On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 23:36:00 +0200, "Edgar"
wrote:


"Herodotus" wrote in message
.. .

Actually, I love the Americanisms such as "I'll fix dinner" - what's
wrong with it? and the various references to the latrine - Little
girl's room", "powder my nose" and so on. Nothing as basic as our
"Where are the toilets?" or "I have to go".

That is reasonably polite, not basic.
Basic is 'Where's the bog'

Here that may be "Where's the crapper?"
Don't know, but the original premise about toilet vs washroom could
well be wrong. Colloquialisms are tricky unless one is very
well-traveled and then paying attention to different groups within the
local population.
There was that "furor" about Jack Paar's WC joke back in the '60's,
and it's possible that many American viewers assumed from it that
Brits might commonly ask "Where's the water closet?"
That they did was probably never true, but I won't say so as I don't
know.
If I were air dropped into England I'd probably start with "Where's
the loo?" and work things out from there.
Again, my perception from reading only - I am prone to doing as the
Romans do, so rapidly adjust.
Here in the Chicago area, bathroom is more common than washroom, but
that may just be my perception, and is also influenced by family.
I certainly haven't studied it closely.
I still often call a refrigerator an icebox.
Oddly enough, my meaning is never lost. Likewise with communicating
with anybody from anywhere about the need of a bathroom.
A quick squat or clutching of one's crotch will always work if
language fails, paying attention to gender of course.
There was a quiz I took when I was about 12 that asked what word you
used for certain devices/appliances. Its purpose was to estimate your
age. The results indicated I was about 50 years old.
I spent many of my formative years with my grandparents, which quickly
explained that discrepancy.
Toilet is obviously French, but always works well anyplace I've been.
Crapper or can usually suffice in comfortable American company, and
porcelain throne also has its use.
If I'm being positively polite and "thoughtful,", I would however pose
the question as "Where is the washroom?"
So back to square one, Peter probably had that right.
He also has cogent views on coffee.
Orwell wrote some interesting essays on language, and I generally
agree with him, unless something works better for me, and this
sentence certainly proves I don't go far out of my way to eliminate
the latinate. Just too much damn work.
Had a lit prof early on who thought "lift" was so much more elegant
than "elevator." Well.........maybe, if you intend to use either word
in verse aimed at Anglo Saxon followers of Orwell.
Anyway, I remember his comment, which is just as important
as its gist.

--Vic

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 01:13:41 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

Orwell wrote some interesting essays on language, and I generally
agree with him, unless something works better for me, and this
sentence certainly proves I don't go far out of my way to eliminate
the latinate. Just too much damn work.
Had a lit prof early on who thought "lift" was so much more elegant
than "elevator." Well.........maybe, if you intend to use either word
in verse aimed at Anglo Saxon followers of Orwell.
Anyway, I remember his comment, which is just as important
as its gist.

--Vic

Hi Vic,
Very thoughtful and interesting reply.

Now about those "lifts" or "elevators". As a five year old learning
English at school for the first time (My grandparents spoke Greek at
home), we were forced to look at the meanings of words and terms -
such as the commonly used "Would you like to come to our place for
dinner" which our teacher said meant that we were to be the dinner -
should be "to dinner". Ridiculous and pendatic in reality but I often
ask people when working in highrises if "lift" and elevate (or) mean
to raise up, does this mean that we should take the stairs when
descending? Some ponder it for days and as yet nobody has come up for
a single word for the Otis thing apart from short descriptive phrases
- same as escalator. Funny language English.

Hope all is well with thee and thine,

cheers
Peter

On 21 Apr 2008 11:49:01 -0500, Dave wrote:

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:58:52 +1000, Herodotus said:

The only word I object to is the Americanism "dude" which is creeping
into Antipodean language and used by those who wish to be seen as hip.
I cannot but object verbally or walk out of a shop when I am addressed
as such.

Have you so far avoided the "like" epidemic-- "I'm like ..... and she's
like.... I'm like....""

I'm often tempted to ask one of those under 30's whether she can complete a
single sentence without using the word "like."

Yes!!!! the bloody term is widespread in Australia these days. It can
be used many times within the same sentence and is often preceded with
"you know" and used as a sentence ending as well. "You know, like...."

Hate it. It grates. shows mu age and growing intolerance

cheers
Peter

"Herodotus" wrote in message
...
On 21 Apr 2008 11:49:01 -0500, Dave wrote:

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:58:52 +1000, Herodotus
said:

The only word I object to is the Americanism "dude" which is creeping
into Antipodean language and used by those who wish to be seen as hip.
I cannot but object verbally or walk out of a shop when I am addressed
as such.

Have you so far avoided the "like" epidemic-- "I'm like ..... and she's
like.... I'm like....""

I'm often tempted to ask one of those under 30's whether she can complete
a
single sentence without using the word "like."

Yes!!!! the bloody term is widespread in Australia these days. It can
be used many times within the same sentence and is often preceded with
"you know" and used as a sentence ending as well. "You know, like...."

Hate it. It grates. shows mu age and growing intolerance

cheers
Peter


"You know, like ... you know."

I heard that once... very short sentence, so I said, "No, I don't know. Like
what?" And, he couldn't explain. So, I said, "then don't say 'you know'
unless I do know."


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com