riverman wrote:

European rivers, OTThirdH, are a mix of the two. The mountains are very old
and worn down, like the Appalacians, however they are very wide and can
support large rivers. The european steep creeks (like the ones in Slovenia)
are similar to the Eastern US rivers in nature, but because of the
dependable drainage of the Alps, they run more consistently and carry a lot
more debris through their drainout. However, because of the intermittent
nature of big floods, the rocks are sharp, poorly sorted, and the river bed
is relatively immature. So you end up with an eastern-style rocky creek,
that runs a western-style length before it changes its nature.

Funny that you use the Slovenian creeks as an example, I spent almost
two weeks at the end of August paddling there. Then again, having come
used to the difficulty levels of those stretches, because I ran them
more than a dozen times this year, I also find that I tend to lessen the
perceived difficulty in my mind. That makes it difficult to rate them
more or less objectively, especially when explaining them to first timers.

I think both eastern and western boaters overrate anything they are
unfamiliar with. Calling Hance in the Grand Canyon a '10' is a joke to any
eastern boater who can navigate rocks. Calling Magic Falls on the Kennebec a
'4-5' is a farce to any western boater who has run the V-wave in Lava. Any
US boater who comes to Europe is going to overrate the rapids, until they
get used to the continuous and rocky nature of them. I think European
boaters see both long runs, and rocky runs, so they might not overrate US
rivers quite so easily.

Then again, there might be such a thing as big water and huge water
(Niagara Gorge, Zambezi). I haven't seen any of them up close, but just
watching the videos gives me an uneasy feeling in my stomach. Again, not
being used to that kind of water influences my perception of the
difficulties involved.

I know here in Kinshasa, I have had so many people tell me how the rapids on
the outskirts of town here are 'Unrunnable' that I want to puke. Its
basically a solid class 5-, with an entrance where you skirt a huge Lava
LedgeHole-sized pourover, run a Hance Lookalike wave train, then catch a
Niagara Whirlpool-sized eddy. I've run stuff this big in rafts a dozen times
with no problem. The stuff downstream is rumored to be worse, but I wonder
if its just continuous instead......

Sounds like you need to get a couple of rafters and their equipment over
there... :-)

--
Wilko van den Bergh
Eindhoven The Netherlands Europe
Look at the possibilities, don't worry about the limitations.
http://wilko.webzone.ru/