The Ecuadorean coast guard had picked up a small fishing boat near the Galapagos Islands with just one survivor aboard: 18-year-old Adrian Vasquez. YouTube Vasquez told a harrowing tale of leaving Panama for an overnight fishing trip, then losing power and spending the next 28 days drifting. During that time, the two other fishermen with Vasquez died. It seemed improbable, but Meredith and the other bird-watchers wondered, "Could this be the boat they saw?" In Panama, reporter Don Winner with the website Panama-Guide.com tracked down Vasquez and recorded video of the interview. Winner showed Vasquez a photo the birders had taken of the fishing boat they saw. "That's us," Vasquez said. He and the other men used their orange flotation devices to try to signal to get someone's attention, he said. Winner asked him about the Princess Star. "Yes, we saw a cruise ship," Vasquez said. He said one of the other fishermen, Oropeces Betancourt, 24, died the following day. The third fisherman, Fernando Osario, 16, died five days later. 'Three People Were Alive' International maritime law clearly requires ships that come upon other vessels in distress to render assistance, if they can do so without endangering themselves. In a statement, Princess Cruises says, "We're aware of the allegations that Star Princess supposedly passed by a boat in distress that was carrying three Panamanian fishermen on March 10. At this time we cannot verify the facts as reported, and we are currently conducting an internal investigation on the matter." Princess isn't commenting on the earlier version of the story Meredith says she got from a company customer services representative. Meredith says the experience has left her feeling sick about what Vasquez, his friends and their families had to go through. "Three people were alive on the day they saw us and the day we saw them," she says. "They tried everything they could think of to signal us. And our boat went by, and his buddy died that night." The Star Princess is registered in Bermuda. An official with Bermuda's Department of Maritime Administration says his office is in contact with Princess about the incident but hasn't determined yet whether it will conduct a full investigation. http://tinyurl.com/cna2eef - - - The ship's captain called corporate and no doubt was told that stopping to help would eat into the profits... === That bit of fantasy no doubt dovetails nicely with your personal anti-corporation sentiments. Have you considered trying to get a job with Fidel Castro, the last of the true communists? I'm sure that you and he would see eye-to-eye on a lot of different issues. More likely the captain, almost certainly a non-US citizen, made the decision on his own, and will now find himself in deep doo doo. Being opposed to the way corporations have ruined this country does not make me a fan of the Castro brothers. In their own way, they are the corporationists of Cuba. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/2012 11:15 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 07:54:56 -0400, X ` Man wrote: It was international news recently when a small fishing boat was found adrift in the Atlantic Ocean, several hundred miles from the Panama town where it launched. After 28 days at sea, only one of the three men who had been onboard was still alive. The other two died from lack of water and exposure. Now there are allegations that weeks earlier, while all of the men were still alive, an American-based cruise ship, the Star Princess, spotted the drifting boat — but sailed on without stopping to help. The Star Princess is a luxury cruise ship operated by Carnival. It has four pools, a nine-hole putting green, a casino, and cabins for some 2,000 passengers. In March, on a cruise around South America, the passengers included three bird-watchers, two from Oregon and one from Ireland. They were on deck daily to watch for seabirds, using powerful binoculars and spotting telescopes. On March 10, one of the birders, Jeff Gilligan from Portland, Ore., saw something through his binoculars out on the water, more than a mile away. "We put our scopes on it," he says, "and we could see a moderate-sized boat with a person standing up in it, waving a dark piece of cloth." Telling The Ship's Crew One of the other birders on the Star Princess was Judy Meredith from Bend, Ore. She says, "We all watched him for a bit and thought, 'This guy's in distress. He's trying to get our attention. And he doesn't have a motor on his boat.' We could see that." Meredith went inside to try to place a call to the ship's bridge, to alert the crew about what they'd seen. The only crew member she could find was with the ship's sales team. "He called the bridge and I sort of talked through the story," she says. "And I was trying to have a sense or urgency in my voice — and tell them that the boat was in distress, and they were trying to get our attention." A crew member used Gilligan's telescope to look at the drifting boat. Gilligan says, at that point, "We were a bit relieved because he had confirmed that he had seen what we were describing. We expected the ship to turn back or stop or something." But soon, the bird-watchers realized that wasn't happening. Gilligan says he and the other birders could only hope that the captain of the Star Princess was taking the appropriate steps — perhaps contacting Panamanian or other authorities, who would conduct search-and-rescue operations. Meredith says they never heard back from the crew. In desperation, she marked down the ship's coordinates and sent an email to a Coast Guard website, without results. The Captain's Log When she got home, Meredith contacted Princess Cruises to see what action was taken. She says a customer relations representative told her the captain reported a different version of the incident — and that according to the captain's log, the ship had been passing through a fishing fleet. Meredith says she was told that the Star Princess contacted the boat and "that they were asking the ship to move to the west, because they didn't want their nets to be damaged. And that the ship altered course. And they were waving their shirts because they were thanking the ship." Eventually, the bird-watchers learned of a news story from Ecuador. The Ecuadorean coast guard had picked up a small fishing boat near the Galapagos Islands with just one survivor aboard: 18-year-old Adrian Vasquez. YouTube Vasquez told a harrowing tale of leaving Panama for an overnight fishing trip, then losing power and spending the next 28 days drifting. During that time, the two other fishermen with Vasquez died. It seemed improbable, but Meredith and the other bird-watchers wondered, "Could this be the boat they saw?" In Panama, reporter Don Winner with the website Panama-Guide.com tracked down Vasquez and recorded video of the interview. Winner showed Vasquez a photo the birders had taken of the fishing boat they saw. "That's us," Vasquez said. He and the other men used their orange flotation devices to try to signal to get someone's attention, he said. Winner asked him about the Princess Star. "Yes, we saw a cruise ship," Vasquez said. He said one of the other fishermen, Oropeces Betancourt, 24, died the following day. The third fisherman, Fernando Osario, 16, died five days later. 'Three People Were Alive' International maritime law clearly requires ships that come upon other vessels in distress to render assistance, if they can do so without endangering themselves. In a statement, Princess Cruises says, "We're aware of the allegations that Star Princess supposedly passed by a boat in distress that was carrying three Panamanian fishermen on March 10. At this time we cannot verify the facts as reported, and we are currently conducting an internal investigation on the matter." Princess isn't commenting on the earlier version of the story Meredith says she got from a company customer services representative. Meredith says the experience has left her feeling sick about what Vasquez, his friends and their families had to go through. "Three people were alive on the day they saw us and the day we saw them," she says. "They tried everything they could think of to signal us. And our boat went by, and his buddy died that night." The Star Princess is registered in Bermuda. An official with Bermuda's Department of Maritime Administration says his office is in contact with Princess about the incident but hasn't determined yet whether it will conduct a full investigation. http://tinyurl.com/cna2eef - - - The ship's captain called corporate and no doubt was told that stopping to help would eat into the profits... === That bit of fantasy no doubt dovetails nicely with your personal anti-corporation sentiments. Have you considered trying to get a job with Fidel Castro, the last of the true communists? I'm sure that you and he would see eye-to-eye on a lot of different issues. More likely the captain, almost certainly a non-US citizen, made the decision on his own, and will now find himself in deep doo doo. Under the Bermuda flag. Not US as Krause stated. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:18:46 -0400, X ` Man
wrote: Being opposed to the way corporations have ruined this country does not make me a fan of the Castro brothers. In their own way, they are the corporationists of Cuba. === Who says the country has been ruined? That may happen yet because of your free spending, money printing partners in the executive branch but meanwhile free enterprise seems to be alive and well. Free enterprise is what made this country great in the first place and it will ultimately be free enterprise that bails us out of our current slump. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/12 11:46 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:18:46 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Being opposed to the way corporations have ruined this country does not make me a fan of the Castro brothers. In their own way, they are the corporationists of Cuba. === Who says the country has been ruined? That may happen yet because of your free spending, money printing partners in the executive branch but meanwhile free enterprise seems to be alive and well. Free enterprise is what made this country great in the first place and it will ultimately be free enterprise that bails us out of our current slump. snerk "Free enterprise" as it has devolved since the Reaqan Administration has no interest in rebuilding the middle class and without a middle class this country has no future. How is "free enterprise" going to bail us out, Wayne? By getting rid of the minimum wage, worker safety regulations, environmental regulations, medicare? And then what? Serfdom for all but the super rich? That sort of economy and country deserve to go down the drain. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:54:18 -0400, X ` Man
wrote: On 4/19/12 11:46 AM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:18:46 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Being opposed to the way corporations have ruined this country does not make me a fan of the Castro brothers. In their own way, they are the corporationists of Cuba. === Who says the country has been ruined? That may happen yet because of your free spending, money printing partners in the executive branch but meanwhile free enterprise seems to be alive and well. Free enterprise is what made this country great in the first place and it will ultimately be free enterprise that bails us out of our current slump. snerk "Free enterprise" as it has devolved since the Reaqan Administration has no interest in rebuilding the middle class and without a middle class this country has no future. How is "free enterprise" going to bail us out, Wayne? By getting rid of the minimum wage, worker safety regulations, environmental regulations, medicare? And then what? Serfdom for all but the super rich? That sort of economy and country deserve to go down the drain. ==== Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/12 1:48 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:54:18 -0400, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 11:46 AM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:18:46 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Being opposed to the way corporations have ruined this country does not make me a fan of the Castro brothers. In their own way, they are the corporationists of Cuba. === Who says the country has been ruined? That may happen yet because of your free spending, money printing partners in the executive branch but meanwhile free enterprise seems to be alive and well. Free enterprise is what made this country great in the first place and it will ultimately be free enterprise that bails us out of our current slump. snerk "Free enterprise" as it has devolved since the Reaqan Administration has no interest in rebuilding the middle class and without a middle class this country has no future. How is "free enterprise" going to bail us out, Wayne? By getting rid of the minimum wage, worker safety regulations, environmental regulations, medicare? And then what? Serfdom for all but the super rich? That sort of economy and country deserve to go down the drain. ==== Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man
wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? He probably has a problem with union social workers making $150 K plus benefits. Its the unions who got too greedy, that caused all the labor problems. Corporations had to move their labor resources offshore to protect their chances for survival. The unions played a huge part in demise of American capitalism. Greed got the best of you Krauses, evidenced by your lifestyle of excesses. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/2012 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... More money in most cases. Nothing would please me more than to see Krause's union retirement package go tits up. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. Unlike either of you, I worked in manufacturing and assembly factories. These were jobs I held during summer breaks while I was a college student. I worked as a truck loader for Shick Razor and also drove a forklift, was trained and worked as a welder at a boiler factory, and worked loading trucks at a brewery. At the razor factory, there were many very highly skilled workers running all sorts of machines. They were paid a lot more than us warehouse grunts, but I was glad for the work. Same at the boiler factory...my job mostly had to do with cleaning out boilers returned to the factory for refurbishing, and there were welders there far more skilled than I was, and they were paid more. But even the lowest of workers who work hard in a factory are entitled to earn a decent living wage and have benefits sufficient for decent life. Wayne would deny them that so he can live a bit higher off the hog on his dividends. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/2012 5:10 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. Unlike either of you, I worked in manufacturing and assembly factories. These were jobs I held during summer breaks while I was a college student. I worked as a truck loader for Shick Razor and also drove a forklift, was trained and worked as a welder at a boiler factory, and worked loading trucks at a brewery. At the razor factory, there were many very highly skilled workers running all sorts of machines. They were paid a lot more than us warehouse grunts, but I was glad for the work. Same at the boiler factory...my job mostly had to do with cleaning out boilers returned to the factory for refurbishing, and there were welders there far more skilled than I was, and they were paid more. But even the lowest of workers who work hard in a factory are entitled to earn a decent living wage and have benefits sufficient for decent life. Wayne would deny them that so he can live a bit higher off the hog on his dividends. What's wrong with Wayne living a tad higher off the hog than a lug-nut turner? I'm sure you expect to do a little better, don't you? |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy.. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
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Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
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Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/2012 9:36 PM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? Ok, so you are a liar, and a stooge... You live in your ****ing sisters basement, hiding from all the people you have ****ed off in your miserable life... snerk |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/12 9:54 PM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/19/2012 9:36 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? Ok, so you are a liar, and a stooge... You live in your ****ing sisters basement, hiding from all the people you have ****ed off in your miserable life... snerk Your grapes are bright green and exceeding sour, little toad. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 16:32:56 -0400, X ` Man
wrote: You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? === Not at all, been there done that, just like you. The problems start when unskilled assembly line workers begin to think that they are entitled to the same compensation and benefits as skilled tradesmen such as machinists, welders and electricians, not to mention professionals like teachers and nurses. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/19/12 10:50 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 16:32:56 -0400, X ` Man wrote: You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? === Not at all, been there done that, just like you. The problems start when unskilled assembly line workers begin to think that they are entitled to the same compensation and benefits as skilled tradesmen such as machinists, welders and electricians, not to mention professionals like teachers and nurses. Perhaps the answer is that we grossly underpay skilled tradesmen and professionals such as teachers and nurses. We certainly overpay most executives at larger corporations; the ratios between top execs and line workers are obscene. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
|
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
|
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/2012 6:39 AM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/19/12 10:50 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 16:32:56 -0400, X ` Man wrote: You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? === Not at all, been there done that, just like you. The problems start when unskilled assembly line workers begin to think that they are entitled to the same compensation and benefits as skilled tradesmen such as machinists, welders and electricians, not to mention professionals like teachers and nurses. Perhaps the answer is that we grossly underpay skilled tradesmen and professionals such as teachers and nurses. We certainly overpay most executives at larger corporations; the ratios between top execs and line workers are obscene. Maybe you should bend Dr3Xs boss ear and tell him that her salary is outrageous for a common social worker. I'm sure she wouldn't mind taking a $100k pay cut for the good of the skilled brick stackers. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/12 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. The operative word is "managed," doofus. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/2012 8:57 AM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/20/12 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. The operative word is "managed," doofus. OK. You managed to heap a bunch of self praise upon yourself. Is that better? |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote:
On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. Your grapes are exceedingly sour, little toady. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/2012 9:25 AM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. Your grapes are exceedingly sour, little toady. Is this your new talking point? As if I would be jealous of a fat, miserable old stooge like you.. Trust me harry, nobody here wants to be anything like you, or have to lie about all their phony accomplishments like you while hiding in your sisters basement... |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/2012 9:27 AM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? You don't know ****. What are your accomplishments, being ****ed by your drunken father, forcing yourself on little girls and boys, hiding in your basement, and spending your inheritance??? |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/12 9:40 AM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/20/2012 9:27 AM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? You don't know ****. What are your accomplishments, being ****ed by your drunken father, forcing yourself on little girls and boys, hiding in your basement, and spending your inheritance??? Actually, no, little toady. None of your "fantasies" about me have any connection to reality. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/2012 9:27 AM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? And your kids ran from home as soon as they reached the age of majority, to avoid the abuse.. I did see one pic you posted a couple years back of your young grandchild painted like a ****ing whore. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/2012 9:44 AM, X ` Man wrote:
On 4/20/12 9:40 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 9:27 AM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? You don't know ****. What are your accomplishments, being ****ed by your drunken father, forcing yourself on little girls and boys, hiding in your basement, and spending your inheritance??? Actually, no, little toady. None of your "fantasies" about me have any connection to reality. Sorry stooge, everyone here has heard your fantasies for years, fantasies about little boys and girls seem to dominate your pedophile lifestyle.... |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
In article , says...
On 4/20/2012 9:27 AM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? You don't know ****. What are your accomplishments, being ****ed by your drunken father, forcing yourself on little girls and boys, hiding in your basement, and spending your inheritance??? And he goes insane is 3......2......1..... |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/12 9:44 AM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/20/2012 9:27 AM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? And your kids ran from home as soon as they reached the age of majority, to avoid the abuse.. I did see one pic you posted a couple years back of your young grandchild painted like a ****ing whore. Wrong again, little toady. Your fantasies must be about your family members. |
Would stopping to help have eaten into profits?
On 4/20/12 9:47 AM, JustWait wrote:
On 4/20/2012 9:44 AM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/20/12 9:40 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 9:27 AM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/20/12 9:14 AM, JustWait wrote: On 4/20/2012 7:28 AM, Happy John wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 21:36:56 -0400, X ` wrote: On 4/19/12 9:25 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 9:24 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 8:39 PM, wrote: On Thursday, April 19, 2012 5:10:05 PM UTC-4, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:56 PM, JustWait wrote: On 4/19/2012 4:32 PM, X ` Man wrote: On 4/19/12 4:23 PM, Wayne.B wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:50:37 -0400, X ` Man wrote: Can we infer that you'd prefer an economy of unionized, make work, government employees who make a living by taxing each other? Without free enterprise you'd have no incentive for innovation or efficiency. The former Soviet Union found that out the hard way. No, Wayne, you cannot infer that, and I'm not advocating Sov-style communism. I am in favor of steps that help rebuild the middle class in this country, though. I see no point in a country that exists only to enrich the rich. ==== When you talk about rebuilding the middle class, are you really refering to the unionized working class? Frankly I'd like to think that the days of $80/hour unskilled assembly line workers are over. I am referring to the jobs that provide goodm family supporting wages to working Americans, with either company or government paid health care, retirement, vacation and similar benefits, because the concept of buying those benefits on your own with today's wages and livings costs is pretty much shot. In fact, in today's greed-driven, corporate-dominated America, those sorts of jobs are pretty much shot. And without those jobs, there really is no point to this country, is there? A country that benefits only the rich isn't a country worth having. You really have it in for working class Americans, don't you, Wayne? No, he has it in for folks who never went to school, never got a skill, making the same money as a trained and schooled engineer... Obviously, neither you nor Wayne have spent much time in manufacturing plants where "products" are turned out. Yes, there are some really low-skilled jobs, but most of the workers on the assembly line or in factories have a lot more in the way of factory/assembly/manufacturing skills than either you or Wayne. I have spent time there, and know something about it. For example, UAW assembly line workers perform low skilled, repetitious jobs that you could train a monkey to do. But have huge compensation packages that very few enjoy. You really can't defend that. Everybody wants the PS3 with a big screen, Suburban in the driveway, all the premium channels on cable with PPV football on the weekends, take the 3 kids to Vegas and Disney twice a year, and all on a C average high school education. The middle class union-driven greed took down middle class in American. You're an ignorant class warrior as well as a racist. What a surprise. you are a stooge... Whatever you think I am, little toad, I have managed my life fairly well. I managed to get a decent education, managed to get and hold decent jobs, managed to get my kids through higher ed, managed to obtain and hold onto health insurance, managed to run a profitable business for several decades without engaging in intellectual property theft, managed to set up and maintain a good retirement, managed to help my wife through graduate school and a doctoral program, and managed to put away some bucks for a rainy day. If memory serves, you haven't managed so well. Do you think your failures have anything to do with your "stoogeship" on Fox News? And...you were the first person here to say, "Self-praise sucks." Good job, Harry. Bull**** stories suck even more.. But harry is the king.. What are your accomplishments? No career, no job, a hippie daughter and another who for whatever reasons, probably not of her making, isn't winning the races you need to get real $ponsorShip so you can live off that? You don't know ****. What are your accomplishments, being ****ed by your drunken father, forcing yourself on little girls and boys, hiding in your basement, and spending your inheritance??? Actually, no, little toady. None of your "fantasies" about me have any connection to reality. Sorry stooge, everyone here has heard your fantasies for years, fantasies about little boys and girls seem to dominate your pedophile lifestyle.... There is a guy here who spent a lot of time on the weekends in a tent with an underaged girl. Forgot his handle...do you recall it? |
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