"hk" wrote in message
m...
On 3/23/10 9:18 PM, Eisboch wrote:


Sounds like the type that was on the last boat I had and had to replace.
Big honking hoses.
The engines were the MercCruiser (GM) 454ci and the hoses that ran from
the
risers to the
mufflers were either 4" or 6" diameter. (can't remember). The boat yard
where I bought the
boat located and installed them. I never liked that boat. Sold it.
Now
boatless. Miss the Navigator.

Eisboch



Considering your previous taste in boats, I never could figure out why you
bought that last boat. I would have kept the little GB if it were in good
shape, since it seemed well-found and also satisfied your need for
creature comforts when "bach'ing" it.

There were a few American Tugs or whatever that other brand is for sale at
a local boatyard. Looked lightly used. You ever look 'em over?

If I could convince the Crown Corp I worked for to double my modest pension,
that's the type of boat I'd take command of.
Up here, we need something seaworthy & comfortable for coastal cruising...
especially with a somewhat short, usually damp, boating season.

"anon-e-moose" wrote in message
...



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

Depending on what you are buying a boat for, you can have just as much
enjoyment in a less expensive, older and/or smaller boat. I did for
years. The old '82 Century I had was a POS, problems up the kazoo and it
handled like a brick. But I enjoyed it and I learned quite a bit about
boating on it, as I did on several more older boats I owned over the years.

Later when retirement was around the corner and my boating interests
changed I found myself in the market for a serious, safe, offshore boat that
could also be lived on for extended periods of time.
That's when I discovered the Navigator line, researched it's history and
builder's credentials and reputation and talked to experienced people who
were familiar with them, including highly qualified marine surveyors. I
became convinced after talking to a boat captain who makes his living
delivering larger boats up and down the east coast. I asked him of all the
boats he had delivered over the years in good weather, bad weather, rough
seas and calm, which one would he pick if he needed to pick only one to
make a trip from MA to Florida in. His answer (without hesitation) was
the Navigator and he then proceeded to tell me why.

Eisboch

On 3/24/10 8:34 AM, Don White wrote:
wrote in message
m...
On 3/23/10 9:18 PM, Eisboch wrote:


Sounds like the type that was on the last boat I had and had to replace.
Big honking hoses.
The engines were the MercCruiser (GM) 454ci and the hoses that ran from
the
risers to the
mufflers were either 4" or 6" diameter. (can't remember). The boat yard
where I bought the
boat located and installed them. I never liked that boat. Sold it.
Now
boatless. Miss the Navigator.

Eisboch



Considering your previous taste in boats, I never could figure out why you
bought that last boat. I would have kept the little GB if it were in good
shape, since it seemed well-found and also satisfied your need for
creature comforts when "bach'ing" it.

There were a few American Tugs or whatever that other brand is for sale at
a local boatyard. Looked lightly used. You ever look 'em over?

If I could convince the Crown Corp I worked for to double my modest pension,
that's the type of boat I'd take command of.
Up here, we need something seaworthy& comfortable for coastal cruising...
especially with a somewhat short, usually damp, boating season.



I liked the looks of that Navigator...looked "shippy" to me.

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 06:19:55 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:


"jps" wrote in message
.. .

Navigator, big plastic boat. Never liked the lines or the look and
they drop value pretty quick. Somebody was happy with you having paid
the depreciation.



You are entitled to your opinion.

Ever been in one in 8 foot confused seas? Ever seen how they are
constructed?
Ever been in the engine spaces and seen the size of the main stringers and
the general construction and design of the important elements of a boat?
Ever spent 10 hours a day at cruise speed, 30 miles offshore on one? Have
you owned one? Ever spent any serious time underway on one? Have you
piloted one in rough seas? Handled one in close quarter maneuvering? I
suspect not.

Something tells me you don't like them and made your unsolicited comments
simply because I owned one.

You give yourself too much credit. I was moored next to one and
invited aboard for three years. I never warmed to it's design,
although I can appreciate that they appeal to some. It's a square
design that makes it look like a block on water. Reminds me of the
Disney cruise vessels. I'm sure it's an excellent boat if you say so.

If that's what floats your boat, you should go get another?

I agree they are not "pretty" in the eyes of all, but they are highly
regarded in marine surveyor's circles as being very well designed and built
from a marine engineering point of view. They are basically the same boat
as a Californian Yacht, the original Marshall design and boat line which he
sold and then purchased back a few years ago.

I couldn't help but notice their rapid decline in value as I tracked
what was being bought and sold around Seattle. They've sold quite few
up here and they're certainly impressive looking but not pretty.

I could recite the main reason I decided to buy one, and the opinions of
seasoned, larger boat owners who were underway on the one I had but I doubt
they would be meaningful to you. I also don't think that the difference in
what I originally paid for it and what I sold it for almost 9 years later
represented an excessive "hit", depreciation-wise. Very few new boats hold
their value well.

Don't quit your day job to become a marine surveyor.

No, don't think I will Richard but thanks for that advice.

Notice you didn't comment on the Fleming or the OE.

My next is the Tollycraft 44 (or 45 later) can be had reasonably on
the east coast and, although they don't have the kind of engine room
the larger Navigators have, they are seaworthy and very well built.
Everything is glassed in, the hulls are thick, hand laid, dead rise is
significant enough to give it excellent seakeeping abilities. They
were given either 3208s or Detroit 8.2s.

And, to me it's good looking. The 48 is also worth noting.

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:30:19 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:


"D.Duck" wrote in message
m...

Eisboch wrote:

"jps" wrote in message
...

Navigator, big plastic boat. Never liked the lines or the look and
they drop value pretty quick. Somebody was happy with you having paid
the depreciation.


Don't quit your day job to become a marine surveyor.

Eisboch

Can you spell T-R-O-L-L ?


sigh Yep. Even in a genuine, boating related thread. Seems the subject
doesn't matter.
Politics or boating ... all the same to a troll. Insults are their
specialty.

Eisboch

Think you're just a bit too sensitive, Richard.

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:54:53 -0400, hk
wrote:

On 3/24/10 7:39 AM, I am Tosk wrote:


Yeah, Tim and I have talked about that. What do you think it is that
makes almost exclusively the "far left" members of this (and most other
groups I frequent) group so vulgar and determined to destroy any
functioning group they visit?

I mean, you look at the most vulgar here, you have Slammer, Harry, JPS,
spewing every shocking, pathetic, vulgar, insult at anybody that tries
to post here, it's a pattern with the far left, you can't deny it...

Scotty


You talked to Tim about it? Did Tim bring up the dozens of posts of
yours that are full of vulgarities and insults? I'll bet he didn't.

*Far* left? Me? JPS? Slammer? That's hilarious, and further proof that
when brains were handed out, you were in the kitchen, wrenching on your
motorbike.

Yes, I'm a tree hugger and a yuppie, all at the same time.

A multipurpose target for the righties, most of which in here are the
inverse of tree huggers.

I'm a fiscal moderate and a social liberal. Seems to fit the
description of most sentient beings, save for the idiots herein who
subscribe to "**** you, I don't care if I've got mine, I'm defending
those that do."

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:24:33 -0400, anon-e-moose
wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
"jps" wrote in message
...
Navigator, big plastic boat. Never liked the lines or the look and
they drop value pretty quick. Somebody was happy with you having paid
the depreciation.



You are entitled to your opinion.

Ever been in one in 8 foot confused seas? Ever seen how they are
constructed?
Ever been in the engine spaces and seen the size of the main stringers and
the general construction and design of the important elements of a boat?
Ever spent 10 hours a day at cruise speed, 30 miles offshore on one? Have
you owned one? Ever spent any serious time underway on one? Have you
piloted one in rough seas? Handled one in close quarter maneuvering? I
suspect not.

Something tells me you don't like them and made your unsolicited comments
simply because I owned one.

I agree they are not "pretty" in the eyes of all, but they are highly
regarded in marine surveyor's circles as being very well designed and built
from a marine engineering point of view. They are basically the same boat
as a Californian Yacht, the original Marshall design and boat line which he
sold and then purchased back a few years ago.

I could recite the main reason I decided to buy one, and the opinions of
seasoned, larger boat owners who were underway on the one I had but I doubt
they would be meaningful to you. I also don't think that the difference in
what I originally paid for it and what I sold it for almost 9 years later
represented an excessive "hit", depreciation-wise. Very few new boats hold
their value well.

Don't quit your day job to become a marine surveyor.

Eisboch



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

Is that how you finance your boats? What boat have you?

The last boat I bought was with cash. Tolly 40 sundeck in pristine
condition.

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:54:53 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:


"anon-e-moose" wrote in message
.. .



You are wasting your time trying to sell the merits of that boat to JPS.
He couldn't afford one even if he mortgaged his house and sold his girls
into slavery.

Depending on what you are buying a boat for, you can have just as much
enjoyment in a less expensive, older and/or smaller boat. I did for
years. The old '82 Century I had was a POS, problems up the kazoo and it
handled like a brick. But I enjoyed it and I learned quite a bit about
boating on it, as I did on several more older boats I owned over the years.

Later when retirement was around the corner and my boating interests
changed I found myself in the market for a serious, safe, offshore boat that
could also be lived on for extended periods of time.
That's when I discovered the Navigator line, researched it's history and
builder's credentials and reputation and talked to experienced people who
were familiar with them, including highly qualified marine surveyors. I
became convinced after talking to a boat captain who makes his living
delivering larger boats up and down the east coast. I asked him of all the
boats he had delivered over the years in good weather, bad weather, rough
seas and calm, which one would he pick if he needed to pick only one to
make a trip from MA to Florida in. His answer (without hesitation) was
the Navigator and he then proceeded to tell me why.

Eisboch

Holy crap. Out of the thousands of boats designed, engineered and
manufactured, he could only site Navigator?

Was he a friend of the broker?

On 3/24/10 11:50 AM, jps wrote:
On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:54:53 -0400,
wrote:

On 3/24/10 7:39 AM, I am Tosk wrote:


Yeah, Tim and I have talked about that. What do you think it is that
makes almost exclusively the "far left" members of this (and most other
groups I frequent) group so vulgar and determined to destroy any
functioning group they visit?

I mean, you look at the most vulgar here, you have Slammer, Harry, JPS,
spewing every shocking, pathetic, vulgar, insult at anybody that tries
to post here, it's a pattern with the far left, you can't deny it...

Scotty


You talked to Tim about it? Did Tim bring up the dozens of posts of
yours that are full of vulgarities and insults? I'll bet he didn't.

*Far* left? Me? JPS? Slammer? That's hilarious, and further proof that
when brains were handed out, you were in the kitchen, wrenching on your
motorbike.

Yes, I'm a tree hugger and a yuppie, all at the same time.

A multipurpose target for the righties, most of which in here are the
inverse of tree huggers.

I'm a fiscal moderate and a social liberal. Seems to fit the
description of most sentient beings, save for the idiots herein who
subscribe to "**** you, I don't care if I've got mine, I'm defending
those that do."


Scotty is a teabagger in a girlie hairdo.

On Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:26:23 -0400, anon-e-moose
wrote:

D.Duck wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"jps" wrote in message
...
Navigator, big plastic boat. Never liked the lines or the look and
they drop value pretty quick. Somebody was happy with you having paid
the depreciation.



You are entitled to your opinion.

Ever been in one in 8 foot confused seas? Ever seen how they are
constructed?
Ever been in the engine spaces and seen the size of the main stringers
and the general construction and design of the important elements of a
boat? Ever spent 10 hours a day at cruise speed, 30 miles offshore on
one? Have you owned one? Ever spent any serious time underway on
one? Have you piloted one in rough seas? Handled one in close
quarter maneuvering? I suspect not.

Something tells me you don't like them and made your unsolicited
comments simply because I owned one.

I agree they are not "pretty" in the eyes of all, but they are highly
regarded in marine surveyor's circles as being very well designed and
built from a marine engineering point of view. They are basically the
same boat as a Californian Yacht, the original Marshall design and
boat line which he sold and then purchased back a few years ago.

I could recite the main reason I decided to buy one, and the opinions
of seasoned, larger boat owners who were underway on the one I had but
I doubt they would be meaningful to you. I also don't think that the
difference in what I originally paid for it and what I sold it for
almost 9 years later represented an excessive "hit",
depreciation-wise. Very few new boats hold their value well.

Don't quit your day job to become a marine surveyor.

Eisboch

Can you spell T-R-O-L-L ?

It's more than that. Eisbock is obviously successful and JPS is Jealous
of the fact.

I'd certainly like to have the safety net and disposable income that
Richard has achieved but I wouldn't trade my life for his. I'm 10 to
15 years behind him and on my way to a similar business event that'll
liquidate my ownership, maybe more or less but that matters not.

I have nothing against Richard but I certainly disagree with his
politics and reticence to explain himself.

When he's pressed, he says he doesn't give a **** what anyone thinks
but then later admits he does. I'm sure he'll clarify it by saying
that he doesn't give a **** what *I* think but that's just bluster.