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#1
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
Frogwatch wrote:
This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. |
#2
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Waves that size in the Gulf are unusual although with the 33 kt wind from the NW there is a lot of room for them to build. My question about anchoring is because I have read several accounts of boats anchored by the stern, a wave comes over the cut-away transom and thats the end. |
#3
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
Frogwatch wrote:
On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Waves that size in the Gulf are unusual although with the 33 kt wind from the NW there is a lot of room for them to build. My question about anchoring is because I have read several accounts of boats anchored by the stern, a wave comes over the cut-away transom and thats the end. Oh...you were trolling. Sorry. My mistake. |
#4
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
Frogwatch wrote:
On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Waves that size in the Gulf are unusual although with the 33 kt wind from the NW there is a lot of room for them to build. My question about anchoring is because I have read several accounts of boats anchored by the stern, a wave comes over the cut-away transom and thats the end. I have been out in 35+ winds in the Gulf, around 8 miles off shore, while the waves looked 12', I think they were probably closer to 6'. I can't imagine 14'-16' in the gulf. Who projected the wave height? |
#5
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
"nameless" wrote in message ... Frogwatch wrote: On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Waves that size in the Gulf are unusual although with the 33 kt wind from the NW there is a lot of room for them to build. My question about anchoring is because I have read several accounts of boats anchored by the stern, a wave comes over the cut-away transom and thats the end. I have been out in 35+ winds in the Gulf, around 8 miles off shore, while the waves looked 12', I think they were probably closer to 6'. I can't imagine 14'-16' in the gulf. Who projected the wave height? I have been out in the Gulf of Mexico. Google West Cameron 587 location, and that is as far as I was out there. Or Eugene Island 312. We were trying to get to a platform in a large crewboat during a hurricane when the captain had the brainstorm that once we got there, there would be no way to unload us. So, we went back to Freeport, TX, and spent three days in a flooded motel. I spent six years in the Gulf of Mexico. You can believe whatever you like. I believe what I saw. Those men were simply inexperienced seamen who set out on a small craft and ran into bad weather. It's quite simple. There were several mistakes that any seasoned seaman would not have made. First is going out. Second, not taking an EPIRB. They probably add on after that, compounding one another. I've spent time on large boats where there were straps to tie one's self into your bunk so you didn't roll out. Dangerous stuff in a big boat. Sometimes even deadly on one of those. Smaller craft are worse. My sympathies to the families. It is sad to lose someone to poor judgement. Steve |
#6
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Next, finding yourself in such a situation, what to do? Should you simply let anchor #1 go knowing you have #2? Obviously start the motor before trying to haul in the anchor. I assume strong wind here was also a major factor in how the boat behaved (data buoy here said sustained 36 kt with gusts to 42). Is the boat better off under power in those conditions or with a drogue deployed from bow? I assume under power. |
#7
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
On Mar 3, 12:19 pm, Frogwatch wrote:
On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Next, finding yourself in such a situation, what to do? Should you simply let anchor #1 go knowing you have #2? Obviously start the motor before trying to haul in the anchor. I assume strong wind here was also a major factor in how the boat behaved (data buoy here said sustained 36 kt with gusts to 42). Is the boat better off under power in those conditions or with a drogue deployed from bow? I assume under power. No life jackets until they flipped? Under those conditions? Were they trying to be candidates for the Darwin Award? Really now, inflatable jackets are comfy, you should always wear them (ok, most of the time). |
#8
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
"Frogwatch" wrote in message ... On Mar 3, 12:19 pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Next, finding yourself in such a situation, what to do? Should you simply let anchor #1 go knowing you have #2? Obviously start the motor before trying to haul in the anchor. I assume strong wind here was also a major factor in how the boat behaved (data buoy here said sustained 36 kt with gusts to 42). Is the boat better off under power in those conditions or with a drogue deployed from bow? I assume under power. No life jackets until they flipped? Under those conditions? Were they trying to be candidates for the Darwin Award? Really now, inflatable jackets are comfy, you should always wear them (ok, most of the time). I would have to agree, Darwin suicide award is their best excuse. Not just for not wearing them, but going out that far in such a small boat. Really stupid. |
#9
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
Canuck57 wrote:
"Frogwatch" wrote in message ... On Mar 3, 12:19 pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Next, finding yourself in such a situation, what to do? Should you simply let anchor #1 go knowing you have #2? Obviously start the motor before trying to haul in the anchor. I assume strong wind here was also a major factor in how the boat behaved (data buoy here said sustained 36 kt with gusts to 42). Is the boat better off under power in those conditions or with a drogue deployed from bow? I assume under power. No life jackets until they flipped? Under those conditions? Were they trying to be candidates for the Darwin Award? Really now, inflatable jackets are comfy, you should always wear them (ok, most of the time). I would have to agree, Darwin suicide award is their best excuse. Not just for not wearing them, but going out that far in such a small boat. Really stupid. I was very surprised at the size of the waves, and here is a graph and weather report on Saturdays weather 50 miles off of Tampa. The waves built up VERY fast. According to the survivor found, everyone was wearing a life vest. http://www.accuweather.com/regional-...34&partner=rss |
#10
posted to rec.boats
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Analyze the accident
"Frogwatch" wrote in message ... On Mar 3, 12:00 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: This accident with the NFL players off Clearwater where the boat overturned is tragic. What went wrong? The weather forecast was poor when they left shore, so what were they thinking? Was it simply a matter of being too macho to exercise common sense? Next, once a boat turns upside down, is there any way to right them? Once righted, would a motor start (assume a 2 cycle). I'd like to know how the boat was anchored, was it from the stern, classical mistake resulting in this. Going offshore with no EPIRB used to be acceptable but today? - - - What went wrong? From the reports I heard yesterday, the guys went 50 miles offshore in a 21' boat and were flipped by 14' to 16' waves. What were they thinking? That they were invulernable. They either were too macho or unaware of how quickly weather can change on the Gulf or both *or* they were so ignorant of the dangers of small boating, they thought their craft could handle anything they encountered. I doubt there is a way for guys in the water to flip right-side-up a boat like that. Might be able to turn back over an open boat, though. Would the motor start? Doubtful. I'm not sure the way the boat was anchored was relevant, since it apparently was rolled over. Had it been anchored from the bow, it probably would have been swamped and then it would have flipped. Back in my Jax days, I would go out 20 miles to some manmade reefs, but only after checking the weather and listening to the weather channel and only with a pack of other boats. 18-footer. No ePIRB back then. Next, finding yourself in such a situation, what to do? Should you simply let anchor #1 go knowing you have #2? Obviously start the motor before trying to haul in the anchor. I assume strong wind here was also a major factor in how the boat behaved (data buoy here said sustained 36 kt with gusts to 42). Is the boat better off under power in those conditions or with a drogue deployed from bow? I assume under power. Probably too many went to the same corner of the boat to pull anchor. Acquaintance in a 13 BW was pulling a crab pot when the 3rd person, large guy walked to the back to help. Boat flipped. They were lucky as all climbed on the bottom, but the portable VHF went to the bottom of the sea. Lucky in the fact that a commercial crabber saw them just at dusk and saved their butts. They should have started back as soon as the wind picked up. Some of us survive ignorance, others don't. Years ago, I was off Pillar Point in a 14' boat. Salmon fishing. Looked up and realized that there was only 2 of us out there. At about 10:30 am in the summer, the wind always comes up and white caps appear. I had about 5 miles to go to shelter, and my asshole was puckered the whole trip. Too small a boat for the conditions I was in. Ignorance of the local conditions. Great Guardian Angel! |
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