Yeah Harry. Typical. Only bayliner uses an I/O, Radar Arch, and "RV
decorated interior" on a 28 foot boat.

It's typical alright. Typical Harry Krause.




Bayliner has a 28' cruiser, the 288 model, that isn't a bad-looking
boat, and, in fact, I took a look at one a couple of years ago.
But...typical of Bayliner, it had some serious shortcomings, starting
with a much-too-small fuel tank and an I/O drive instead of an inboard
or at least a vee-drive. And the interior was decorated like an RV.
Without the idiotic radar arch, though, it is an attractive, traditional
cruiser, suitable for the Bay or the ICW. But it is a bit overpriced for
what it is.

Wally, your right. I think it's just cabin fever as I haven't taken my
boat out for three weeks!

With the NWS predicting rainy weather all day saturday and sunday, I
didn't make plans except to go out on sandusky bay with my friends M26
sailboat on saturday. Talk about lively sailing! Wanted to go to PIB
or Kellys but the dog was at home and, and even if my girlfriend could
get in to pick her up, she wouldn't have gotten to Sandusky until
6;30pm. A littel late for making a fall trip, even if it's just to
Kellys. So I checked the Chris and the Trophy, and went home.

Where are you on Huron? I typically overnight 2-3 times a year at the
HBB, especially during their outdoor concerts! If you looking for a
nice trip, but don't want to go to PIB or Kellys, try the Lyman Harbor
Marina. They also have concerts in the summer, and now allow
overnighting.

If you're ever at Kellys, PIB, or the Basin, and you see a guy with a
Norwegian Elkhound, it's probably me. Stop by and say hey!


On Fri, 03 Oct 2003 17:33:24 -0400, (Bob
D.) wrote:

I am BY NO MEANS the most experienced boater out there, nor do I profess
to be. I do feel I have a *pretty good* handle on things within this
realm. This make me your worst nightmare, Mr Krause, as I usually know
when someone is talking out their ass, and passing it off as knowledge.

Hope this helps,

Bob Dimond

Bob, settle down. Why the hell do you care about one bitter, half-baked
quasi-boater's opinion?

Who cares? Enjoy your Bayliner.
Send him a picture of the Lorain light and maybe you can be his web
friend if it means that much to you.

If it's your boat, it floats and you like it, it's a good boat.

While I don't know enough about boat brands models, on a boat by boat
basis, I'd agree, there are lots of crappy boats. However you *do*
infer that Bayliner is the only crappy boat by your actions.

I make no such inference.



I stand behind my opinion of your actions to date. If infereernce is
improper, I'll be glad to use the term imply


I've have not been in rec.boats since its inception, but I have been
here
awhile. I have yet to see a smart ass comment directed at any other
brand
of boat, otherwise I would give your statements better consideration.
If
you think Bayliner is not alone in building a poor boat, then that the
ONE
thing you managed to keep to yourself, since I've been reading.

I've criticized any number of boat brands for any number of reasons.


Two things about you last statement seem false. One, you've criticized
another brand of boat. Two, you gave reasons.

:^)

Wayne.B wrote in message . ..

On 4 Oct 2003 08:51:24 -0700, (Scott McFadden)
wrote:

"Let me tell you, those are NOT ocean swells"

========================================

It's kind of fun to fly down east coast on a clear day in the fall.

You can sometimes see the inlets breaking from 35,000 feet up.

Alot more fun than trying to get through one.

Here is a shot of Mantanzas (S of St Aug) with +6' breakers guarding
the mouth.

http://www.co.st-johns.fl.us/bcc/pub...ages/inlet.jpg

Mantanzas means "massarce" in Spanish and that might happen to you to
if you're dumb enough mess with her on a bad day.
--
SJM

I don't think your old Bayliner is better, nor would I head out in six
to eight foot waves in my 36' boat, and it is built to take that kind of
stuff. What I think is that you are no brighter than another Bayliner
owner who used to post here and who claimed he took on 30' waves in his
22' Bayliner

Harry, are you that dense to banter back and forth for so long, yet miss
the point of this entire argument? You repeatedly have implied or
directly said that all Bayliners are crap. (You can dispute the
implication all you want, but anyone who will do a google search with
the keywords "Harry Krause Bayliner Wellcraft Chris-Craft Sea Ray" will
have far more negative comments than positive comments, with the vast
majority of those comments directed at Bayliner, affirming you bigoted
actions) I have repeatedly told you I take exception to these comments
you and others so quickly hand out as a mattter of fact.

Anyone with a third grade reading comprehension, would have seen that
I've NEVER argued nor implied that Baylinere are better. I'm not
even saying that Bayliners are as good as any other boat.

My unwavering point is how can ALL bayliners be so bad as to be
deserving of your, and others negative comments, above any other brand?

It is understandable if someone asks what "boat will handle a x
circumstance", merits the reply: "If your taking a boat out in those
circumstances, don't get a Bayliner because (state specific reason)." Of
course this is provided Bayliner tend the only boat with that
shortcomming under those circumstances.

However, you Mr. Krause, among others, are more inclined to answer a
question like "I just bought a new Bayliner besides the mandated USCG
equipment, what other stuff should i get" The most common reply would
be something along the lines of: "A new boat.", a smart ass comment
based solely on the word Bayliner. Not your words per se, but your
general behavior to be sure.

The repeated and unprovoked bashing of the Bayliner name, by yourself
and others, whenever it comes up in this group implies that all Bayliner
are crap no matter what environment there in and no mattter what boat
they are compared to. This begs the question: How can these
Bayliner implications be true if I and others have been able to
repeatedly depended on our Bayliners in rough conditions, refutting them?

I not asking you to change you mind, Harry. I'm simply asking you and
others to open you mind, and take these experiences, which run
contrary to you opinions and experiences into consideration before
dismissing the Bayliner brand is such absolute terms. Bayliners are
not as bad and hated as you make them out to be, no matter how bad you
think they are or how much you dislike them.

Last, if we accept the implication of your statement that I'm a dim
wit, what does the fact that you continously throw negative and
unsubstanciated comments out as fact say about you? What does it say
about you when you have to change the subject, and argue pointless
minutia by taking one sentence out of context within the entire
argument, missing the point of the entire argument with someone you
imply is your subordinate?

I think I need to follow some good advice, end this thread, and get on
with my life. Feel free to take the last word, and live in the delusion
of your absolutism.

Take Care,

Bob Dimond

BOB wrote:

Yeah Harry. Typical. Only bayliner uses an I/O, Radar Arch, and "RV
decorated interior" on a 28 foot boat.

It's typical alright. Typical Harry Krause.




Bayliner has a 28' cruiser, the 288 model, that isn't a bad-looking
boat, and, in fact, I took a look at one a couple of years ago.
But...typical of Bayliner, it had some serious shortcomings, starting
with a much-too-small fuel tank and an I/O drive instead of an inboard
or at least a vee-drive. And the interior was decorated like an RV.
Without the idiotic radar arch, though, it is an attractive, traditional
cruiser, suitable for the Bay or the ICW. But it is a bit overpriced for
what it is.


Well, Bob, I use my criteria in selection boats, not yours. I don't like
I/O drives, especially in salt water environments; I don't like ugly
radar arches, and I don't like boats decorated so that they look like
RVs. I also like believe a 28' boat should have a larger fuel tank than
what Bayliner offers on that model.

Obviously, your tastes are different.





--
* * *
email sent to will *never* get to me.

BOB wrote:



While I don't know enough about boat brands models, on a boat by boat
basis, I'd agree, there are lots of crappy boats. However you *do*
infer that Bayliner is the only crappy boat by your actions.

I make no such inference.



I stand behind my opinion of your actions to date. If infereernce is
improper, I'll be glad to use the term imply

Sorry, but I've never implied Bayliners were the only crappy boats.



I've have not been in rec.boats since its inception, but I have been
here
awhile. I have yet to see a smart ass comment directed at any other
brand
of boat, otherwise I would give your statements better consideration.
If
you think Bayliner is not alone in building a poor boat, then that the
ONE
thing you managed to keep to yourself, since I've been reading.

I've criticized any number of boat brands for any number of reasons.


Two things about you last statement seem false. One, you've criticized
another brand of boat. Two, you gave reasons.

:^)

Well, it appears you have no more knowledge of posts in rec.boats than
you do about of safe boating.

--
* * *
email sent to will *never* get to me.

Scott McFadden wrote:

Wayne.B wrote in message . ..

On 4 Oct 2003 08:51:24 -0700, (Scott McFadden)
wrote:

"Let me tell you, those are NOT ocean swells"

========================================

It's kind of fun to fly down east coast on a clear day in the fall.

You can sometimes see the inlets breaking from 35,000 feet up.

Alot more fun than trying to get through one.

Here is a shot of Mantanzas (S of St Aug) with +6' breakers guarding
the mouth.

http://www.co.st-johns.fl.us/bcc/pub...ages/inlet.jpg

Mantanzas means "massarce" in Spanish and that might happen to you to
if you're dumb enough mess with her on a bad day.
--
SJM


My favorite inlet - really. Used to run it at least once a week, just
for the joy of it, and because the fishing right at the bridge - on both
sides - is usually damned good. I've caught tarpon right there...



--
* * *
email sent to will *never* get to me.

BOB wrote:


I don't think your old Bayliner is better, nor would I head out in six
to eight foot waves in my 36' boat, and it is built to take that kind of
stuff. What I think is that you are no brighter than another Bayliner
owner who used to post here and who claimed he took on 30' waves in his
22' Bayliner

Harry, are you that dense to banter back and forth for so long, yet miss
the point of this entire argument? You repeatedly have implied or
directly said that all Bayliners are crap.

No, I have not. I don't recall ever saying or implying that. I think
Bayliners are perfectly suitable for protected waters, such as, for
example, Chesapeake Bay, where I do a lot of boating. But I wouldn't go
out in the ocean out of sight of shore in one, nor would I run any of my
favorite (and by that I mean treacherous) ocean inlets in a Bayliner,
any Bayliner.


(You can dispute the
implication all you want, but anyone who will do a google search with
the keywords "Harry Krause Bayliner Wellcraft Chris-Craft Sea Ray" will
have far more negative comments than positive comments, with the vast
majority of those comments directed at Bayliner, affirming you bigoted
actions)

Which means squat, Bob. Really.


I have repeatedly told you I take exception to these comments
you and others so quickly hand out as a mattter of fact.

Take all the exception you want, Bob. Makes no difference to me.


However, you Mr. Krause, among others, are more inclined to answer a
question like "I just bought a new Bayliner besides the mandated USCG
equipment, what other stuff should i get" The most common reply would
be something along the lines of: "A new boat.", a smart ass comment
based solely on the word Bayliner. Not your words per se, but your
general behavior to be sure.


Hey, Bob...you are entitled to your opinion, no matter how far from
reality it is. Go for it, eh?


The repeated and unprovoked bashing of the Bayliner name, by yourself
and others, whenever it comes up in this group implies that all Bayliner
are crap no matter what environment there in and no mattter what boat
they are compared to. This begs the question: How can these
Bayliner implications be true if I and others have been able to
repeatedly depended on our Bayliners in rough conditions, refutting them?

You've disputed, Bob; you haven't refuted. Look up the words.

What does it say
about you when you have to change the subject, and argue pointless
minutia by taking one sentence out of context within the entire
argument, missing the point of the entire argument with someone you
imply is your subordinate?


Beauty is in the details, Bob, no matter how minute.



I think I need to follow some good advice, end this thread, and get on
with my life. Feel free to take the last word, and live in the delusion
of your absolutism.


I'd be glad to grant you absolution, Bob, but I can't find my robe.




* * *
email sent to will *never* get to me.

Sorry, just one more.

Hey Spanky " I'm impartial, and don't just categorically hate Bayliners"
Krause:

Where or how in my four sentences, did I refute your selection criteria?

What I did do was point out what runs contrary to what you've repeatedly
try to tell me, that is, to quote you directly:

"I've never implied Bayliners were the only crappy boats."

You've just proven my point about your unfounded bigotry. Brands A-Z
CAN, AND DO the same thing the same way. Radar Arch, Gas Tank,
Interior, and I/O. The shortcommings you address as:

"typical of Bayliner

are in fact typical in the entire marine industry. But only Bayliner
gets maligned by you.

No only do you miss the point in trying to comprehend my posts. It's
obvious you don't even comprehend what YOU POST.

If you did, you would not dispute what I've been saying ALL THIS TIME
that you unfairly single out bayliners, for you derrogatory comments.

(shaking his head) WOW...





BOB wrote:

Yeah Harry. Typical. Only bayliner uses an I/O, Radar Arch, and "RV
decorated interior" on a 28 foot boat.

It's typical alright. Typical Harry Krause.




Bayliner has a 28' cruiser, the 288 model, that isn't a bad-looking
boat, and, in fact, I took a look at one a couple of years ago.
But...typical of Bayliner, it had some serious shortcomings, starting
with a much-too-small fuel tank and an I/O drive instead of an
inboard
or at least a vee-drive. And the interior was decorated like an RV.
Without the idiotic radar arch, though, it is an attractive,
traditional
cruiser, suitable for the Bay or the ICW. But it is a bit overpriced
for
what it is.


Well, Bob, I use my criteria in selection boats, not yours. I don't like
I/O drives, especially in salt water environments; I don't like ugly
radar arches, and I don't like boats decorated so that they look like
RVs. I also like believe a 28' boat should have a larger fuel tank than
what Bayliner offers on that model.

Obviously, your tastes are different.