"Norm" wrote in message
...
Yes, a Shannon would be GREAT. It's just a tad out of our price range

Sometimes we have to tighten up and work an extra year for the boat we want.
I never hear of anyone regretting going a little higher to get more for the
money.

Steve
s/v Good Intentions

Here in Florida, there are more brokers per square mile than tourists.
Personally I agree with Jack and would use yachtworld and maybe pick up a
copy of Sailboat Trader magazine (I don't think Trader online carries all
the listings in the magazine) and save myself 10% off the purchase price.
MMC
"Jack Dale" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:45:20 GMT, (Norm) wrote:

The kids are gone, the house has been sold, most of the junk has been
sold or given away, and after nearly 10 years of being without a boat,
my wife and I are ready to start shopping again!

We just made airline reservations to fly from Juneau Alaska down to
Seattle Washington on the 22nd of April. Wow are we excited

Try a search on Seattle on http://www.yachtworld.com. Use the
advanced search strategy.

Here in Florida, there are more brokers per square mile than tourists.
Personally I agree with Jack and would use yachtworld and maybe pick up a
copy of Sailboat Trader magazine (I don't think Trader online carries all
the listings in the magazine) and save myself 10% off the purchase price.

Aha. Just in time for the Easter Bunny.
Most private sellers (who don't list through brokers) aren't ging through the
hassle of selling privately so they can
offer the boat ten percent cheaper.....they hope to get just as much as anybody
else and put that ten percent in their pocket. :-)

Meanwhile, nobody has done any legwork at all to see whether the boat has a
legitimate, unencumbered document or title before the prospective buyer begins
spending big dough for sureys, etc. Nobody, (certainly not the private seller),
has fear of any recourse from regulatory agencies for any "whoppers" that get
told during the sales process.

To say, "never buy from a private party" makes no more sense than "never buy
from a broker." In the final analysis a good boat and a good deal is where you
find it- whether private or brokered, and there are as many horror stories
involving deception or ignorance by private sellers as with brokers.

One thing we can be absolutely sure of, however: If a private seller intended
to take 10 percent less for his boat he would most likely have *already* listed
it with a broker.
:-)

Norm--

Lots of good advice so far. While you're in the area, you might also want
to flit up to Bellingham. There are a number of decent brokers up there,
too. We bought a Westsail 32 from Bellhaven Marine some years ago, and were
very pleased with the transaction. (And the boat, btw.)

Oldtimer story: we lived in Ketchikan from 1957-60, and there wasn't a
SINGLE sailboat in Thomas Basin, the municipal marina. And except for a few
local sport fishing boats (like our homemade plywood 16-footer) not many
pleasure boats of any sort. It is nice we have more time for sailing
now...)

Everyone with a boat also has a biased opinion about it, but you might look
at the Westsail 42. Most are ketch rigged, but a few have cutter rigs.
We're happy with our 32, which seems like plenty of boat to us, but not a
few couples and even a few single handers skipper the W42's. They are dandy
boats if you like to sail the marine equivalents of Sherman tanks.

Good luck with your search. It's a good part of the fun. (We're looking
into a Victory Tug 37 at the moment, and enjoying the anticipation of a
new-to-us boat.)

Cheers,

Dick Behan
Lopez Island


"Norm" wrote in message
...
The kids are gone, the house has been sold, most of the junk has been
sold or given away, and after nearly 10 years of being without a boat,
my wife and I are ready to start shopping again!

We just made airline reservations to fly from Juneau Alaska down to
Seattle Washington on the 22nd of April. Wow are we excited

Our last boat was a 36' Fuji Ketch. This time we're looking for Sloop
between 38 and 40'. Being in Alaska has made it pretty hard to get an
idea of exactly what boat will work best for us, so we're guessing
we'll have to crawl thru a few before we start getting a clearer
picture. We want something that can be safely taken offshore, holds
adaquate fuel and water, skeg rudder and fin keel with fairly shallow
draft 4 to 5.5' at the most. Some folks have recommended a Morgan 38
a while back, so plan to check one out if possible. Not sure if that
is a very good offshore vessel though. Suggestions???

It's been a long time since we've been in Seattle. Last time I was
there, most of the boat shopping seemed to be around Lake Union. Is
that still correct? Can someone recommend any other areas close by to
check out????

We'd really like to hear some recommendations on boat brokers too. It
would be nice if we could use one that comes recommended rather than
take our chances via email. Any recommondations???

If all works well, we hope to be bringing something back up to Alaska
in June, but if we have to wait another winter, that's ok too.

This has been a great news group. I've been lurking for about 2 years
or so and have really enjoyed the reading.

kl7rs - Norm in Alaska - Almost retired!!!!

One more thing, Norm. Check into 49 North, a free sailing magazine
published in Seattle. (Google up their website in the meantime.) Lots of
ads from both brokers and private sellers are listed. A monthly goldmine.

One more thing, Norm. Check into 49 North, a free sailing magazine
published in Seattle. (Google up their website in the meantime.)

Fat fingered.......look for 48 North instead. :-)

Very good sailing mag, btw.

Congratulations Norm, from the "other" Norm. I'm 6 weeks away from retiring,
and looking for a boat in the PNW also.

You might want to broaden your search area a bit. As others have said,
Bellingham, Anacortes, etc, would be a good place to visit. Most are short
drives from Seattle. (Plus hotel/motel is a little cheaper too).

I've dealt with two outfits in Bellingham as a sailing student....San Juan Sailing
and Bellhaven, and both are a brokerage.
Try www.sanjuansailing.com and www.bellhaven.net
to get the phone numbers. Both are friendly, and I believe have integrity. If
you care to, tell either that "Norm from Oregon" suggested you call.

By all means find a copy of 48 North...or look at their web site, it's THE
sailing rag in the PNW. Bear in mind that the web site doesn't list all the
boats for sale.

I wouldn't dream of suggesting a boat model suitable for your needs,
but I will make one suggestion.....make up a mini-survey sheet listing
boat name, the vitals (make, length, disp, tankage, price, etc), owner/broker,
equipment, etc......and then make a bunch of copies. When you visit
a boat, use the list (a clip-board is handy), to fill out the data on the
spot. You might be tempted to ignore some boats you visit, and quickly decide
you're not interested, but fill out the sheet(s) any way. You're building
a personal data base. Plus, if you're like me, by the time you look at
boat #20, you won't remember what boat #4 was all about. grin

Good luck, and keep us posted....
Norm B


On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:45:20 GMT, (Norm) wrote:

The kids are gone, the house has been sold, most of the junk has been
sold or given away, and after nearly 10 years of being without a boat,
my wife and I are ready to start shopping again!

We just made airline reservations to fly from Juneau Alaska down to
Seattle Washington on the 22nd of April. Wow are we excited

Our last boat was a 36' Fuji Ketch. This time we're looking for Sloop
between 38 and 40'. Being in Alaska has made it pretty hard to get an
idea of exactly what boat will work best for us, so we're guessing
we'll have to crawl thru a few before we start getting a clearer
picture. We want something that can be safely taken offshore, holds
adaquate fuel and water, skeg rudder and fin keel with fairly shallow
draft 4 to 5.5' at the most. Some folks have recommended a Morgan 38
a while back, so plan to check one out if possible. Not sure if that
is a very good offshore vessel though. Suggestions???

It's been a long time since we've been in Seattle. Last time I was
there, most of the boat shopping seemed to be around Lake Union. Is
that still correct? Can someone recommend any other areas close by to
check out????

We'd really like to hear some recommendations on boat brokers too. It
would be nice if we could use one that comes recommended rather than
take our chances via email. Any recommondations???

If all works well, we hope to be bringing something back up to Alaska
in June, but if we have to wait another winter, that's ok too.

This has been a great news group. I've been lurking for about 2 years
or so and have really enjoyed the reading.

kl7rs - Norm in Alaska - Almost retired!!!!

Thanks Norm. You had some great advise. The punch mini-survey sheet
is a great idea. I'm also planning on taking a video camera. I can
put the footage # on the data sheet for quick reference.

I take it your still looking? What have you narrowed your search down
to?

We're in the very beginning stages and I'm guessing we'll be making
several trips before we start to get a good idea of what will work for
us.

I've been told by a couple folks, that very few people look back and
wish they would have gotten a smaller or less expensive boat. I guess
its usually the other way around, people wishing they would have
shelled out just a bit more and gotten something a bit bigger.

I've noticed that boats are generally more expensive in the Pacific NW
than almost anywhere else. I've compared lots of boats on
YachtWorld's web site. 10-25% higher in PNW. It might even be worth
taking a trip back east.

I'll check 48 North too. Thanks.


On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:38:46 -0800, engsol
wrote:

Congratulations Norm, from the "other" Norm. I'm 6 weeks away from retiring,
and looking for a boat in the PNW also.

You might want to broaden your search area a bit. As others have said,
Bellingham, Anacortes, etc, would be a good place to visit. Most are short
drives from Seattle. (Plus hotel/motel is a little cheaper too).

I've dealt with two outfits in Bellingham as a sailing student....San Juan Sailing
and Bellhaven, and both are a brokerage.
Try www.sanjuansailing.com and www.bellhaven.net
to get the phone numbers. Both are friendly, and I believe have integrity. If
you care to, tell either that "Norm from Oregon" suggested you call.

By all means find a copy of 48 North...or look at their web site, it's THE
sailing rag in the PNW. Bear in mind that the web site doesn't list all the
boats for sale.

I wouldn't dream of suggesting a boat model suitable for your needs,
but I will make one suggestion.....make up a mini-survey sheet listing
boat name, the vitals (make, length, disp, tankage, price, etc), owner/broker,
equipment, etc......and then make a bunch of copies. When you visit
a boat, use the list (a clip-board is handy), to fill out the data on the
spot. You might be tempted to ignore some boats you visit, and quickly decide
you're not interested, but fill out the sheet(s) any way. You're building
a personal data base. Plus, if you're like me, by the time you look at
boat #20, you won't remember what boat #4 was all about. grin

Good luck, and keep us posted....
Norm B


On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:45:20 GMT, (Norm) wrote:

The kids are gone, the house has been sold, most of the junk has been
sold or given away, and after nearly 10 years of being without a boat,
my wife and I are ready to start shopping again!

We just made airline reservations to fly from Juneau Alaska down to
Seattle Washington on the 22nd of April. Wow are we excited

Our last boat was a 36' Fuji Ketch. This time we're looking for Sloop
between 38 and 40'. Being in Alaska has made it pretty hard to get an
idea of exactly what boat will work best for us, so we're guessing
we'll have to crawl thru a few before we start getting a clearer
picture. We want something that can be safely taken offshore, holds
adaquate fuel and water, skeg rudder and fin keel with fairly shallow
draft 4 to 5.5' at the most. Some folks have recommended a Morgan 38
a while back, so plan to check one out if possible. Not sure if that
is a very good offshore vessel though. Suggestions???

It's been a long time since we've been in Seattle. Last time I was
there, most of the boat shopping seemed to be around Lake Union. Is
that still correct? Can someone recommend any other areas close by to
check out????

We'd really like to hear some recommendations on boat brokers too. It
would be nice if we could use one that comes recommended rather than
take our chances via email. Any recommondations???

If all works well, we hope to be bringing something back up to Alaska
in June, but if we have to wait another winter, that's ok too.

This has been a great news group. I've been lurking for about 2 years
or so and have really enjoyed the reading.

kl7rs - Norm in Alaska - Almost retired!!!!

I've noticed that boats are generally more expensive in the Pacific NW
than almost anywhere else. I've compared lots of boats on
YachtWorld's web site. 10-25% higher in PNW. It might even be worth
taking a trip back east.

Boat prices are higher here for a couple of reasons. Climate and geography.

First, our constant overcast filters out enough UV to allow older boats to be
in better shape here where the sun appears only three times a year (and then,
only by appointment or divine intervention). You won't find people commonly
repainting the topsides on 10-15 year old boats in the NW due to gel coat
oxidation. By the same token, our climate allows us to use our boats 12 months
a year with no need to haul out for winter. If a boat has more days of
potential use, people will be willing to pay slightly more to own it.

Second, geography. Once away from Puget Sound, it's a long distance to any
place (in the US) that has any significant number of boats for sale. There are
always a few in Portland, but after that you're almost to central CA before you
see any large market availability. That same geography (even moreso than
climate) makes the Pacific NW one of the most desirable places in the US to own
and use a boat.

Big demand, restricted supply, higher prices.

Most folks who have bought a boat elsewhere around the country and relocated it
here have done so because they had to go outside the area to find the boat they
wanted, rather than the deal.

There isn't much gain to be realized by
trying to haul a boat clear across the country for 10-15% of its value in
initial cost savings. Transportation, taking down the rig or removing the
flybridge and putting the boat back together again, and repairing the damage
done during transit will consume a lot of the savings. The time and travel
expense involved with running around the country to personally inspect the
"final four" will consume the rest.

If there were huge savings to be realized by hauling boats here from all around
the country, there would be a lot more people doing it than the few maverick
specialists who seem to be able to scratch out a modest living in the
enterprise.

A few years ago, my office was on a dock where there was a 50-foot yacht
languishing on the moorings. The vessel was a brand name that it reputed to be
top drawer, and very expensive. Seemed that the owner of the boat had purchased
it in San Diego due to a "deal" he found there, and hired a professional
delivery crew to bring it up the coast.

The delivery captain was in a hurry, and ran the boat way too hard into a nasty
storm. Broke the first and second bulkheads.

Insurance refused to pay because the damage was the result of "abuse". Delivery
captain didn't have a pot to pee in. In the end, the buyer wound up spending
several times what he imagined he had originally "saved" to have the boat
rebuilt in a local yard.

If you really want to find a "deal" on a boat,
there's a local company that cooperates closely with some brokerages in Asia.
They really do have some eye-poppin' deals a lot of the time. It's not
inexpensive, however, to fly to Hong Kong to inspect, sea trial, and survey a
boat. For example, on their web page this morning they have a 42' fiberglass
Grand Banks listed for $117k. If the boat is in shape, that's $50k less than
some others ask for identical boats. (But it needs to shipped across the
Pacfic) I'm sure they have a number of good buys on sailboats as well.

http://www.yachtworld.com/internationalmarine/

In article ,
(Norm) wrote:

We'll be coming back up to Alaska for 3 more years. Unless the state
offers a Retirement Incentive Bill. One can only hope!

So is the a Marine Mobile MF/HF rig in your new vessels future?

Bruce in alaska who actually does have a real license....AL7AQ
--
add a 2 before @