"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
Since it is harder to change headsails with a roller rig, I've found that
sail plan and size is more important than I've heard discussed.

My E32 came with big 150% Genoa on the theory that it would do everything.
The problem was that, when rolled up to the size appropriate for the
typical strong wind, it lost too much shape and had too much bulk rolled
on the head stay for the boat to go to windward well. I therefore had to
carry a working jib in case I was ever faced with a long beat to windward
and go through the whole swapping routine. Changing headsails on a roller
rig is harder not just because of the foil set up but because a "do
everything" roller Genoa has to be of heavier cloth to stand up to the
strains when reefed and the rolling. Add luff foam and leach sun cover
and It makes for a big bulky sail bag and hard work bagging on the
foredeck.

I had my new headsail built last winter cut to 135% size with a very high
clew. The latter feature makes sailing in congested waters vastly more
enjoyable and safer at a performance penalty I would only notice in a race
with an identical boat. The area reduction means that the sail will still
have decent shape when reefed down to size for 20 - 25 knot winds. I
really haven't noticed any performance difference with the full sail plan
that I can tie to the reduction in overlap.

I no longer carry the working jib although I will put it back on board for
any long trips that might involved long beats in 25 knot plus winds. I
used to change jibs a couple times a month as different weather systems
went through but, no more.

The E32 is a bit on the tender side so these sizes are not a guide to all
boats. If you are ordering a new roller headsail, figure out the jib size
for winds in the low 20's and tell your sailmaker to make the full size
such that you will still have decent shape when rolled down that amount.

My boat came with a nearly new Profurl system which has been entirely
satisfactory and easy to use. The foil cames with two grooves so
theoretically you can hoist one sail before you lower the other as I have
several extra halliards. This is fine if you have a full crew for racing but
I sail with just my wife for crew and all halliards are led back to the
cockpit so there is a bit too much for two to do when changing headsails
even though we have an excellent Simrad pilot which counts as a third member
of crew on board.
In my previous boat I have had my fill of being well offshore in a storm,
trying to unhank a foresail , get it down the fore hatch instead of
overboard and then trying to hank on a storm jib, so for me the roller is
the way to go..
All the foresails that came with the boat from 150% mylar genny down to the
storm jib have been fitted with bolt 'ropes' that fit the foils so even
changing to the storm jib would be a hassle and involve visiting the
foredeck.
.. Luckily, in addition to all the racing sails I have a nearly new Mack
130% foresail which was built specifically for furling and sets beautifully
however much it is furled so it is the only foresail I use.

On Aug 9, 8:10 am, "Edgar" wrote:
....
My boat came with a nearly new Profurl system which has been entirely
satisfactory and easy to use. The foil cames with two grooves so
theoretically you can hoist one sail before you lower the other as I have
several extra halliards. ...

But not when using the "furling" option. If you have a furling sail
up it will be attached to the swivel and if you hoist a new sail
before lowering the old you will not be able to lower the swivel or
the old sail... There may be other justifications for dual slots
(twin headsails for trade wind sailing, redundancy, or racing sail
changes when the swivel (and therefore the furling) is not used) but
they aren't for changing sails when cruising.

-- Tom.

wrote in message
...
On Aug 9, 8:10 am, "Edgar" wrote:
...
My boat came with a nearly new Profurl system which has been entirely
satisfactory and easy to use. The foil cames with two grooves so
theoretically you can hoist one sail before you lower the other as I have
several extra halliards. ...

But not when using the "furling" option. If you have a furling sail
up it will be attached to the swivel and if you hoist a new sail
before lowering the old you will not be able to lower the swivel or
the old sail... There may be other justifications for dual slots
(twin headsails for trade wind sailing, redundancy, or racing sail
changes when the swivel (and therefore the furling) is not used) but
they aren't for changing sails when cruising.

-- Tom.

Yes that is true of course. My boat came from a racing background and has
several Mylar foresails, all of which fit the grooves. This is all very well
but it needs two peole to handle sail changes as one has to man the
halliards while the other feeds the sail into the foil. I sail with just my
wife for crew so all those racing sails are in the basement at home and I
stick with a 130% dacron genny which is specially designed for the roller.
Even though we only cruise I do not like a slow boat and we hold our own
pretty well with most boats our own size so I am happy.

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:38:43 +0200, "Edgar"
wrote:


wrote in message
...
On Aug 9, 8:10 am, "Edgar" wrote:
...
My boat came with a nearly new Profurl system which has been entirely
satisfactory and easy to use. The foil cames with two grooves so
theoretically you can hoist one sail before you lower the other as I have
several extra halliards. ...

But not when using the "furling" option. If you have a furling sail
up it will be attached to the swivel and if you hoist a new sail
before lowering the old you will not be able to lower the swivel or
the old sail... There may be other justifications for dual slots
(twin headsails for trade wind sailing, redundancy, or racing sail
changes when the swivel (and therefore the furling) is not used) but
they aren't for changing sails when cruising.

-- Tom.

Yes that is true of course. My boat came from a racing background and has
several Mylar foresails, all of which fit the grooves. This is all very well
but it needs two peole to handle sail changes as one has to man the
halliards while the other feeds the sail into the foil. I sail with just my
wife for crew so all those racing sails are in the basement at home and I
stick with a 130% dacron genny which is specially designed for the roller.
Even though we only cruise I do not like a slow boat and we hold our own
pretty well with most boats our own size so I am happy.


Is there some reason you don't want to use a pre-feeder? I routinely
change sails by myself. I get the sail started in the track, and then
the prefeeder takes care of guiding the rest of the sail in while I
man the halyard. Rarely, I have to stop at some point because the sail
is too twisted on the deck to feed well. Takes but a second to fix
that when it happens, and get back in the cockpit.

My pre-feeder is homemade out of starboard, and splits in two pieces,
held togeter by bolts with wingnuts, in case I ever need to remove it
from the bolt rope while somewhere in the middle of it's length. So
far, I've never used that option.

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:38:43 +0200, "Edgar"
wrote:


wrote in message
...
On Aug 9, 8:10 am, "Edgar" wrote:
...
My boat came with a nearly new Profurl system which has been entirely
satisfactory and easy to use. The foil cames with two grooves so
theoretically you can hoist one sail before you lower the other as I
have
several extra halliards. ...

But not when using the "furling" option. If you have a furling sail
up it will be attached to the swivel and if you hoist a new sail
before lowering the old you will not be able to lower the swivel or
the old sail... There may be other justifications for dual slots
(twin headsails for trade wind sailing, redundancy, or racing sail
changes when the swivel (and therefore the furling) is not used) but
they aren't for changing sails when cruising.

-- Tom.

Yes that is true of course. My boat came from a racing background and has
several Mylar foresails, all of which fit the grooves. This is all very
well
but it needs two peole to handle sail changes as one has to man the
halliards while the other feeds the sail into the foil. I sail with just
my
wife for crew so all those racing sails are in the basement at home and I
stick with a 130% dacron genny which is specially designed for the roller.
Even though we only cruise I do not like a slow boat and we hold our own
pretty well with most boats our own size so I am happy.


Is there some reason you don't want to use a pre-feeder? I routinely
change sails by myself. I get the sail started in the track, and then
the prefeeder takes care of guiding the rest of the sail in while I
man the halyard. Rarely, I have to stop at some point because the sail
is too twisted on the deck to feed well. Takes but a second to fix
that when it happens, and get back in the cockpit.

My pre-feeder is homemade out of starboard, and splits in two pieces,
held togeter by bolts with wingnuts, in case I ever need to remove it
from the bolt rope while somewhere in the middle of it's length. So
far, I've never used that option.

Yes, if I planned to revert to racing mode I would add a pre-feeder but
still feel that a !50% Mylar genny lying on deck would need a helping hand
from time to time.
Even my storm jib needs feeding into the groove on the foil so while
shorthanded I prefer to stick with the Profurl and dedicated foresail
designed for it.
I have the spinnaker winch handy in the cockpit if I need it for the furling
line but have never had to use it yet as the line has a good lead and I have
always been able to haul it in by hand.
I have no wish to have to go onto the foredeck well offshore in the middle
of the night to change a foresail in heavy weather although I have fitted a
jackstay so that I can be clipped on all the way forward if I have to.
.. Had my fill of that sort of thing in the English Channel with my previous
boat when I lived in Uk-that boat had hankon foresails. But at least here in
S. Norway it is never actually dark in the middle of the night in summer so
that is a bonus.

On Thu, 21 Aug 2008 10:58:34 +0200, "Edgar"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:38:43 +0200, "Edgar"
wrote:


wrote in message
...
On Aug 9, 8:10 am, "Edgar" wrote:
...
My boat came with a nearly new Profurl system which has been entirely
satisfactory and easy to use. The foil cames with two grooves so
theoretically you can hoist one sail before you lower the other as I
have
several extra halliards. ...

But not when using the "furling" option. If you have a furling sail
up it will be attached to the swivel and if you hoist a new sail
before lowering the old you will not be able to lower the swivel or
the old sail... There may be other justifications for dual slots
(twin headsails for trade wind sailing, redundancy, or racing sail
changes when the swivel (and therefore the furling) is not used) but
they aren't for changing sails when cruising.

-- Tom.

Yes that is true of course. My boat came from a racing background and has
several Mylar foresails, all of which fit the grooves. This is all very
well
but it needs two peole to handle sail changes as one has to man the
halliards while the other feeds the sail into the foil. I sail with just
my
wife for crew so all those racing sails are in the basement at home and I
stick with a 130% dacron genny which is specially designed for the roller.
Even though we only cruise I do not like a slow boat and we hold our own
pretty well with most boats our own size so I am happy.


Is there some reason you don't want to use a pre-feeder? I routinely
change sails by myself. I get the sail started in the track, and then
the prefeeder takes care of guiding the rest of the sail in while I
man the halyard. Rarely, I have to stop at some point because the sail
is too twisted on the deck to feed well. Takes but a second to fix
that when it happens, and get back in the cockpit.

My pre-feeder is homemade out of starboard, and splits in two pieces,
held togeter by bolts with wingnuts, in case I ever need to remove it
from the bolt rope while somewhere in the middle of it's length. So
far, I've never used that option.

Yes, if I planned to revert to racing mode I would add a pre-feeder but
still feel that a !50% Mylar genny lying on deck would need a helping hand
from time to time.

I still don't understand why you don't have a pre-feeder. It's
probably more important on a cruiser than on a race boat where there
would usually be more crew on board and less actual need for one.

You can buy one that works just fine for about $20. Even when changing
sails at the dock before going out, it's a big help. What is the
downside that makes you resist having one?

I still don't understand why you don't have a pre-feeder. It's
probably more important on a cruiser than on a race boat where there
would usually be more crew on board and less actual need for one.

You can buy one that works just fine for about $20. Even when changing
sails at the dock before going out, it's a big help. What is the
downside that makes you resist having one?

Because I only hoist the jib once a year in spring and lower it again in
autumn