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#1
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
This is a trivial question, but it drives me crazy, and maybe somebody
can help me. For my dinghy/davit system I have 4 triple blocks – two for each side. All of them are for 3/8 line. Now here is the problem: Every time when I put the dinghy down and again back the line is twisted and become entangled. Every time I have to spend time to fix it – and really drive me crazy. I use polyester yacht braid. Thanks in advance Mada |
#2
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
On Jun 16, 4:29 am, wrote:
.... Every time when I put the dinghy down and again back the line is twisted and become entangled. ... Hmmm. I don't know, but have you tried coiling your line into your other hand? I suspect you're twisting the line as you coil it. You could test this by throwing the tails out on the deck and running your hands down them to take out the twists and then using the davits. If you're problem gets much better or goes away then the coiling is your problem. If not, beats me... --Tom. |
#3
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
On Jun 16, 11:55 am, "Roger Long" wrote:
It's hardly a trivial question. Getting the twist out of lines so that they don't do this when a load is put on is hard. The snags can hurt you or your boat if they occur somewhere more critical. Suppose the dinghy was your only way to reach someone in the water because other devices had drifted away from them? If you just take the line as it came from the store and run it through the blocks this will probably happen. First, learn to coil properly. Take the new line and start coiling it up, a real coil, hanging from one hand and measuring with the other; not winding around thumb and elbow the way all former girl scouts seem to do. Twist the rope between thumb and forefinger so that each loop hangs exactly parallel and easy with the one before it. With new line, you'll find that the twists build up so you have to stop periodically and whip the uncoiled part around and around in the other direction to work the twist out. Don't accept any tendency for the loops to look like they are trying to go into a figure eight. You may have to go through this process a few times. For lines as short as davit falls, you might also hoist the line up the mast with a halyard and work the twist out. I've heard that towing them astern for a while works wonders but I've never done it. You'll probably still have some tendency to twist under load even after all this. It sounds like you have swivel blocks on your davits. There is really no need for them to swivel in this applications. Replace them with non swivel blocks or put a siezing of wire or marlin around the block and shackle so they can't turn. Another thing that can easily happen with something like dinghy davits is for the block to get turned over when disconnected. It can be a maddening mental exercise to figure out which way it should go back if it twists through the parts. Try hooking the two blocks directly together after disconnecting the dinghy. This will also help keep them from swinging around. -- Roger Long Don't you have to reverse the twist for every other loop, or you are creating twists in the line ? I just do a figure 8 loop instead. Todd |
#4
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
wrote
Don't you have to reverse the twist for every other loop, or you are creating twists in the line ? I just do a figure 8 loop instead. I think Roger's talking about untwisting the tail of the rope as he coils. A problem I've seen with the over and under technique (which I think is what you mean) is that it's really easy to produce a long string of evenly spaced knots when uncoiling it. |
#5
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
Mada,
One other thought. The falls of my davits become more twisted if I leave a half turn around the cleat as I lower. I always used to do this as it took some of the weight but now I take the line all of the way off the cleat before lowering. Ansley Sawyer SV Pacem |
#6
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
wrote in message ... This is a trivial question, but it drives me crazy, and maybe somebody can help me. For my dinghy/davit system I have 4 triple blocks – two for each side. All of them are for 3/8 line. Now here is the problem: Every time when I put the dinghy down and again back the line is twisted and become entangled. Every time I have to spend time to fix it – and really drive me crazy. I use polyester yacht braid. Thanks in advance Mada I suspect it hs something to do with the way you have reeved (roven?)the line through the blocks as braidline itself has no tendency to twist under load. Two triple blocks on each hoist sounds excessive. However if you use these you have to fix the end of the rope at the top and reeve the line so that the fall emerges from the centre sheave of the top block This prevents any tendency for the pull on the fall to twist the whole assembly and for the same reason said fall must finally emerge also from the centre sheave of the bottom block If you do not reeve this system correctly the bottom block will tend to turn over while you are hauling in the slack after launching the dinghy and I suspect that this is the root of your problem. It is more usual for boat hoists to have a triple block at the top and a double block at the bottom since the fall must always emerge from the top block. Therefore the double block at the lower end has a becket on it onto which the other end of the rope is spliced and you must then reeve the rope so that it emerges finally from the centre sheave on the top block, You do not need swivels on the blocks for a dinghy hoist and if you have swivels that may also be part of your problem |
#7
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
On Jun 16, 1:39 pm, "Ernest Scribbler"
wrote: wrote Don't you have to reverse the twist for every other loop, or you are creating twists in the line ? I just do a figure 8 loop instead. I think Roger's talking about untwisting the tail of the rope as he coils. A problem I've seen with the over and under technique (which I think is what you mean) is that it's really easy to produce a long string of evenly spaced knots when uncoiling it. I think you are right there (which is why I like the figure 8 coil), but the very act of: "Twist the rope between thumb and forefinger so that each loop hangs exactly parallel and easy with the one before it. " Creates a half twist in the rope for each coil. If you make alternate twists in opposite directions (see http://www.animatedknots.com/coiling/ ) then there is no twist built up in the rope while you coil it. Todd |
#8
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
Call me old fashioned but I like the look of a regular coil. I've never tried the figure 8 method or even seen it done so I don't know if it work for a hanging coil. -- Roger Long |
#9
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
Call me old fashioned but I like the look of a regular coil. I've never tried the figure 8 method or even seen it done so I don't know if it work for a hanging coil. -- Roger Long You're old fashioned :-) Looks aside it works very well and hangs just like a regular coil. And it does have a better chance of running free after being dropped off the cleat than the round coil. I climbed rocks before I sailed much, but learned the figure 8 from sailors. Todd |
#10
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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Trivial question about entagled lines.
On Mon, 16 Jun 2008 11:55:49 -0400, "Roger Long"
wrote: Don't accept any tendency for the loops to look like they are trying to go into a figure eight. You may have to go through this process a few times. Not sure I agree with that advice. Coiling as a "figure 8" totally eliminates any tendency fo the line to twist or kink. It is one of those time honored traditions of the sea called "faking" or "flaking" the line, and is used for those situations where a long run of line absolutely has to run out quickly and cleanly. Racing sailors routinely do this with spinnaker halyards on big boats to ensure that the takedown goes quickly and smoothly. |
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