On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 11:49:14 -0700, Canuck57
wrote:

On 18/02/2011 10:38 PM, wrote:

That is also the fatal flaw in privatizing Social Security. You could
certainly see big increases in apparent value but that would fall off
pretty fast as soon as you cashed it in.
We simply do not have enough money coming into the system to support
the boomers. It doesn't matter it is social security or your 401k. You
still have 2-3 kids supporting each old person.

Most people, a huge majority, probably 80% or more would have been
better off if Social Security was deposited into a non-redeemable IRA.
A huge part of why Social Security is failing is because of government
skimming and bamboozling, not because enough wasn't paid.

For example, government borrows Social Security moneys for literally 6%
below it's real market value. Collected assets don't even track
inflation. By setting interest rates well below real market, they can
borrow SS for nothing. Over time this depreciates the value of SS.

At this point the fraud on SS has indeed already occured. So moving
forward, yep, there isn't enough money coming in. But I read even if
the US government didn't spend one sent on payout of SS, yet still had
the income, total bankruptcy is still inevitable. That is, the debt
problem is so huge that nothing short of a 66% reduction in government
spending will have a chance in hell. Either that or taxes must triple.

USA may very well be past the tipping point into perpetual structural
debt. Hyper-stagflation is inevitable. And with it, no one wants to
invest in a stagnant depreciating economy. If you tried to tripple US
taxation on business, they would leave the US in flocks. Some already are.

Obama has set the stage for USA bankruptcy. I really think the idea is
to accumulate all the debt into the US Fed then declare it bankrupt. At
which oint USD becoems worthless like toilet paper.

Did you know Washington DC creates more new dollars than the US consumes
in sheets of toilet paper?

You seem to care a great deal about what we do as a nation, yet you
have no stake in it. Sounds to me like you're just bored with your
life on the couch.

On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 11:31:26 -0700, Canuck57
wrote:

On 18/02/2011 9:25 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 22:44:30 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 13:29:01 -0800, wrote:

We better get used to questions like this because the whole country
has a "Greece" moment coming. I doubt our protests will be as peaceful
as Egypt or even Greece. It might be more like Warsaw 1944 except the
populace is better armed. ;-)

There's no "Greece" or Egypt "moment" coming. That's a paranoid
fantasy.

I guess you were absent the day they taught arithmetic.

Why don't you find something a little more biting if you're trying to
insult me.

I apologize, that was snarky.

Apology accepted.



Are you denying the deficit is a problem and that the entitlements are
unsustainable?

Never denied it. What I'm denying is that it's a short-term problem.
It's a long-term problem. Obama's recent budget addressed it in the
long term to the tune of $1.1 T (some things I don't agree with, but
that's another story). Of course Sen. Sessions said it didn't go deep
enough, but of course he proposed nearly the exact same deficit
reduction amount a short while ago.

$1.1T is trivial compared to the problem. That barely covers where we
are now and there are only a small fraction of the boomers on the
public dole. If he can't touch the current deficit, how will he handle
the hockey stick that is in the next decade?
I don't think the GOP is really talking about it either.

They're talking about when it suits them. Sessions was talking about
it along with the rest of the right-wing nuts. They would love to gut
all the social programs. I'd say that it's in their DNA, except they
don't believe in science.


That is what brought down the Greek economy

We are not Greece... I know that's an incredible statement for some
people...

No we are not Greece. The world could survive a total collapse of
Greece. When the US gets a cold, the world gets pneumonia.

We are not even close to a "collapse"... guess you didn't hear but the
economy is getting better.

You believe Obama bull****? A record number of people are expected to
lose their homes THIS YEAR. Civic and state debt defaults are skyrocketing.

I believe facts and not racist hyperbole. Bush did this to us. Obama
is trying to fix it.


Infamous last words. They said that after the Titanic hit the iceberg,
we are too big to sink.

Feel free to hide under your blankey.

On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 13:12:29 -0700, Canuck57
wrote:

On 20/02/2011 11:43 AM, wrote:

They said GM was too big to fail. Here is a hint, that was hogwash. US
is NOT too big to fail, and in fact is going through that right now.
Too big to fail instantly, yes, too big to fail - nope.

Sure... throw people out on the street... that's the right-wing
solution to the economy!

Nope, get off your arse, get a job. USA is still a land of opportunity
for the fortunate 4.7% of the worlds population to be born there. Big
problem is many of these liberals are too fat, too mentally lazy,
mentally screwed up with drugs, think too stupid to really amount to much.

But that means you'd have to get a job!


Smart money is leaving the US. Look at the stocks, those with foreign
content are doing better than pure domestic plays. Even Warrent Buffet
knows this.

You're not smart. You left. Therefore, the dumb people are leaving.

Yep, and that is why USA is short on jobs, no investments in a dying
economic model of entitlement and big fat inefficient government.

You're not bright enough to understand, yet you keep talking.

How is that Obama sized debt work'in for ya?

Obama is a debt monger, debt worshiper. And there is no known route to
wealth through excessive unmanageable debt. Iceland tried the very
policy Obama is trying, it failed miserably. Iceland tried this before
too, in 1974 they had 43% inflation. Today, they have high
unemployment, stagnant economy and basic minimum wages.

Look at Japans lost decades.

Look at the racist/birthers... like yourself.

Hahaha, still hiding behind race I see. You just can't admit I and
others like me are just smarter than you.

You're the racist here. You hate Obama. If that's what you call
"smarter" you're as dumb as a post.

UK devalued the pound by 30% once, took the economy more than a decade
to recover.

Fact remains, and no liberalism will ever override reality.... you can't
debt-spend your way out of a debt problem.

In Debt We Trust -- Obama.

That spells economic doom. Might take decades, might take days, but be
sure the future in debt is not bright.

Never invest in a chronic debtor, you lose money that way.

Never could a black man do a good job, apparently.

When invention, I can assure you your skin color never enters the
picture. CAN YOU MAKE ME MONEY or are you just a whiny debt welsher a
begging? Same greed, but I am smart enough and worked hard enough I
don't have to beg for it.

You're the unemployed guy sitting on the couch.

No excuses, plenty of "black" people make plenty of money, it isn't
about color. It is about mojo and attitude.

For you, it's about black people or Hispanics or anyone who doesn't
look or think like you.

On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 13:13:33 -0700, Canuck57
wrote:

On 20/02/2011 11:43 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 11:11:28 -0700,
wrote:

On 18/02/2011 12:11 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 12:26:17 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 09:00:23 -0800, wrote:

You think using a majority to supress the people and
votes of the opposition is fair play?

Oh like the 111th congress? You folks said the republicans should suck
it up and go along. When they didn't you said they were
obstructionists.
Aren't the Wisconsin democrats shutting down the government?
Where is your outrage?
I wonder what their constitution says about legislators who abandon
their jobs? Perhaps the governor can simply replace them. In real
life, I imagine all they have to do is walk through and spit in the
lobby to demonstrate that they are still working.

We are going to be entering uncharted territory though. Nobody really
knows what happens when a state files for bankruptcy. How do they
discharge their debts when they don't have the money and they can't
just print it like the federal government does. Will they try to print
some kind of scrip and see if people would take it? Are they just
going to tell their debtors to sue them?

We better get used to questions like this because the whole country
has a "Greece" moment coming. I doubt our protests will be as peaceful
as Egypt or even Greece. It might be more like Warsaw 1944 except the
populace is better armed. ;-)

There's no "Greece" or Egypt "moment" coming. That's a paranoid
fantasy.

Agreed, it will be at least a generation of poverty.

Agreed, you're an idiot with no business acumen.

Tell that to my accountant.

Tell her yourself. Oh wait, you don't need an accountant, since you're
on the dole.

On 19/02/2011 9:03 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 19 Feb 2011 12:20:45 -0500, John
wrote:

On Sat, 19 Feb 2011 11:12:52 -0600, Boating All wrote:

In ,
says...

And then there is DEA that serves no function at all except to pioneer
new ways to take our rights.
expanded unwarranted searches
surveillance beyond the worst things NSA does
property abuses
Swat raids that kill innocents
etc
... and doing absolutely nothing to stem the flow of drugs

Don't forget prisons to house drug violation offenders.
The "war on drugs" is a huge and expensive disgrace.

Speaking of prisons....

http://urbanlegends.about.com/librar...rrectional.htm

Beautiful, ain't it?

More nonsense BS from a crazy person.

http://www.snopes.com/photos/architecture/prison.asp

Yep, Obama style Club Fed. Just incase Obama gets locked up.

--
Socialism is a great ideal as long as someone else pays for it. And when
no one is left to pay for it, they all can share nothing.

On 20/02/2011 3:36 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 14:53:21 -0700,
wrote:

On 20/02/2011 11:37 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 11:28:20 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 19 Feb 2011 23:01:11 -0800, wrote:

On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 00:17:10 -0500, wrote:



Cutting half of the DoD budget is a good start but if you ignore
SS/Medicare you will never get a handle on the deficit.

The rest may be good symbolism but they are insignificant.

Completely untrue and misleading as usual.

What is untrue? You don't think SS and Medicare are a budget buster in
the out years?

SS/MC are not in trouble right now. They will be if nothing is
changed, but NOT RIGHT NOW.


WTF? Both are paying out more than they take in. In any other business
that is called running at a loss. There is no likely scenario that
will make that get any better. One of the current proposals is to
remove the FICA tax altogether so they do not have to perpetuate this
lie of "insurance" or "an investment". SS/Medicare will just become
welfare. That will make it easier to ration, means test and alter
benefits.

So what. That's a long-term problem not a short term one.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezr...rming_soc.html
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezr...shortfall.html

Social Security reform is about ripping people off that paid far too
much into it. Hey, they got your money now they don't want to pay good
on the promise. DC is welshing in the people, their own people.

Hey, it should be eliminated. But the tax and employers part should be
contributed to an account in the employees name, in the employees
account and under their control, and not able to withdraw until 60 or
so. And withdrawals need to be controlled as not to blow it on drugs
and the like.

This way government skimming and bamboozling can't diminish its value.

Pooling money schemes, be they government SS or defined plans, they are
garbage plans designed to hide the skimming and slight.

In an ideal world, the idea of government pension is a good one. But
the real world, such pooled plans always get the political corruption to
rip people off as money like that attracts liberal leaches and political
parasites bad.

In your name, in your account and in your control. That is where you
want your pension and retirement. Keeps it away from the greedy liberal
spenders.

You're brainless.

Your broke.

--
Socialism is a great ideal as long as someone else pays for it. And when
no one is left to pay for it, they all can share nothing.

On 20/02/2011 3:36 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 12:41:45 -0700,
wrote:

On 19/02/2011 7:09 PM, wrote:

Did you know 74% of Whitehouse staff got a 9% raise last year? Piggies
are having a feast while others suffer.

Cutting half of the DoD budget is a good start but if you ignore
SS/Medicare you will never get a handle on the deficit.

The rest may be good symbolism but they are insignificant.

Agreed. The cuts have to go deep and *no* sacred cows spared. Even
congressional, senate and administration budgets need the big axe.
Duplicated agencies collapsed into one with massively reduced budgets.
What, is there 5 or 7 housing agencies? Why not one that is color
blind? Or why even have a housing agency as states/cities do their own
civic planning?

The cuts will need to be deep to be effective.

But it is also why I am betting they will not do it. Sad to say, US
government bankruptcy is inevitable as I don't believe in politicians
being this "American" to save the country from eventual currency based
bankruptcy. $60 billion is hardly a scratch. Thy need another $1,600
billion. The cuts are not even 5% of what is needed to balance up. A
joke really.

Now if congress refuses the debt/money expansion say for 3 months and DC
government checks bounce to send the message... I will re-assess the
politicians desire to remain solvent.

Until then people need to start thinking of currency as a rapidly
depreciating asset. $1 today is effectively $0.95 next week in
purchasing power.

Fortunately, you have no say in what happens in this great country.

Suits me fine. I realized some time ago I am 1/7,000,000,000 of the
higher order predators on this planet, and by luck being born in North
American and by getting off my arse, I didn't pretty good.

First lesson is you or I are not going to change a damn thing. But how
we work with what is presented to us is key for our own successes.

So how is that Obama sized debt work'in for ya?

--
Socialism is a great ideal as long as someone else pays for it. And when
no one is left to pay for it, they all can share nothing.

On 20/02/2011 3:37 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 12:55:20 -0700,
wrote:

On 19/02/2011 9:05 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 19 Feb 2011 10:23:49 -0700,
wrote:

On 18/02/2011 4:21 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 16:20:04 -0700,
wrote:

On 18/02/2011 9:15 AM, Frogwatch wrote:
On Feb 18, 11:01 am, need wrote:
In , payer3389
@mypacks.net says...



On 2/18/11 10:44 AM, Frogwatch wrote:
The Obamanations are not interested in democracy as shown by what is
happening in Wisconsin. When the other side wins the election, they
engage in an illegal walkout to prevent legislation. Remember "Card
Check" where they tried to deny people the right to vote on
unionization? They have no interest in Democracy, they are interested
in raw power.
Winning the election was not good enough because they do not recognize
who won. When that happens, the next step is..................

...right-wing racist-birthers like you move to another country?

Yes, we know you are trying to clear this group for your 2012 propaganda
run. Remember how each and every Progressive here answered Tim's call
for civility with a defined, NO, NO, NO!?

Here is your story.
Democrats, being thugs...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71gsn...layer_embedded

Here is another "brave" liberal, attacking old women...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVFdaz_VUJE

Here is another advocate of "free speech"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBDqG...1&feature=fvwp

I wonder if our friend Donnie was in this crowd?

http://www.breitbart.tv/hate-rally-p...ca-with-trash-
left-behind/

Oh, did you notice Tim doesn't post here anymore?

The lefties do not recognize elections and routinely attack any
dissent and then blame everyone else. Their own shot Gifford and they
blamed Palin. Lefties eventually always resort to mass murder as
Obama's best friend Bill Ayers said he wanted when he said he wanted
to kill 20 million Americans.

The liberal lefties up here are the same. Irrational zealots of telling
others they will pay for their welfare. Nosy types too.

I think you should move to Yemen immediately. I'm sure they'd welcome
your dislike of gov't.

Have more peaceful places to consider. I wouldn't move to a Muslim
country for any reason.

Don't worry, they won't let you in. Either would Panama or Costa Rica
if they find out what you'd be doing/saying about their gov't.

Funny, I have already been told I more than qualify and the bank already
provided me with the reference I need. Looking at some properties now.
And I didn't say anything bad about Panama or Costa Rica...

When I go out on a boat fishing, I will not think of you. Do have to
bone up on my Spanish though.

Funny... you should leave immediately.

Not for a bit yet. Besides, I already check, I can get Internet down
there to pester you. If we move I will give you a month or two break.
Then rub it in.

--
Socialism is a great ideal as long as someone else pays for it. And when
no one is left to pay for it, they all can share nothing.

On 20/02/2011 3:38 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 20 Feb 2011 12:59:59 -0700,
wrote:

On 20/02/2011 11:38 AM, wrote:

You moved back to Canada because you were thrown out of the US.

And I took my job with me!

You mean your unemployment. Job /= sitting on couch.

No. When I said I needed to return to Canada for personal reasons, they
said I should report to the Canadian office. Never even changed bosses.
Part of the reasons were the Canadian investments needed some
attention I couldn't do in the US, and I could see the US was headed for
the wall.

loonies traded at 1.013 -- I like.

I wouldn't trade a moron for a loonie.

Your not even a moron, so you have nothing to trade.

--
Socialism is a great ideal as long as someone else pays for it. And when
no one is left to pay for it, they all can share nothing.

On Sat, 19 Feb 2011 10:52:35 -0700, Canuck57
wrote:

On 18/02/2011 7:18 PM, bpuharic wrote:
On Fri, 18 Feb 2011 19:43:29 -0500, wrote:


Are you the only fool that thinks government is doing a good job?

and how's wall street doing after sucking 10 trillion out of the
economy in the last 3 years? we back at full employment?

You still do not get it do you?

Government, big governmetn including Obama are not the solution, they
ARE the problem.

no, that reagan cliche is dead. especially since reagan RAISED taxes
to try and balance the budget

if the GOVT was the problem, we wouldnt have had wall street suck 10
TRILLION out of the economy

OTHER countries with MORE regulation did NOT suffer as we did

you right wingers simply have no EVIDENCE for your views. none. you
have MYTH, FAIRY TALES and stories

but no EVIDENCE. that's why liberals are smarter; we rely on evidence

The more government gets, the less the people get.

really? and how we doing in the last 3 years after the MASSIVE
DEREGULATION of wall street? we doing OK?


US Government is BROKE. Bankrupt.

gee. wall street just caused a meltdown of the economy. put millions
out of work

and you blame it on the GOVT

HAHAHAHA


Few know, UK tried this once. They devalued their currency by 30%
overnight because of DEBT. Took them over a decade to recover.

what we NEED to do is REGULATE wall street and re-establish the
credibility of markets

but the right wont go for it. it's better to let the middle class keep
bailing out the rich.