I am looking at 2 Pearson sailboats. One has a Universal model 12 engine &
the other has a Westerbeke 12. Does either engine have a better reputation
than the other?
Marc

On Tue, 6 Apr 2004 00:13:37 -0400, "Marc Beroz"
wrote:

I am looking at 2 Pearson sailboats. One has a Universal model 12 engine &
the other has a Westerbeke 12. Does either engine have a better reputation
than the other?
Marc

I believe they might be the same as I think Westerbeke bought
Universal in the late '80s...so the Universal might be the older
engine.

Westerbeke is generally considered middle of the road, quality-wise.
Everyone likes Volvos until they have to buy a spare part, and Yanmars
are currently the default setting, although that may be because so few
people do their own diesel maintenance.

Anyone past a certain age seems to consider the Perkins 4-108 God's
own diesel in terms of reliability and owner-maintainability, but they
are getting fairly elderly now, as are the boats in which they burble
and shake.

R.

I believe they might be the same as I think Westerbeke bought
Universal in the late '80s...so the Universal might be the older
engine.

You are correct that Westerbeke and Universal are the same company.
There is no reason to suspect that the Universal must be older than the
Westerbeke, either trademark can be purchased brand new today.

I suspect Westerbeke may run both lines so they can appoint more dealers in
crowded markets. Dealer "A" is the "exclusive" Westerbeke dealer, but to keep
him hustling and competitive in price they give the same product to Dealer "B"
and call it a Universal instead.

On 06 Apr 2004 06:02:40 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

I believe they might be the same as I think Westerbeke bought
Universal in the late '80s...so the Universal might be the older
engine.

You are correct that Westerbeke and Universal are the same company.
There is no reason to suspect that the Universal must be older than the
Westerbeke, either trademark can be purchased brand new today.

Pardon me, as I thought the Universal brand had been incorporated into
that of Westerbeke. But then I own an Atomic 4, so my interest in the
firm ceases after 1985 G

I suspect Westerbeke may run both lines so they can appoint more dealers in
crowded markets. Dealer "A" is the "exclusive" Westerbeke dealer, but to keep
him hustling and competitive in price they give the same product to Dealer "B"
and call it a Universal instead.

Like Kubota and Beta Marine, eh?

R.

On 06 Apr 2004 06:02:40 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

I believe they might be the same as I think Westerbeke bought
Universal in the late '80s...so the Universal might be the older
engine.

You are correct that Westerbeke and Universal are the same company.
There is no reason to suspect that the Universal must be older than the
Westerbeke, either trademark can be purchased brand new today.

Pardon me, as I thought the Universal brand had been incorporated into
that of Westerbeke. But then I own an Atomic 4, so my interest in the
firm ceases after 1985 G

I suspect Westerbeke may run both lines so they can appoint more dealers in
crowded markets. Dealer "A" is the "exclusive" Westerbeke dealer, but to keep
him hustling and competitive in price they give the same product to Dealer "B"
and call it a Universal instead.

Like Kubota and Beta Marine, eh?

R.

On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 06:02:40 +0000, Gould 0738 wrote:

I believe they might be the same as I think Westerbeke bought Universal
in the late '80s...so the Universal might be the older engine.

You are correct that Westerbeke and Universal are the same company.
There is no reason to suspect that the Universal must be older than the
Westerbeke, either trademark can be purchased brand new today.

I suspect Westerbeke may run both lines so they can appoint more dealers
in crowded markets. Dealer "A" is the "exclusive" Westerbeke dealer, but
to keep him hustling and competitive in price they give the same product
to Dealer "B" and call it a Universal instead.

Although both under the name of "Westerbeke", the Universals are different
engines. For instance, the M25XPB (3-cyl, 1.0L, 26hp@3000rpm) that I just
put into Far Cove is an updated Universal M25. It says "Universal" on the
side, painted a different colour, and the closest equivalent "Westerbeke"
is a 30B (3-cyl, .95L, 27hp@3600rpm). DEFINITELY a different engine, in
more ways than the colour.

Also, at least around here, you get a "Universal" engine from the
"Westerbeke" dealer.

Kinda like Chev and Pontiac, I guess...

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 06:02:40 +0000, Gould 0738 wrote:

I believe they might be the same as I think Westerbeke bought Universal
in the late '80s...so the Universal might be the older engine.

You are correct that Westerbeke and Universal are the same company.
There is no reason to suspect that the Universal must be older than the
Westerbeke, either trademark can be purchased brand new today.

I suspect Westerbeke may run both lines so they can appoint more dealers
in crowded markets. Dealer "A" is the "exclusive" Westerbeke dealer, but
to keep him hustling and competitive in price they give the same product
to Dealer "B" and call it a Universal instead.

Although both under the name of "Westerbeke", the Universals are different
engines. For instance, the M25XPB (3-cyl, 1.0L, 26hp@3000rpm) that I just
put into Far Cove is an updated Universal M25. It says "Universal" on the
side, painted a different colour, and the closest equivalent "Westerbeke"
is a 30B (3-cyl, .95L, 27hp@3600rpm). DEFINITELY a different engine, in
more ways than the colour.

Also, at least around here, you get a "Universal" engine from the
"Westerbeke" dealer.

Kinda like Chev and Pontiac, I guess...

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

I believe they might be the same as I think Westerbeke bought
Universal in the late '80s...so the Universal might be the older
engine.

You are correct that Westerbeke and Universal are the same company.
There is no reason to suspect that the Universal must be older than the
Westerbeke, either trademark can be purchased brand new today.

I suspect Westerbeke may run both lines so they can appoint more dealers in
crowded markets. Dealer "A" is the "exclusive" Westerbeke dealer, but to keep
him hustling and competitive in price they give the same product to Dealer "B"
and call it a Universal instead.

In article ,
rhys wrote:

Anyone past a certain age seems to consider the Perkins 4-108 God's
own diesel in terms of reliability and owner-maintainability, but they
are getting fairly elderly now, as are the boats in which they burble
and shake.

R.

Nothing wrong with a 4-108. I have one that had 40,000 hours on it when
it was rebuilt, top and bottom. It now has another 9,000 hours on it and
is just hitting it's stride. Complete Rebuild Kit for a 4-108 goes for
about $800US. Try getting a rebuild kit for anywhere near that, for any
other engine, in the same power range. This is one engine that has
staying power for years and years.

Bruce in alaska
--
add a 2 before @

Bruce in Alaska wrote in news:bruceg-
:


Nothing wrong with a 4-108. I have one that had 40,000 hours on it when
it was rebuilt, top and bottom. It now has another 9,000 hours on it and
is just hitting it's stride. Complete Rebuild Kit for a 4-108 goes for
about $800US. Try getting a rebuild kit for anywhere near that, for any
other engine, in the same power range. This is one engine that has
staying power for years and years.

Bruce in alaska

I agree with Bruce. I bought one off a sailor out of NC for $1200,
complete (engine, transmission, all the wiring and panel), for Lionheart
with only a few hundred hours on it. General Diesel started it in their
shop, shrugged their shoulders and asked why we bothered to bring it to
them for checkout. It replaced a 4-108 that had a hard life of neglect
from its former owner in Lionheart. The old engine was so loose in the
rings that you had to stop every few hours to drain the diesel oil out of
the crankcase, but it would start instantly without a preheat in FL or SC
every time. It ran 60 PSI oil pressure at operating temp even like this.
Its rear crank seal was gone so dumped the excess crankcase into the
bilge...(c; The "new" 4-108 never had its preheater ever hooked up in the
SE USA. It cranks the first try with no preheat at 40F OAT quite fast.
Lionheart has a spare overhauled 4-108 and transmission, now. The rebuild
of the old engine was very reasonable, as diesel overhauls go. They're
very "cheap to keep".

Larry W4CSC