"pmiller" wrote in message ...
After several years of looking and saving I am finally ready to buy my
first boat. Ive looked at boats from 26 to 34 ft and based on advice from
many people here I am
eliminating everything over 30' as too big for a first boat.
Today I looked at a 30' Sea Ray Sundancer 1989.
The boat will be used on the Chesapeake Bay in the Annapolis MD area.

Is there anyone here familiar with the Sundancers of that
age?

Id love to know if there were any problems with those boats or anything in
particular to look for.

I will of course have a survey done prior to purchase
Ive taken the powerboating course and have a little experience with a 19'
runabout and a 24' Cruise Along
which is now in the Calvert Marine Museum.

Thanks

Paul

Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.

Boating is supposed to be enjoyable, it's not going to be enjoyable
when it comes time for you to dock that boat. You can learn the easy
way with a smaller, easier to handle boat, or you can learn the hard
way with the bigger boat. Your going to look like a fool trying to
dock. It will be very obvious to everyone that you don't know what
your doing. I've seen too many new boaters that bought boats that were
too big for them to handle do a lot of damage with them.

Go with the smaller boat, it's the best advice you'll ever get when it
comes to first time boats.

Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.

I would disagree, based on experience.

My first boat was a 34-foot, single screw trawler. Twenty some years ago. No
bow thruster, no stern thruster.
No serious problem.

To this day, some experienced boaters are known to remark about my current
boat, (not much larger at just 36 feet) "How do you handle a single screw? I
have enough trouble with twins and a thruster!"

Biggest difference? I had some excellent, hands-on instruction from a qualified
instructor who knew what he was doing. Other wise, you are probably right:
if the learning process is going to involve just setting out and bouncing off
everything in sight until some workable substitute for proper technique is
accidentally stumbled upon, we should all start with a very small
dinghy.....preferably an inflatable. :-)

Learning to handle a 21-foot boat teaches you..................how to handle a
21-foot boat. There will still be a learning curve when stepping up to the
larger vessel, and there is no valid reason to be fearful of a medium size
craft like a 30' express cruiser- even as a beginner. Again, the key is going
to be qualified, hands-on instruction in boat operation. Power Squadron and
USCG AUX courses are fine, too, but you won't learn how to handle a boat in a
classroom.

(If you notice the details in the original post, the party isn't even strictly
a beginner.)

Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.

I would disagree, based on experience.

My first boat was a 34-foot, single screw trawler. Twenty some years ago. No
bow thruster, no stern thruster.
No serious problem.

To this day, some experienced boaters are known to remark about my current
boat, (not much larger at just 36 feet) "How do you handle a single screw? I
have enough trouble with twins and a thruster!"

Biggest difference? I had some excellent, hands-on instruction from a qualified
instructor who knew what he was doing. Other wise, you are probably right:
if the learning process is going to involve just setting out and bouncing off
everything in sight until some workable substitute for proper technique is
accidentally stumbled upon, we should all start with a very small
dinghy.....preferably an inflatable. :-)

Learning to handle a 21-foot boat teaches you..................how to handle a
21-foot boat. There will still be a learning curve when stepping up to the
larger vessel, and there is no valid reason to be fearful of a medium size
craft like a 30' express cruiser- even as a beginner. Again, the key is going
to be qualified, hands-on instruction in boat operation. Power Squadron and
USCG AUX courses are fine, too, but you won't learn how to handle a boat in a
classroom.

(If you notice the details in the original post, the party isn't even strictly
a beginner.)

G Gonna agree and disagree(I'm from the school of "boat handlers are
born, not made") with the overall jist of the thread.
If you have the basic understanding of how a boat steers and reacts to a
propeller/propellers, wind and current, to a point (and even beyond),
the size will not really matter.
In fact, the larger boat may even be the better one to learn on, since
it will tend to react more slowly and predictably.
Not everyone will learn and react the same, so my suggestion would be to
look at what you want, but get someone to take you out in it, who knows
what they are doing, and get a feel for how you feel and handle the boat.
It may be too big for you, it may not .... don't just spend 5 minutes,
spend an hour or two, and BG be brutally honest with yourself ....you
may be better off with a motorhome.

otn

PS My first powerdriven boat, other than a few outboards, was a 45'
"Liberty Launch" with a tiller and bell signals for the engine .... talk
about a learning experience!

Gould 0738 wrote:
Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.


I would disagree, based on experience.

My first boat was a 34-foot, single screw trawler. Twenty some years ago. No
bow thruster, no stern thruster.
No serious problem.

To this day, some experienced boaters are known to remark about my current
boat, (not much larger at just 36 feet) "How do you handle a single screw? I
have enough trouble with twins and a thruster!"

Biggest difference? I had some excellent, hands-on instruction from a qualified
instructor who knew what he was doing. Other wise, you are probably right:
if the learning process is going to involve just setting out and bouncing off
everything in sight until some workable substitute for proper technique is
accidentally stumbled upon, we should all start with a very small
dinghy.....preferably an inflatable. :-)

G Gonna agree and disagree(I'm from the school of "boat handlers are
born, not made") with the overall jist of the thread.
If you have the basic understanding of how a boat steers and reacts to a
propeller/propellers, wind and current, to a point (and even beyond),
the size will not really matter.
In fact, the larger boat may even be the better one to learn on, since
it will tend to react more slowly and predictably.
Not everyone will learn and react the same, so my suggestion would be to
look at what you want, but get someone to take you out in it, who knows
what they are doing, and get a feel for how you feel and handle the boat.
It may be too big for you, it may not .... don't just spend 5 minutes,
spend an hour or two, and BG be brutally honest with yourself ....you
may be better off with a motorhome.

otn

PS My first powerdriven boat, other than a few outboards, was a 45'
"Liberty Launch" with a tiller and bell signals for the engine .... talk
about a learning experience!

Gould 0738 wrote:
Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.


I would disagree, based on experience.

My first boat was a 34-foot, single screw trawler. Twenty some years ago. No
bow thruster, no stern thruster.
No serious problem.

To this day, some experienced boaters are known to remark about my current
boat, (not much larger at just 36 feet) "How do you handle a single screw? I
have enough trouble with twins and a thruster!"

Biggest difference? I had some excellent, hands-on instruction from a qualified
instructor who knew what he was doing. Other wise, you are probably right:
if the learning process is going to involve just setting out and bouncing off
everything in sight until some workable substitute for proper technique is
accidentally stumbled upon, we should all start with a very small
dinghy.....preferably an inflatable. :-)

"John" wrote in message
om...
"pmiller" wrote in message
...
After several years of looking and saving I am finally ready to buy my
first boat. Ive looked at boats from 26 to 34 ft and based on advice
from
many people here I am
eliminating everything over 30' as too big for a first boat.
Today I looked at a 30' Sea Ray Sundancer 1989.
The boat will be used on the Chesapeake Bay in the Annapolis MD area.

Is there anyone here familiar with the Sundancers of that
age?

Id love to know if there were any problems with those boats or anything
in
particular to look for.

I will of course have a survey done prior to purchase
Ive taken the powerboating course and have a little experience with a
19'
runabout and a 24' Cruise Along
which is now in the Calvert Marine Museum.

Thanks

Paul

Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.

Boating is supposed to be enjoyable, it's not going to be enjoyable
when it comes time for you to dock that boat. You can learn the easy
way with a smaller, easier to handle boat, or you can learn the hard
way with the bigger boat. Your going to look like a fool trying to
dock. It will be very obvious to everyone that you don't know what
your doing. I've seen too many new boaters that bought boats that were
too big for them to handle do a lot of damage with them.

Go with the smaller boat, it's the best advice you'll ever get when it
comes to first time boats.

I own a 1997 Sea Ray 290 Sundancer - LOA 32 feet. This is my first boat and
I can honestly say that I'm glad I purchased a boat of this size. Sure,
there was a very steep learning curve and some stupid mistakes in the
beginning. I'm into my 4th year with the boat and am quite comfortable
handling her around docks. First year, there was what I like to refer to as
"major pucker factor" - especially approaching a docking situation. I
always made sure I used the ehad before getting near the dock!! Only advice
I can offer is take your time, go slow, ask for assistance and get someone
who knows how to handle boats teach you a thing or two.

Have fun,
Sandy K.

"John" wrote in message
om...
"pmiller" wrote in message
...
After several years of looking and saving I am finally ready to buy my
first boat. Ive looked at boats from 26 to 34 ft and based on advice
from
many people here I am
eliminating everything over 30' as too big for a first boat.
Today I looked at a 30' Sea Ray Sundancer 1989.
The boat will be used on the Chesapeake Bay in the Annapolis MD area.

Is there anyone here familiar with the Sundancers of that
age?

Id love to know if there were any problems with those boats or anything
in
particular to look for.

I will of course have a survey done prior to purchase
Ive taken the powerboating course and have a little experience with a
19'
runabout and a 24' Cruise Along
which is now in the Calvert Marine Museum.

Thanks

Paul

Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.

Boating is supposed to be enjoyable, it's not going to be enjoyable
when it comes time for you to dock that boat. You can learn the easy
way with a smaller, easier to handle boat, or you can learn the hard
way with the bigger boat. Your going to look like a fool trying to
dock. It will be very obvious to everyone that you don't know what
your doing. I've seen too many new boaters that bought boats that were
too big for them to handle do a lot of damage with them.

Go with the smaller boat, it's the best advice you'll ever get when it
comes to first time boats.

I own a 1997 Sea Ray 290 Sundancer - LOA 32 feet. This is my first boat and
I can honestly say that I'm glad I purchased a boat of this size. Sure,
there was a very steep learning curve and some stupid mistakes in the
beginning. I'm into my 4th year with the boat and am quite comfortable
handling her around docks. First year, there was what I like to refer to as
"major pucker factor" - especially approaching a docking situation. I
always made sure I used the ehad before getting near the dock!! Only advice
I can offer is take your time, go slow, ask for assistance and get someone
who knows how to handle boats teach you a thing or two.

Have fun,
Sandy K.

"Sandy K." wrote in message ...
"John" wrote in message
om...
"pmiller" wrote in message
...
After several years of looking and saving I am finally ready to buy my
first boat. Ive looked at boats from 26 to 34 ft and based on advice
from
many people here I am
eliminating everything over 30' as too big for a first boat.
Today I looked at a 30' Sea Ray Sundancer 1989.
The boat will be used on the Chesapeake Bay in the Annapolis MD area.

Is there anyone here familiar with the Sundancers of that
age?

Id love to know if there were any problems with those boats or anything
in
particular to look for.

I will of course have a survey done prior to purchase
Ive taken the powerboating course and have a little experience with a
19'
runabout and a 24' Cruise Along
which is now in the Calvert Marine Museum.

Thanks

Paul

Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.

Boating is supposed to be enjoyable, it's not going to be enjoyable
when it comes time for you to dock that boat. You can learn the easy
way with a smaller, easier to handle boat, or you can learn the hard
way with the bigger boat. Your going to look like a fool trying to
dock. It will be very obvious to everyone that you don't know what
your doing. I've seen too many new boaters that bought boats that were
too big for them to handle do a lot of damage with them.

Go with the smaller boat, it's the best advice you'll ever get when it
comes to first time boats.

I own a 1997 Sea Ray 290 Sundancer - LOA 32 feet. This is my first boat and
I can honestly say that I'm glad I purchased a boat of this size. Sure,
there was a very steep learning curve and some stupid mistakes in the
beginning. I'm into my 4th year with the boat and am quite comfortable
handling her around docks. First year, there was what I like to refer to as
"major pucker factor" - especially approaching a docking situation. I
always made sure I used the ehad before getting near the dock!! Only advice
I can offer is take your time, go slow, ask for assistance and get someone
who knows how to handle boats teach you a thing or two.

Have fun,
Sandy K.

I agree with the idea of asking someone to "show you the ropes", but
sadly, a lot of people don't. I have friends that are boat dealers,
they will tell you they can't beleave how many people with no
experiance buy large boats and just show up on their own expecting it
to be "like driving a car". Had you spent some time on the water with
a smaller boat before you bought the one you now have, that "pucker
factor" time would have been reduced to a few times out on the boat,
instead of a year long. A lot of this also has to do with what kind of
docking facilities you will be using, how congested the waterways you
will be on are, and the depth, width and currents of the waterways.
Additionally, few people who have never boated before are capable of
knowing just what kind of boat will suit their needs. They know what
they like, they know what they think they will need and they know what
appeals to them. But they know very little about boats and boating,
what's important, and what's not. They frequently find themselves a
year or two later with a boat that does not suit their needs.

"Sandy K." wrote in message ...
"John" wrote in message
om...
"pmiller" wrote in message
...
After several years of looking and saving I am finally ready to buy my
first boat. Ive looked at boats from 26 to 34 ft and based on advice
from
many people here I am
eliminating everything over 30' as too big for a first boat.
Today I looked at a 30' Sea Ray Sundancer 1989.
The boat will be used on the Chesapeake Bay in the Annapolis MD area.

Is there anyone here familiar with the Sundancers of that
age?

Id love to know if there were any problems with those boats or anything
in
particular to look for.

I will of course have a survey done prior to purchase
Ive taken the powerboating course and have a little experience with a
19'
runabout and a 24' Cruise Along
which is now in the Calvert Marine Museum.

Thanks

Paul

Paul,

A 30 foot boat is still too big for a first boat. Get a boat around 21
feet long and learn what your doing with it, then move up after two
years. It's a boat, not a car, and it takes time to learn to operate a
boat properly.

Boating is supposed to be enjoyable, it's not going to be enjoyable
when it comes time for you to dock that boat. You can learn the easy
way with a smaller, easier to handle boat, or you can learn the hard
way with the bigger boat. Your going to look like a fool trying to
dock. It will be very obvious to everyone that you don't know what
your doing. I've seen too many new boaters that bought boats that were
too big for them to handle do a lot of damage with them.

Go with the smaller boat, it's the best advice you'll ever get when it
comes to first time boats.

I own a 1997 Sea Ray 290 Sundancer - LOA 32 feet. This is my first boat and
I can honestly say that I'm glad I purchased a boat of this size. Sure,
there was a very steep learning curve and some stupid mistakes in the
beginning. I'm into my 4th year with the boat and am quite comfortable
handling her around docks. First year, there was what I like to refer to as
"major pucker factor" - especially approaching a docking situation. I
always made sure I used the ehad before getting near the dock!! Only advice
I can offer is take your time, go slow, ask for assistance and get someone
who knows how to handle boats teach you a thing or two.

Have fun,
Sandy K.

I agree with the idea of asking someone to "show you the ropes", but
sadly, a lot of people don't. I have friends that are boat dealers,
they will tell you they can't beleave how many people with no
experiance buy large boats and just show up on their own expecting it
to be "like driving a car". Had you spent some time on the water with
a smaller boat before you bought the one you now have, that "pucker
factor" time would have been reduced to a few times out on the boat,
instead of a year long. A lot of this also has to do with what kind of
docking facilities you will be using, how congested the waterways you
will be on are, and the depth, width and currents of the waterways.
Additionally, few people who have never boated before are capable of
knowing just what kind of boat will suit their needs. They know what
they like, they know what they think they will need and they know what
appeals to them. But they know very little about boats and boating,
what's important, and what's not. They frequently find themselves a
year or two later with a boat that does not suit their needs.

They know what
they like, they know what they think they will need and they know what
appeals to them. But they know very little about boats and boating,
what's important, and what's not. They frequently find themselves a
year or two later with a boat that does not suit their needs.


A lot of boaters end up with a boat that proves to be less than ideal after a
season or two.

I still bristle at the (very common) suggestion that a prospective boater who
has done enough considering and evaluating to know he or she is looking for the
characteristics commonly associated with a 30-foot express cruiser should,
instead, buy a 20-foot runabout. That removes ending up with the "wrong" boat
from a group of possibilities and promotes it to an absolute certainty.

More people probably get out of boating because they start off with a boat that
is too small, too light, (and powered by a worn out, cantankerous, single
gasoline engine) than leave the pastime because they bought a boat that was of
adequate size and displacement for their intended purposes.