"Harry" wrote in message
m...
On 6/23/10 8:21 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Jun 22, 9:29 pm, wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 20:09:42 -0400, Wayne.B

wrote:
Tragic:

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/cre...-capsized.html

Even more so...

"None of the people in the fishing boat were wearing life jackets at
time of accident."

Sad.

It's not likely that a life jacket would have saved someone run over
by a bunch of barges and a tug. That's the problem I have with those
statistics, the "pro life jacket" people always want to assume that
wearing a life jacket would have saved the victim. And that is not
always the case. We don't wear life jackets while recreational
boating. I only ask people to wear one if they are very young or
can't swim. Wearing a life jacket is a situation by situation call.

It's hard to imagine tht these three guys could have all missed seeing
this bearing down on them. I can understand how the tug operator
might have missed seeing them.


According to the news story, the tug was pushing nine barges. What size
barges, I don't know, but that far back, it is unlikely the barge operator
could see anything in front of him, and, if he could see the small boat,
it isn't likely he could have stopped in time or even changed the
direction of that train of barges significantly.

Perhaps operators of pusher barge trains should be required to post a
forward lookout on the bow of the most forward barge.

Good point... or maybe they should be restricted in how many barges they can
push in a confined space.
We have a bit of a similar controversy up here on 'road trains'... that is
18 wheelers pulling two trailers, rather than one.
Lots of safety concerns from the public.

"I am Tosk" wrote in message
...
In article 991b7911-95f9-412a-a5b7-
,
says...

On Jun 22, 9:29 pm, W1TEF wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 20:09:42 -0400, Wayne.B

wrote:
Tragic:

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/cre...-capsized.html

Even more so...

"None of the people in the fishing boat were wearing life jackets at
time of accident."

Sad.

It's not likely that a life jacket would have saved someone run over
by a bunch of barges and a tug. That's the problem I have with those
statistics, the "pro life jacket" people always want to assume that
wearing a life jacket would have saved the victim. And that is not
always the case. We don't wear life jackets while recreational
boating. I only ask people to wear one if they are very young or
can't swim. Wearing a life jacket is a situation by situation call.

It's hard to imagine tht these three guys could have all missed seeing
this bearing down on them. I can understand how the tug operator
might have missed seeing them.

I have been there and almost got run over.. How you can miss it? I don't
know it's huge but the one that crept up on my was like a big silent
planed slipping in in the night... No lights on the front of the barges,
it was crazy.

--
Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!


Maybe it was a 'police barge' and they were looking for you.

On 6/23/10 2:09 PM, YukonBound wrote:


"I am Tosk" wrote in message
...
In article 991b7911-95f9-412a-a5b7-
,
says...

On Jun 22, 9:29 pm, W1TEF wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 20:09:42 -0400, Wayne.B

wrote:
Tragic:

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/cre...-capsized.html

Even more so...

"None of the people in the fishing boat were wearing life jackets at
time of accident."

Sad.

It's not likely that a life jacket would have saved someone run over
by a bunch of barges and a tug. That's the problem I have with those
statistics, the "pro life jacket" people always want to assume that
wearing a life jacket would have saved the victim. And that is not
always the case. We don't wear life jackets while recreational
boating. I only ask people to wear one if they are very young or
can't swim. Wearing a life jacket is a situation by situation call.

It's hard to imagine tht these three guys could have all missed seeing
this bearing down on them. I can understand how the tug operator
might have missed seeing them.

I have been there and almost got run over.. How you can miss it? I don't
know it's huge but the one that crept up on my was like a big silent
planed slipping in in the night... No lights on the front of the barges,
it was crazy.

--
Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!


Maybe it was a 'police barge' and they were looking for you.


snerk

Yeah...the cops wanted to keel haul the little ****.

On Jun 23, 12:35*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 10:32:18 -0400, I am Tosk

wrote:
I have been there and almost got run over.. How you can miss it? I don't
know it's huge but the one that crept up on my was like a big silent
planed slipping in in the night... No lights on the front of the barges,
it was crazy.

I thought the front barge was required to have running lights and a
flasher.
At any rate the sun was up when this happened

Then again, if the fisherman were familiar with the area, then they
should have known to watch for barge traffic.

It's hard to imagine tht these three guys could have all missed seeing
this bearing down on them. I can understand how the tug operator
might have missed seeing them.

It's not for me. We were in the Atchafalaya River one morning on our way to
a great oxbow isolated fishing lake south of Butte La Rose, Louisiana called
Cow Island Lake. Google earth it, and you will see the tiny cut we are
talking about. We rounded a corner and came into a narrow cut about the
same time a barge was coming out of it. We nearly ran into it head-on. We
had been on that stretch many times, but had never once seen a barge in that
cut. We figured he got in there by mistake, or may have been taking it as a
shortcut. There wasn't very much clearance as it was. We had to wait a
good bit before the big barges and pushboat came out so we could go in. It
was before dawn, and a dark night. Luckily not stormy.

Things happen quick on the water.

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com watch for the book

A fool shows his annoyance at once, but a prudent man overlooks an insult.


Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com watch for the book

A fool shows his annoyance at once, but a prudent man overlooks an insult.

wrote in message
...
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 23:19:24 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:


"Canuck57" wrote in message
...
On 22/06/2010 6:59 PM, nom=de=plume wrote:

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
Tragic:

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/cre...-capsized.html

Terrible loss of life. Not even wearing life jackets... sad.

Darwinian actually.

It is law, if you are in a shipping lane or channel, and you are more
manouvable you ge tthe frac out of the way. Unless you have diver flags
out, then the barge would be at fault.

Would be interesting to see who they blame.

--
The bigger government gets, the more it tends to rule out common sense.

Unless there are facts we're not privy to, I think it's pretty obvious who
has the majority of the fault. But, I suspect that the barge operator will
take some percentage blame. Even if she was doing everything 'right', she
would still have the obligation to avoid a collision.


If you are a captain pushing a barge train, there isn't much you can
do to avoid a collision.
9 barges at a couple million pounds each are not going to turn on a
dime and it might take a couple miles to stop them.
About he can do is blow his horn.

Perhaps. Did he blow said horn? If not or if he didn't see the boat, then I
believe he'll have some percentage fault.

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 23 Jun 2010 10:32:18 -0400, I am Tosk
wrote:

I have been there and almost got run over.. How you can miss it? I don't
know it's huge but the one that crept up on my was like a big silent
planed slipping in in the night... No lights on the front of the barges,
it was crazy.

I thought the front barge was required to have running lights and a
flasher.
At any rate the sun was up when this happened

I've seen zillions of them on the IntraCoastal Waterway without lights.

Steve

YukonBound wrote:


"Harry" wrote in message
m...
On 6/23/10 8:21 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Jun 22, 9:29 pm, wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 20:09:42 -0400, Wayne.B

wrote:
Tragic:

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/cre...-capsized.html

Even more so...

"None of the people in the fishing boat were wearing life jackets at
time of accident."

Sad.

It's not likely that a life jacket would have saved someone run over
by a bunch of barges and a tug. That's the problem I have with those
statistics, the "pro life jacket" people always want to assume that
wearing a life jacket would have saved the victim. And that is not
always the case. We don't wear life jackets while recreational
boating. I only ask people to wear one if they are very young or
can't swim. Wearing a life jacket is a situation by situation call.

It's hard to imagine tht these three guys could have all missed seeing
this bearing down on them. I can understand how the tug operator
might have missed seeing them.


According to the news story, the tug was pushing nine barges. What
size barges, I don't know, but that far back, it is unlikely the
barge operator could see anything in front of him, and, if he could
see the small boat, it isn't likely he could have stopped in time or
even changed the direction of that train of barges significantly.

Perhaps operators of pusher barge trains should be required to post a
forward lookout on the bow of the most forward barge.

Good point... or maybe they should be restricted in how many barges
they can push in a confined space.
We have a bit of a similar controversy up here on 'road trains'...
that is 18 wheelers pulling two trailers, rather than one.
Lots of safety concerns from the public.
The two have nothing in common. Barges move at, maybe, 10 knots. At
5:30pm there was enough light to see this thing coming.

"I am Tosk" wrote in message
...
In article 1660a4fc-2c0c-46bd-a669-a72a65d5d112
@b35g2000yqi.googlegroups.com, says...

On Jun 22, 10:34 pm, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 21:29:00 -0400, W1TEF
wrote:

Even more so...

"None of the people in the fishing boat were wearing life jackets at
time of accident."

Sad.

It is sad, and it's really not clear exactly how it could have been
avoided other than greater vigilance/keeping out of the way. I have
to admit that I'm not much into wearing life jackets either except
under the most extreme circumstances, and it's not really clear that
wearing a life jacket will save you from being run over by 8 barges
and a tug. Probably not is my guess but you never know.

They probably became distracted by their fishing and didn't notice the
barges until too late, or perhaps their engine failed to start at the
critical juncture, or maybe they had an anchor own and couldn't get
it up, etc. There are lots of possibilities I suppose but it does
drive home the danger associated with small recreational boats mixing
in with large commercial traffic.

One has to wonder if the tug operator suffers from the same malady
that many of the 18 wheeler drivers do. The "I'm a 'professional'
driver, and these mere regular people in their cars and trucks need to
get out of my way" attitude. Rules of navigation notwithstanding,
it's on his conscience now.

Must be a local thing... Most truckdrivers here are pretty good on the
road. They hate to crash, slows them down plenty..

--
Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!

I drove some for a couple jobs I had and after experiencing enough idiots
cutting in front of me and hearing about truckers dying or ending up
seriously injured rather than running (literally) over a "4 wheeler" I took
the attitude that if a driver was stupid enough to make it a him/her or me
situation it was going to be him/her.

On Jun 23, 8:06*pm, "mmc" wrote:
"I am Tosk" wrote in l-september.org...





In article 1660a4fc-2c0c-46bd-a669-a72a65d5d112
@b35g2000yqi.googlegroups.com, says...

On Jun 22, 10:34 pm, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 21:29:00 -0400, W1TEF
wrote:

Even more so...

"None of the people in the fishing boat were wearing life jackets at
time of accident."

Sad.

It is sad, and it's really not clear exactly how it could have been
avoided other than greater vigilance/keeping out of the way. I have
to admit that I'm not much into wearing life jackets either except
under the most extreme circumstances, and it's not really clear that
wearing a life jacket will save you from being run over by 8 barges
and a tug. Probably not is my guess but you never know.

They probably became distracted by their fishing and didn't notice the
barges until too late, or perhaps their engine failed to start at the
critical juncture, or maybe they had an anchor own and couldn't get
it up, etc. There are lots of possibilities I suppose but it does
drive home the danger associated with small recreational boats mixing
in with large commercial traffic.

One has to wonder if the tug operator suffers from the same malady
that many of the 18 wheeler drivers do. *The "I'm a 'professional'
driver, and these mere regular people in their cars and trucks need to
get out of my way" attitude. *Rules of navigation notwithstanding,
it's on his conscience now.

Must be a local thing... Most truckdrivers here are pretty good on the
road. They hate to crash, slows them down plenty..

--
Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!

I drove some for a couple jobs I had and after experiencing enough idiots
cutting in front of me and hearing about truckers dying or ending up
seriously injured rather than running (literally) over a "4 wheeler" I took
the attitude that if a driver was stupid enough to make it a him/her or me
situation it was going to be him/her.

Are you one of those truckers who will run up behind a "4 wheeler" and
sit there, tailgating, a foot or two off their bumper, knowing that
you don't have a prayer of stopping if traffic slows suddenly? Or one
of those who switches into the left passing lane going downhill,
knowing full well an uphill is just a few hundred feet ahead, and now
you'll just become a moving roadblock, running beside your brethren
trucker in the right lane, for the next 5 miles, unwilling to speed up
to get by and move back over? Or the trucker that pulls out into a
two lane road with traffic approching, knowing it will take you a mile
or two of struggling just to barely approach the speed limit, all the
while with traffic backing up behind you?

And then you wonder why people seemingly cut in front of you? It's
because of many trucker's bad driving behavior and general lack of
driving courtesy. Besides, if you guys were such great drivers, we
wouldn't have to shut down the interstate on a nearly weekly basis
because some dumb trucker has spilled his load on one of the off-
ramps... you know, the ones that are clearly marked with a sharp turn
sign and a low speed limit.

I believe that 18 wheelers should be limited to interstates only, and
have to off-load their cargo to smaller trucks within a mile or two of
the interstate. That would eliminate the severe damage they inflict
on the secondary roads, and the havoc they inflict on traffic. If
they spill their load, they personally pay for the cleanup. Cause an
accident, lose your commercial license *forever*.

I do appreciate them hauling our cargo. Just don't act like an
asshole and try to kill us while doing it!