Califbill wrote:
wrote in message ...

On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 23:34:44 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 23:20:01 -0500, wrote:

I have a gas pool heater, I know how much gas it takes to heat water.
I don't use the heater..

Have you analyzed the cost of a gas pool heater vs high efficiency
reverse cycle electric? It's kind of a moot question for me since we
don't have gas here (only propane) but just curious.

This is actually propane too. 330,000 BTU Starite.
I never really looked into it. I got the heater for free.
My wife has 7 heated pools at the country club and they are using heat
pumps. They have huge bills.


Reply:
I run a solar heater on my pool and have a floating blanket to keep it
warm. Blanket not really needed in the mid summer most of the time.
Used to have a gas heater. Natural gas and the little needle on the
meter looked like the front end of Cessna when I heated my pool via
the gas heater. Only did it twice for parties. Neighbor heated his
pool one may to get an extra couple weeks on the start of the season.
$450 gas bill and that was 25 years ago.

I used my electric heater one cold November to heat the pool for some
out of town friends for a week. The electric bill was almost $400
higher than normal. This was only 5-6 years ago and I was only "adding"
15º!

http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.

his week’s cold weather has dropped local water temperatures into the
mid-60s, prompting the cold-sensitive endangered species to swim in
large numbers up the Caloosahatchee River to the Florida Power & Light
warm-water discharge in the Orange River, the site of Lee County’s
Manatee Park, east of Fort Myers.

“I was at Manatee Park yesterday, and there were no manatees, and
today, wow, they’re stacked up,” Capt. Denis Grealish of the Florida
Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission said Friday.

“Herds of manatees are heading up river at a fast clip.”

With that many manatees on the move, and with good boating weather
forecast for the weekend, chances of collisions with boats increase
dramatically.

So far this year, boats have killed 11 manatees in Lee County waters."
"...In a typical year, 25 percent of all manatee deaths are caused by
boat strikes, but 2010 has not been typical.

Through October, 65 of the state’s 668 manatee deaths were caused by
boats (9.7 percent); 244 manatees (36.5 percent) died from cold
stress, most as a result of January’s record cold water temperatures.

As dozens of manatees took advantage of the warm Florida Power & Light
discharge Friday, dozens of visitors took advantage of the marine
mammal spectacle at Manatee Park.

Tim wrote:
http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.

his week’s cold weather has dropped local water temperatures into the
mid-60s, prompting the cold-sensitive endangered species to swim in
large numbers up the Caloosahatchee River to the Florida Power& Light
warm-water discharge in the Orange River, the site of Lee County’s
Manatee Park, east of Fort Myers.

“I was at Manatee Park yesterday, and there were no manatees, and
today, wow, they’re stacked up,” Capt. Denis Grealish of the Florida
Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission said Friday.

“Herds of manatees are heading up river at a fast clip.”

With that many manatees on the move, and with good boating weather
forecast for the weekend, chances of collisions with boats increase
dramatically.

So far this year, boats have killed 11 manatees in Lee County waters."
"...In a typical year, 25 percent of all manatee deaths are caused by
boat strikes, but 2010 has not been typical.

Through October, 65 of the state’s 668 manatee deaths were caused by
boats (9.7 percent); 244 manatees (36.5 percent) died from cold
stress, most as a result of January’s record cold water temperatures.

As dozens of manatees took advantage of the warm Florida Power& Light
discharge Friday, dozens of visitors took advantage of the marine
mammal spectacle at Manatee Park.

Damn Global Warming!

On 12/4/10 5:06 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 4 Dec 2010 00:46:17 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.


I was at the DEP office Friday for my water quality QA and I talked to
one of the biologists. She says when they do necropsy in the winter
they are finding manatee with undigested grass still in their throats.
The literally freeze while they are eating if they venture away from
the power plant. If they stay there they starve.

Yeah we are really "saving them".

The crime is heating the water.

Gee, on that note, I suppose I should ask my wife to shut off the
"birdbath" water heater she runs outdoors all winter, so that passing
birds have unfrozen water to drink.

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 04 Dec 2010 17:14:15 -0500, HarryK wrote:

On 12/4/10 5:06 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 4 Dec 2010 00:46:17 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.


I was at the DEP office Friday for my water quality QA and I talked to
one of the biologists. She says when they do necropsy in the winter
they are finding manatee with undigested grass still in their throats.
The literally freeze while they are eating if they venture away from
the power plant. If they stay there they starve.

Yeah we are really "saving them".

The crime is heating the water.

Gee, on that note, I suppose I should ask my wife to shut off the
"birdbath" water heater she runs outdoors all winter, so that passing
birds have unfrozen water to drink.


I suppose it all depends on if you support the endangered species act.
That says you should not intentionally be interrupting or altering
natural migration patterns with human activity.

He feeds the wild animals around his house human food. That tells you
what kind of person he is. He feels good about doing something that is
actually harming the wildlife.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 04 Dec 2010 17:14:15 -0500, HarryK wrote:

On 12/4/10 5:06 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 4 Dec 2010 00:46:17 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.


I was at the DEP office Friday for my water quality QA and I talked to
one of the biologists. She says when they do necropsy in the winter
they are finding manatee with undigested grass still in their throats.
The literally freeze while they are eating if they venture away from
the power plant. If they stay there they starve.

Yeah we are really "saving them".

The crime is heating the water.

Gee, on that note, I suppose I should ask my wife to shut off the
"birdbath" water heater she runs outdoors all winter, so that passing
birds have unfrozen water to drink.


I suppose it all depends on if you support the endangered species act.
That says you should not intentionally be interrupting or altering
natural migration patterns with human activity.

He feeds the wild animals around his house human food. That tells you
what kind of person he is. He feels good about doing something that is
actually harming the wildlife.

He doesn't understand that he is turning his property into killing
ground. We stopped feeding the birds due to the fact that our female
Beagle kept catching and killing the birds. Also, our yard is now a no
squirrel zone, when the other squirrels saw one of their own being
caught and eaten by the same female Beagle they got the idea that our
yard was not the place to be.

Our chipmunk family living under our front steps was resolved by the
foxes. One chipmunk is a snack but a whole family of chipmunks is a
meal. And, our neighborhood has no stray cats either. The foxes have
taken care of that problem.

If you are truly concerned about the animals you would not put out food
where it does not naturally occur nor water where it is not naturally
found. All yo are doing is creating a buffet for the local predators.

On 12/5/10 10:50 AM, BAR wrote:
In ,
says...

In ,
says...

On Sat, 04 Dec 2010 17:14:15 -0500, wrote:

On 12/4/10 5:06 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 4 Dec 2010 00:46:17 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.


I was at the DEP office Friday for my water quality QA and I talked to
one of the biologists. She says when they do necropsy in the winter
they are finding manatee with undigested grass still in their throats.
The literally freeze while they are eating if they venture away from
the power plant. If they stay there they starve.

Yeah we are really "saving them".

The crime is heating the water.

Gee, on that note, I suppose I should ask my wife to shut off the
"birdbath" water heater she runs outdoors all winter, so that passing
birds have unfrozen water to drink.


I suppose it all depends on if you support the endangered species act.
That says you should not intentionally be interrupting or altering
natural migration patterns with human activity.

He feeds the wild animals around his house human food. That tells you
what kind of person he is. He feels good about doing something that is
actually harming the wildlife.

He doesn't understand that he is turning his property into killing
ground. We stopped feeding the birds due to the fact that our female
Beagle kept catching and killing the birds. Also, our yard is now a no
squirrel zone, when the other squirrels saw one of their own being
caught and eaten by the same female Beagle they got the idea that our
yard was not the place to be.

Our chipmunk family living under our front steps was resolved by the
foxes. One chipmunk is a snack but a whole family of chipmunks is a
meal. And, our neighborhood has no stray cats either. The foxes have
taken care of that problem.

If you are truly concerned about the animals you would not put out food
where it does not naturally occur nor water where it is not naturally
found. All yo are doing is creating a buffet for the local predators.



The hawks and owls in our neighborhood do their jobs taking care of the
smaller rodents. We provide food and water for passing birds, the
neighborhood squirrels, foxes, raccoons, and possums. These show up on
occasion and there's no evidence they are attacking each other. The
squirrels are pests, but there is no way you can put out birdseed in
feeders without having squirrels around, too. The foxes are our
favorites; they are beautiful animals. The raccoons are cute and clever.

We live on the edge of a large wooded area. The critters are abundant
here. A few of them come by, and the ones that do are recognizable. We
have limited interaction with them, and in all the years we have lived
here, they have not been "pests." The only pests in our immediate
neighborhood are the various religious proselytizers who come knocking
uninvited at the front door from time to time.

We don't allow our housepets outside. The only time they go outdoors is
on an annual or other trip to the veterinarian.

In article , says...

On 12/5/10 10:50 AM, BAR wrote:
In ,
says...

In ,
says...

On Sat, 04 Dec 2010 17:14:15 -0500, wrote:

On 12/4/10 5:06 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 4 Dec 2010 00:46:17 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.


I was at the DEP office Friday for my water quality QA and I talked to
one of the biologists. She says when they do necropsy in the winter
they are finding manatee with undigested grass still in their throats.
The literally freeze while they are eating if they venture away from
the power plant. If they stay there they starve.

Yeah we are really "saving them".

The crime is heating the water.

Gee, on that note, I suppose I should ask my wife to shut off the
"birdbath" water heater she runs outdoors all winter, so that passing
birds have unfrozen water to drink.


I suppose it all depends on if you support the endangered species act.
That says you should not intentionally be interrupting or altering
natural migration patterns with human activity.

He feeds the wild animals around his house human food. That tells you
what kind of person he is. He feels good about doing something that is
actually harming the wildlife.

He doesn't understand that he is turning his property into killing
ground. We stopped feeding the birds due to the fact that our female
Beagle kept catching and killing the birds. Also, our yard is now a no
squirrel zone, when the other squirrels saw one of their own being
caught and eaten by the same female Beagle they got the idea that our
yard was not the place to be.

Our chipmunk family living under our front steps was resolved by the

I thought that you just said that posts involving religion shouldn't be
posted here.

In article , says...

He feeds the wild animals around his house human food. That tells you
what kind of person he is. He feels good about doing something that is
actually harming the wildlife.

He doesn't understand that he is turning his property into killing
ground. We stopped feeding the birds due to the fact that our female
Beagle kept catching and killing the birds. Also, our yard is now a no
squirrel zone, when the other squirrels saw one of their own being
caught and eaten by the same female Beagle they got the idea that our
yard was not the place to be.

Our chipmunk family living under our front steps was resolved by the
foxes. One chipmunk is a snack but a whole family of chipmunks is a
meal. And, our neighborhood has no stray cats either. The foxes have
taken care of that problem.

If you are truly concerned about the animals you would not put out food
where it does not naturally occur nor water where it is not naturally
found. All yo are doing is creating a buffet for the local predators.



The hawks and owls in our neighborhood do their jobs taking care of the
smaller rodents. We provide food and water for passing birds, the
neighborhood squirrels, foxes, raccoons, and possums. These show up on
occasion and there's no evidence they are attacking each other. The
squirrels are pests, but there is no way you can put out birdseed in
feeders without having squirrels around, too. The foxes are our
favorites; they are beautiful animals. The raccoons are cute and clever.

Kind of like your own menagerie?

We live on the edge of a large wooded area. The critters are abundant
here. A few of them come by, and the ones that do are recognizable. We
have limited interaction with them, and in all the years we have lived
here, they have not been "pests." The only pests in our immediate
neighborhood are the various religious proselytizers who come knocking
uninvited at the front door from time to time.

I live near where Rock Creek begins.

We don't allow our housepets outside. The only time they go outdoors is
on an annual or other trip to the veterinarian.

Why are you denying your animals the ability to experience nature. Or,
have they told you they like sitting at the window watching the world go
by just like prisoners do?

On Sun, 5 Dec 2010 10:50:23 -0500, BAR wrote:

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 04 Dec 2010 17:14:15 -0500, HarryK wrote:

On 12/4/10 5:06 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 4 Dec 2010 00:46:17 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

http://www.news-press.com/article/20...ion-from-cold-

Theyr'e on the move Greg. Yep -to the power plant.


I was at the DEP office Friday for my water quality QA and I talked to
one of the biologists. She says when they do necropsy in the winter
they are finding manatee with undigested grass still in their throats.
The literally freeze while they are eating if they venture away from
the power plant. If they stay there they starve.

Yeah we are really "saving them".

The crime is heating the water.

Gee, on that note, I suppose I should ask my wife to shut off the
"birdbath" water heater she runs outdoors all winter, so that passing
birds have unfrozen water to drink.


I suppose it all depends on if you support the endangered species act.
That says you should not intentionally be interrupting or altering
natural migration patterns with human activity.

He feeds the wild animals around his house human food. That tells you
what kind of person he is. He feels good about doing something that is
actually harming the wildlife.

He doesn't understand that he is turning his property into killing
ground. We stopped feeding the birds due to the fact that our female
Beagle kept catching and killing the birds. Also, our yard is now a no
squirrel zone, when the other squirrels saw one of their own being
caught and eaten by the same female Beagle they got the idea that our
yard was not the place to be.

Our chipmunk family living under our front steps was resolved by the
foxes. One chipmunk is a snack but a whole family of chipmunks is a
meal. And, our neighborhood has no stray cats either. The foxes have
taken care of that problem.

If you are truly concerned about the animals you would not put out food
where it does not naturally occur nor water where it is not naturally
found. All yo are doing is creating a buffet for the local predators.


Can we trade dogs for a few days? Mine can't seem to catch a squirrel.