On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 09:14:07 -0600, wrote:

You know, we have already spent $350 billion to bail out the *******s
that caused this mess. We've let them keep their millions in bonuses,
but we're quibbling about spending 1/10 of that to save an industry that
provides 1-3 million jobs. I don't get it. And, I would point out, it
was the incompetence of Wall Street that brought Detroit's troubles into
crisis.

No - it was not caused by Wall Street - it was caused by two outsized
factors - the first was the speculative oil bubble which placed an
absurd tax the average American who suddenly had limited funds due to
the increased costs of fuel and fuel oil. The second factor was the
refusal of the FED and Treasury Department to back up Bear Stearns -
which was a solvent company with plenty of assets that had run into
liquidity because of ourside pressure on it's stock.

GM had been in trouble for years prior to the collapse.

With respect to Obamessiah's New New Deal, the original New Deal was a
joke and strictly make work. This isn't going to work either because
it's a SOP to the construction unions to keep their members busy -
screw everybody else.

Tell me - what's an average factory worker make building solar panels.
Have any idea? How about a truck driver - non Union? How about a
flag waver for traffic control. The guy who runs the paver, the
roller, the bridge steel worker. Is Obama going to give all these
people the same rate of pay regardless of what they do? How is he
giong to control the cost? Is it going to be privately contracted or
government contracted? How about the engineers, the surveyors, the
cost managers, accountants and lawyers - they all going to be paid at
the same rate as professionals?

It's a joke - you know it, I know it.

--

"Every normal man must be tempted at times
to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag,
and begin to slit throats."

H. L. Mencken

On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:17:16 -0500, "Eisboch"
wrote:

Think about it.

You are asking a lot of the Obamatrons.

--

"An idealist is one who, on noticing that
a rose smells better than a cabbage, concludes
that it will also make better soup."

H.L. Mencken

On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:21:14 -0500, Boater
wrote:

We've handed out close to a trillion dollars to the Wall Street and
banking industries, and for what? We'll get nothing out of that. Not
even a lousy car.

Tell me just out of curiosity - what model car do you drive? How
about your wife?

--

"An idealist is one who, on noticing that
a rose smells better than a cabbage, concludes
that it will also make better soup."

H.L. Mencken

On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 08:51:23 -0700, "RG" wrote:


One of the financial experts interviewed on CNN commented on this. He
said that even if GM received the full requested government bailout ...
*plus* an additional 50-75 billion that he figured will be necessary in
the future, GM will still be an insolvent, bankrupt company.


Which is why the debate about whether or not to allow them to fail is so
absurd. The point is that they have already failed, big time. The debate
now should be about how to deconstruct and see if some sort of Phoenix can
rise from the ashes. Under the right circumstances, I believe such a
re-birth is possible and would have a reasonable chance of success.

Perfect.

Well said.

--

"An idealist is one who, on noticing that
a rose smells better than a cabbage, concludes
that it will also make better soup."

H.L. Mencken

Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:21:14 -0500, Boater
wrote:

We've handed out close to a trillion dollars to the Wall Street and
banking industries, and for what? We'll get nothing out of that. Not
even a lousy car.

Tell me just out of curiosity - what model car do you drive? How
about your wife?


Why do you ask? I don't fault the UAW or organized workers for the
crappiness of some of the cars US producers turn out.

On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 14:20:58 -0500, Boater
wrote:

Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:21:14 -0500, Boater
wrote:

We've handed out close to a trillion dollars to the Wall Street and
banking industries, and for what? We'll get nothing out of that. Not
even a lousy car.

Tell me just out of curiosity - what model car do you drive? How
about your wife?

Why do you ask? I don't fault the UAW or organized workers for the
crappiness of some of the cars US producers turn out.

Just curious.
--

Happy Holidays and Merry Whatever It Is
That ****es Liberals Off.

"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in
message ...
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 14:20:58 -0500, Boater
wrote:

Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:21:14 -0500, Boater
wrote:

We've handed out close to a trillion dollars to the Wall Street and
banking industries, and for what? We'll get nothing out of that. Not
even a lousy car.

Tell me just out of curiosity - what model car do you drive? How
about your wife?

Why do you ask? I don't fault the UAW or organized workers for the
crappiness of some of the cars US producers turn out.

Just curious.
--

It's a Toyota. Really.

~Snerk~

On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:46:42 -0700, "RG" wrote:


"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in
message ...
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 14:20:58 -0500, Boater
wrote:

Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:21:14 -0500, Boater
wrote:

We've handed out close to a trillion dollars to the Wall Street and
banking industries, and for what? We'll get nothing out of that. Not
even a lousy car.

Tell me just out of curiosity - what model car do you drive? How
about your wife?

Why do you ask? I don't fault the UAW or organized workers for the
crappiness of some of the cars US producers turn out.

Just curious.

It's a Toyota. Really.

~Snerk~

That's what I thought.

Made down South with non-Union labor.

Do as I say - not as I do.

Typical. He wants to save a company from which he won't buy a car
because of quality issues which is built by the very same Union
members he says are so important to the US. Instead he buys a car
from a foreign company built in the US by non-Union labor.

Now is that tortured thinking or what?
--

Happy Holidays and Merry Whatever It Is
That ****es Liberals Off.

"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in
message ...
On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:46:42 -0700, "RG" wrote:


"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in
message ...
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 14:20:58 -0500, Boater
wrote:

Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:21:14 -0500, Boater
wrote:

We've handed out close to a trillion dollars to the Wall Street and
banking industries, and for what? We'll get nothing out of that. Not
even a lousy car.

Tell me just out of curiosity - what model car do you drive? How
about your wife?

Why do you ask? I don't fault the UAW or organized workers for the
crappiness of some of the cars US producers turn out.

Just curious.

It's a Toyota. Really.

~Snerk~

That's what I thought.

Made down South with non-Union labor.

Do as I say - not as I do.

Typical. He wants to save a company from which he won't buy a car
because of quality issues which is built by the very same Union
members he says are so important to the US. Instead he buys a car
from a foreign company built in the US by non-Union labor.

Now is that tortured thinking or what?
--


Twisted. So much so that he couldn't even bring himself to directly an
honestly answer your simple question. Please pay no attention to the man
behind the curtain.

Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 7 Dec 2008 12:46:42 -0700, "RG" wrote:

"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in
message ...
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 14:20:58 -0500, Boater
wrote:

Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:
On Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:21:14 -0500, Boater
wrote:

We've handed out close to a trillion dollars to the Wall Street and
banking industries, and for what? We'll get nothing out of that. Not
even a lousy car.
Tell me just out of curiosity - what model car do you drive? How
about your wife?
Why do you ask? I don't fault the UAW or organized workers for the
crappiness of some of the cars US producers turn out.
Just curious.
It's a Toyota. Really.

~Snerk~

That's what I thought.

Made down South with non-Union labor.

Do as I say - not as I do.

Typical. He wants to save a company from which he won't buy a car
because of quality issues which is built by the very same Union
members he says are so important to the US. Instead he buys a car
from a foreign company built in the US by non-Union labor.

Now is that tortured thinking or what?
--

The quality issues have nothing to do with the workers who build the
car, and everything to do with corporate management. Besides, you are
assuming there is but one vehicle. There are others. The Toyota has
100,000+ miles and is only used to tow the boat. At least *one* of the
others is built with UAW labor.