I am not asking you to believe it nor to I have to prove anything, I have
nothing to gain from it.
What I can say it that you better take some Gravol before or at the
beginning of the storm.
The other point is you better be well anchored to your cockpit and forget
about using the head.
BTW where to you use your boat?

"Bob" wrote in message
ups.com...

NE Sailboat wrote:
"I got involved in 40 foot waves with a 27 feet sailboat. ..."

I don't believe this for one moment. 40' waves? And you were in a 27'
boat?

Total nonsense.

================================================== =========

If you are to post, at least post something rational

================================================== ====



Not really. One of the most fun/exciting times sailing was me, my cow
dog, a six pack, and my 15' sprit sail dory.............. oh, and 25'
seas. Okay, we call em swells here. How know 25'? USCG Sea State and in
the bottom it was twice the length of myh unstayed fir mast.

Might want to ask where the guy in the 27' boat does his sailing.

NOw I did not mention other conditions but the 25' seas sure sounds
grande, no?

I am not asking you to believe it nor to I have to prove anything, I have
nothing to gain from it.
What I can say it that you better take some Gravol before or at the
beginning of the storm.
The other point is you better be well anchored to your cockpit and forget
about using the head.
BTW where to you use your boat?
=======================

I believe you and Britney Spears will make a lovely couple.

With those 40 footers keeping you in the "doghouse" and Britney with "no"
underwear .......... a wedding made in heaven.

========================================

I am curious though .. did you happen to dream about a big ship and a big
wave ......... maybe just maybe ..???

A simple plot: a tidal wave knocks a ship upside down and a handful of
survivors have to climb to the bottom of the ship at the surface before the
ship sinks. They are led by a fanatical preacher (Gene Hackman) who
conflicts with an ex-cop (Ernest Borgnine) and his ex-hooker wife (Stella
Stevens). Jack Albertson (WILLY WONKA) and Shelley Winters are an elderly
Jewish couple who are on their way to see their new grandchild. Pamela Sue
Martin (TV's Nancy Drew) and Eric Shea (like Bobby Brady, but more annoying)
are brother and sister on their way to meet their parents. Roddy McDowall (a
fantastic actor) is wasted as a ship hand who dies rather quick. Red Buttons
(PETE'S DRAGON) is an elderly gentleman who helps the ship's lounge singer
(Carol Lynley) retain her sanity. Arthur O'Connell is a strict reverend who
refuses to go along with Hackman. Leslie Nielsen makes a cameo as the ship's
captain who dies during the tidal wave.


Do you call your 27 footer ....... The Poseidon ?????????????????????????


================================================== =============
wrote in message
...
I am not asking you to believe it nor to I have to prove anything, I have
nothing to gain from it.
What I can say it that you better take some Gravol before or at the
beginning of the storm.
The other point is you better be well anchored to your cockpit and forget
about using the head.
BTW where to you use your boat?

"Bob" wrote in message
ups.com...

NE Sailboat wrote:
"I got involved in 40 foot waves with a 27 feet sailboat. ..."

I don't believe this for one moment. 40' waves? And you were in a 27'
boat?

Total nonsense.

================================================== =========

If you are to post, at least post something rational

================================================== ====



Not really. One of the most fun/exciting times sailing was me, my cow
dog, a six pack, and my 15' sprit sail dory.............. oh, and 25'
seas. Okay, we call em swells here. How know 25'? USCG Sea State and in
the bottom it was twice the length of myh unstayed fir mast.

Might want to ask where the guy in the 27' boat does his sailing.

NOw I did not mention other conditions but the 25' seas sure sounds
grande, no?

Might want to ask where the guy in the 27' boat does his sailing.

Here we have to best of both world.
I use my boat on the St. John river system, the Bay of Fundy, the coast of
Nova Scotia and Maine.

wrote in message
...
I am not asking you to believe it nor to I have to prove anything, I have
nothing to gain from it.
What I can say it that you better take some Gravol before or at the
beginning of the storm.
The other point is you better be well anchored to your cockpit and forget
about using the head.
BTW where to you use your boat?

"Bob" wrote in message
ups.com...

NE Sailboat wrote:
"I got involved in 40 foot waves with a 27 feet sailboat. ..."

I don't believe this for one moment. 40' waves? And you were in a 27'
boat?

Total nonsense.

================================================== =========

If you are to post, at least post something rational

================================================== ====



Not really. One of the most fun/exciting times sailing was me, my cow
dog, a six pack, and my 15' sprit sail dory.............. oh, and 25'
seas. Okay, we call em swells here. How know 25'? USCG Sea State and in
the bottom it was twice the length of myh unstayed fir mast.

Might want to ask where the guy in the 27' boat does his sailing.

NOw I did not mention other conditions but the 25' seas sure sounds
grande, no?

Quote"With those 40 footers keeping you in the "doghouse".Unquote


With 40 footers, you do not stay in the doghouse (cabin) unless you are well
attached to the floor to prevent injuries

For sanitary reasons I prefer to be attached outside in the cockpit with
more than one anchor points.



"NE Sailboat" wrote in message
news:2gzeh.932$e26.40@trndny04...
I am not asking you to believe it nor to I have to prove anything, I have
nothing to gain from it.
What I can say it that you better take some Gravol before or at the
beginning of the storm.
The other point is you better be well anchored to your cockpit and forget
about using the head.
BTW where to you use your boat?
=======================

I believe you and Britney Spears will make a lovely couple.

With those 40 footers keeping you in the "doghouse" and Britney with "no"
underwear .......... a wedding made in heaven.

========================================

I am curious though .. did you happen to dream about a big ship and a big
wave ......... maybe just maybe ..???

A simple plot: a tidal wave knocks a ship upside down and a handful of
survivors have to climb to the bottom of the ship at the surface before
the ship sinks. They are led by a fanatical preacher (Gene Hackman) who
conflicts with an ex-cop (Ernest Borgnine) and his ex-hooker wife (Stella
Stevens). Jack Albertson (WILLY WONKA) and Shelley Winters are an elderly
Jewish couple who are on their way to see their new grandchild. Pamela Sue
Martin (TV's Nancy Drew) and Eric Shea (like Bobby Brady, but more
annoying) are brother and sister on their way to meet their parents. Roddy
McDowall (a fantastic actor) is wasted as a ship hand who dies rather
quick. Red Buttons (PETE'S DRAGON) is an elderly gentleman who helps the
ship's lounge singer (Carol Lynley) retain her sanity. Arthur O'Connell is
a strict reverend who refuses to go along with Hackman. Leslie Nielsen
makes a cameo as the ship's captain who dies during the tidal wave.


Do you call your 27 footer ....... The Poseidon ?????????????????????????


================================================== =============
wrote in message
...
I am not asking you to believe it nor to I have to prove anything, I have
nothing to gain from it.
What I can say it that you better take some Gravol before or at the
beginning of the storm.
The other point is you better be well anchored to your cockpit and forget
about using the head.
BTW where to you use your boat?

"Bob" wrote in message
ups.com...

NE Sailboat wrote:
"I got involved in 40 foot waves with a 27 feet sailboat. ..."

I don't believe this for one moment. 40' waves? And you were in a 27'
boat?

Total nonsense.

================================================== =========

If you are to post, at least post something rational

================================================== ====



Not really. One of the most fun/exciting times sailing was me, my cow
dog, a six pack, and my 15' sprit sail dory.............. oh, and 25'
seas. Okay, we call em swells here. How know 25'? USCG Sea State and in
the bottom it was twice the length of myh unstayed fir mast.

Might want to ask where the guy in the 27' boat does his sailing.

NOw I did not mention other conditions but the 25' seas sure sounds
grande, no?

NE Sailboat wrote:
I also disagree completely with your opinion. Single hand sailing is
hard
work, dangerous, lonely, etc. Just leaving whatever mooring, dock
you might be attached to is tough. Unless you have more than two
arms?

It's not my opinion you are disagreing with, it is my experience. For you,
it may be hard, lonely, dangerous, work but I find it relaxing, stimulating,
and even medative. This applies to docking as well. My landings in the
slip from hell are almost always smoother and better when I'm alone because
I'm fully focused and able to act with exact timing instead of worrying
whether the crew will step off at the right moment, remember to put a turn
on the cleat instead of pulling from chest height in a panic, etc.

I do a lot of things slower and the preplanning required makes for a lot of
the enjoyable mental exercise. Where I might just cast off and back out
with a crew, I will move the boat to a different position, double lines back
short enough that they can't foul the prop but will just fall off the horn
of the cleats when I start moving. As I back out, there is almost always
some helpful person on the dock yelling, "You forgot your dock lines!" but I
just motor out into the open and walk around calmly retrieving them.

Try buying two bow and stern lines each about 3/4 the length of your boat.
Take time to lead them outside everything with the ends tied together. You
can then step ashore with the ability to control both ends of the boat.
After making on line fast, the other will be right there without falling in
the water or being on the deck of the boat that has blown just out of reach.

I do all this with two arms and, as I said, it is easier than with any but a
very experienced crew.

Then, once released, the project of putting up the main, getting
everything together ,, et all.

It's not a project. It's seamanship. It's why we spend all this money to
be able to enjoy this.

And the big issue is the helm! Unless you are the first person on
earth who can be in two places at once. Someone, must steer.

You are not doing this right. I sometimes have to go back and make a helm
adjustment but it's not a big deal. I usually get everything ready to
hoist, go back and position the boat, and then haul away. My boat is as
quick turning as any when unattended. If I can do this, you should easily
be able to manage it in your long keel Bristol 32.

Little things learned over 43 years help. Are you overhauling your sheets
before hoisting? The drag of a partially hoisted sail pulling the sheets
through the blocks will accellerate and turn the boat. If the sail can
swing freely, it will have less effect on the boat.

I get very frustrated. One minute I'm pulling on a sheet, next I'm
back resetting the helm

This gets close to the core problem. Attitude is important. Once you get
frustrated, the parts of the mind that anticipate, stratagize, and react
constructively to unexpected problems begin to shut down. This is above
all, a mental exercise. Nothing will help as much as learning to get into a
"zone" where snags are just something you deal with.

But :::: the helm! That rotten helm.

Come on, the Bristol 32 has about as sweet a helm as you are ever going to
find on a sailboat. My E32 has marvelous control authority but her least
attractive trait is that she turns instantly and quickly as soon as you let
go. If I can do all this stuff calmly on an E32, you can do it on a B32.
Do you have a wheel? If so learn how to use the brake. Sometimes setting
it so it just drags works better than locking it. If you have a tiller, look
at one of those "Tiller Tamers".


At the end of the day .... the docking, mooring. I hate this.

There's the nub of the problem. Have you considered golf? You'll never do
it right unless you enjoy it, even when it isn't going right.

I'd rather have a crewmate. Someone to help out.

Well, as to why you don't have a crewmate, I just won't touch that with a
ten foot pole. I will say however, that you are much more likely to find or
retain a crewmate if you learn how to do everything calmly by yourself and
project a reassuring sense of competence and control. My current number one
crew detested boating up until last spring. Sailing or boating with her
former husband was like being in a storm at sea. It was a constant crisis
from the time they left the dock until they returned during which everything
she did was wrong. Now she is completely in love with cruising and looking
forward eagerly to going to Newfoundland, Labrador, and even beyond.

One thing I brought with me from aviation was the concept of practice. If
you are going out and just starting to cruise, as it sounds like you did
last summer, you are setting yourself up for frustration. Now that you know
the boat, plan on a few days next spring with no goals other than practice.
Put the sails up and down, dock and undock. Try different things. Think
ahead. Think of the snags not as frustraging interruptions but as the keys
to doing it smoothly by anticipating them.

Experience helps but none of this can be done by rote. Attitude and getting
in to a zone of calm and creative problem solving is vital.
The brain also has a way of processing lessons over time when you get away.
The improvement in my handling of the boat this summer over the first was
amazing, right from the first day. You'll find next season much easier.
But, only if you get your attitude adjusted.

--
Roger Long

NE Sailboat wrote:
"I got involved in 40 foot waves with a 27 feet sailboat. ..."

I don't believe this for one moment. 40' waves? And you were in a
27' boat?

The waves were 20 feet. How do I know this? During the time that I was
researching sailing vessel casualties and working on the project to help
write the stability regulations for sailing school vessels, the accuracy of
wind and sea state reports were a significant issue so I looked into these
questions quite a bit.

There are solid physical reasons why even the most experience sailors
overestimate wave heights by about 100%. These have to do with the motion
on the wave face that makes the local "down", or direction a pendulum would
point, be perpendicular to the face of the wave instead of towards the
center of the earth. This is one of the illusions that promotes
seasickness.

There is a fairly precise method of measuring wave height. Even knowing all
these things, I look at waves I've just measured as six feet and I could
still swear that they are 12. In fact, a very reliable way to measure wave
height is to simply take your best guess and cut it in half.

--
Roger Long

On Sat, 09 Dec 2006 13:11:53 GMT, "NE Sailboat"
wrote:

I still think you should see if Paris Hilton will come along with you on
your single handed cruise. She and I have broken up.

You could probably get the leak fixed at any good vinyl repair shop.

Maybe you were too rough on her.

Roger ,,, look at the buoy reports .. I can't seem to remember off my head
but some web page has the reports from the offshore buoys. Such info as
wave height, wind, water temperature, etc.

This might be a weather report site ???????? I am going to look...

If the sailor was on a 27' boat and the waves were 40' high .... that is
over 4 stories high.

If he is going into the waves? What if he is going with them? Holy ****
,,, that is one huge surf ride.


=====================
"Roger Long" wrote in message
news
NE Sailboat wrote:
"I got involved in 40 foot waves with a 27 feet sailboat. ..."

I don't believe this for one moment. 40' waves? And you were in a
27' boat?

The waves were 20 feet. How do I know this? During the time that I was
researching sailing vessel casualties and working on the project to help
write the stability regulations for sailing school vessels, the accuracy
of wind and sea state reports were a significant issue so I looked into
these questions quite a bit.

There are solid physical reasons why even the most experience sailors
overestimate wave heights by about 100%. These have to do with the
motion on the wave face that makes the local "down", or direction a
pendulum would point, be perpendicular to the face of the wave instead of
towards the center of the earth. This is one of the illusions that
promotes seasickness.

There is a fairly precise method of measuring wave height. Even knowing
all these things, I look at waves I've just measured as six feet and I
could still swear that they are 12. In fact, a very reliable way to
measure wave height is to simply take your best guess and cut it in half.

--
Roger Long

Roger ,, your long posting brings up a number of subjects ,, here is my
answers to some.

It is my opinion that single handed sailing is dangerous. Yet, I spent most
of last summer single handing. Let's face it, **** happens. When you are
ten miles offshore and **** happens and you are by yourself ..............

Is it relaxing? Yes, that I agree. But it could be just as relaxing with a
couple of good crewmates.

Docking a boat by myself isn't my worry. The worry, or apprehension is
caused by the other boats which I might bang into. I don't want to miss a
little and smash into some motor boat. I don't dock very often anyway, but
I don't like to do it when I am in a busy area.

You go on as if I have no experience. 31 years, sailing. That is some
experience, I'd say.

And, I still would rather have a crewmate!

As for going out cruising ... I have cruised from Conn, to Maine. I will be
out again next summer.

Crewmate of not, I will be out cruising. But, I'd still rather have someone
along.

There is a reason that Joshua Slocum became so famous.

The first person to
complete a solo circumnavigation was Joshua Slocum. Slocum was a retired
Master Mariner, originally from Canada, but subsequently a citizen of the
USA. He sailed in 1895 on a route that took him across the Atlantic, down
South America and through the Strait of Magellan, and then on to Australia,
South Africa and home. He had rebuilt his 35 foot sloop Spray by himself
before he sailed and proved a good and safe sailboat bringing him safely
home in 1898.

Even with the publicity gained by Slocum there was no attempt to repeat his
voyage for more than 20 years and this, again, was also in a boat built by
the sailor. In 1921 Harry Pigeon set off from California in his 35-foot yawl
Islander and completed a fairly uneventful circumnavigation. Alain Gerbault
of France followed in 1924 in his 39-foot cutter Firecrest. The year 1942
would appear an unlikely time to try to circumnavigate the world, but that
was when Vito Dumas set out from his home in Argentina in his ketch Legh II,
making the voyage completely in the Southern Hemisphere.


More than 20 years passed before anyone attempted another solo
circumnavigation. This time it wasn't a cruise like the previous voyages but
an attempt to beat the sailing times of the great Clipper ships. Francis
Chichester set out from England in his 56-foot ketch Gypsy Moth IV taking
107 days to reach Sydney. After a re-fit he continued his voyage, which
totaled 274 days at sea. Even as he returned Alec Rose was setting out in
his 36-footer Lively Lady and completed his circumnavigation, with two
stops, in 11 months.

After Francis Chichester brought Gipsy Moth IV back to Plymouth in 1967, he
challenged all single-handed sailors and adventurers. In his mind a nonstop,
solo circumnavigation was the only voyage left. Although a non-stop voyage
was seemed an impossible achievement, people were soon announcing their
plans to make the attempt.

Chichester's challenge manifested itself in the 1968 Sunday Times Golden
Globe. In January of 1969 Robin Knox-Johnston answered Chischester's call in
his 32-foot ketch Suhaili, after a 9 month beating though the Southern
Ocean. Knox-Johnston proved that what once was though impossible, was indeed
possible and in fact possible with one of the slowest boats to have actually
crossed an ocean.

After the Golden Globe most of the circumnavigators were cruises. In 1970
21-year-old Robin Lee Graham made history by becoming the youngest person to
solo circumnavigate the globe. He completed most of his 5 year journey in
the 22-foot Lapworth sloop Dove. After Graham completed his journey many
people realized that a circumnavigation or even a journey across an ocean
was possible and in fact within reach of people with just a little bit of
sailing experience.
========================

If single handing is as easy as you make it out to be ....... why are the
above folks so revered.

==========

Roger, I appreciate our differences on this subject and your opinion. If
you see me out on the high seas next summer say hello.






===============




"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
NE Sailboat wrote:
I also disagree completely with your opinion. Single hand sailing is
hard
work, dangerous, lonely, etc. Just leaving whatever mooring, dock
you might be attached to is tough. Unless you have more than two
arms?

It's not my opinion you are disagreing with, it is my experience. For
you, it may be hard, lonely, dangerous, work but I find it relaxing,
stimulating, and even medative. This applies to docking as well. My
landings in the slip from hell are almost always smoother and better when
I'm alone because I'm fully focused and able to act with exact timing
instead of worrying whether the crew will step off at the right moment,
remember to put a turn on the cleat instead of pulling from chest height
in a panic, etc.

I do a lot of things slower and the preplanning required makes for a lot
of the enjoyable mental exercise. Where I might just cast off and back
out with a crew, I will move the boat to a different position, double
lines back short enough that they can't foul the prop but will just fall
off the horn of the cleats when I start moving. As I back out, there is
almost always some helpful person on the dock yelling, "You forgot your
dock lines!" but I just motor out into the open and walk around calmly
retrieving them.

Try buying two bow and stern lines each about 3/4 the length of your boat.
Take time to lead them outside everything with the ends tied together.
You can then step ashore with the ability to control both ends of the
boat. After making on line fast, the other will be right there without
falling in the water or being on the deck of the boat that has blown just
out of reach.

I do all this with two arms and, as I said, it is easier than with any but
a very experienced crew.

Then, once released, the project of putting up the main, getting
everything together ,, et all.

It's not a project. It's seamanship. It's why we spend all this money to
be able to enjoy this.

And the big issue is the helm! Unless you are the first person on
earth who can be in two places at once. Someone, must steer.

You are not doing this right. I sometimes have to go back and make a helm
adjustment but it's not a big deal. I usually get everything ready to
hoist, go back and position the boat, and then haul away. My boat is as
quick turning as any when unattended. If I can do this, you should easily
be able to manage it in your long keel Bristol 32.

Little things learned over 43 years help. Are you overhauling your sheets
before hoisting? The drag of a partially hoisted sail pulling the sheets
through the blocks will accellerate and turn the boat. If the sail can
swing freely, it will have less effect on the boat.

I get very frustrated. One minute I'm pulling on a sheet, next I'm
back resetting the helm

This gets close to the core problem. Attitude is important. Once you get
frustrated, the parts of the mind that anticipate, stratagize, and react
constructively to unexpected problems begin to shut down. This is above
all, a mental exercise. Nothing will help as much as learning to get into
a "zone" where snags are just something you deal with.

But :::: the helm! That rotten helm.

Come on, the Bristol 32 has about as sweet a helm as you are ever going to
find on a sailboat. My E32 has marvelous control authority but her least
attractive trait is that she turns instantly and quickly as soon as you
let go. If I can do all this stuff calmly on an E32, you can do it on a
B32. Do you have a wheel? If so learn how to use the brake. Sometimes
setting it so it just drags works better than locking it. If you have a
tiller, look at one of those "Tiller Tamers".


At the end of the day .... the docking, mooring. I hate this.

There's the nub of the problem. Have you considered golf? You'll never
do it right unless you enjoy it, even when it isn't going right.

I'd rather have a crewmate. Someone to help out.

Well, as to why you don't have a crewmate, I just won't touch that with a
ten foot pole. I will say however, that you are much more likely to find
or retain a crewmate if you learn how to do everything calmly by yourself
and project a reassuring sense of competence and control. My current
number one crew detested boating up until last spring. Sailing or boating
with her former husband was like being in a storm at sea. It was a
constant crisis from the time they left the dock until they returned
during which everything she did was wrong. Now she is completely in love
with cruising and looking forward eagerly to going to Newfoundland,
Labrador, and even beyond.

One thing I brought with me from aviation was the concept of practice. If
you are going out and just starting to cruise, as it sounds like you did
last summer, you are setting yourself up for frustration. Now that you
know the boat, plan on a few days next spring with no goals other than
practice. Put the sails up and down, dock and undock. Try different
things. Think ahead. Think of the snags not as frustraging interruptions
but as the keys to doing it smoothly by anticipating them.

Experience helps but none of this can be done by rote. Attitude and
getting in to a zone of calm and creative problem solving is vital.
The brain also has a way of processing lessons over time when you get
away. The improvement in my handling of the boat this summer over the
first was amazing, right from the first day. You'll find next season much
easier. But, only if you get your attitude adjusted.

--
Roger Long

Roger Long wrote:
There are solid physical reasons why even the most experience sailors
overestimate wave heights by about 100%.

Roger,
It may be true that some overestimate wave heights by this much, but it
is hardly universal. For moderate waves, I am quite confident in my
estimates. It's really quite simple. If you know the height of your
eye above the water as you sit in the cockpit (for instance, mine is
just a hair over 6') then if the wave top is above the horizon while you
are in the trough, it is over 6', if it doesn't, it is under 6'. By
adjusting for how much it appears to be higher/lower than the horizon,
you can then get a very good estimate for waves up to about twice your
base height. Beyond that, it becomes more difficult and the wave
heights become more of a guesstimate than an estimate as it is difficult
to really tell if it is even with the spreaders or how much above/below
them the waves really are.

Note that using this method, you also have to adjust a bit depending on
the amount of heel and whether you are sitting on the high or low side
of the cockpit.

p.s.
Don't forget that all waves have two heights, the one we write down in
the log and the one we tell about at the bar in the story that begins
"No ****, you won't believe....". Could this be the source of your
assertion that most sailors overestimate by 100%?