OK, I admit I am unable to teach someone. Sometimes you explain it
several times and they dont get it. What do you do? Years ago, I
taught College Physics and my students seemed to think I was good but
that is all abstractions. Teaching a skill is different. I have never
been able to teach my wife to steer a canoe either. I cannot explain
how to do it, I just do it. Its like explaining how to ride a bike.
Some people really want personal instruction and others just want to be
pointed in the right direction and let them go. My son is like my
wife, he craves instruction to the nth degree and he makes me crazy.
My 10 yr old daughter just wants some general directions and she'll
figure out the rest. Of course, my little daughter drives my wife
crazy.
Tacking in the channel was like that. How do I tell her "Steer up when
you feel power coming on from the wind and then down a little when it
goes away". "When you tack, you gotta feel when the wind begins to
catch the jib to help push the bow around in a tight tacking situation"
There is a lotta "feel" that goes into this that I cannot explain.

wrote in message
oups.com...
OK, I admit I am unable to teach someone. Sometimes you explain it
several times and they dont get it. What do you do? Years ago, I
taught College Physics and my students seemed to think I was good but
that is all abstractions. Teaching a skill is different. I have never
been able to teach my wife to steer a canoe either. I cannot explain
how to do it, I just do it. Its like explaining how to ride a bike.
Some people really want personal instruction and others just want to be
pointed in the right direction and let them go. My son is like my
wife, he craves instruction to the nth degree and he makes me crazy.
My 10 yr old daughter just wants some general directions and she'll
figure out the rest. Of course, my little daughter drives my wife
crazy.
Tacking in the channel was like that. How do I tell her "Steer up when
you feel power coming on from the wind and then down a little when it
goes away". "When you tack, you gotta feel when the wind begins to
catch the jib to help push the bow around in a tight tacking situation"
There is a lotta "feel" that goes into this that I cannot explain.



A proper education instills self learning. You can teach others, but you
certainly can't think for them. It is up to them to chose to learn, to do
that they must chose to think. If they can't think they can only be trained
like animals.

wrote:
OK, I admit I am unable to teach someone. Sometimes you explain it
several times and they dont get it. What do you do?

Very very very standard teaching discipline:
1- tell the student what you're going to teach him

check: ask the student to describe in his own words the goal
of the lesson

2- teach the student the info & skills needed

check: ask the student to list the necessary info,
equipment, & skills necessary for the task

3- Demonstrate each component skill of the task

check: have the student practice each component skill

4- Demonstrate the entire task under the students direction

5- supervise the student demonstrating the entire task.

It may be desirable or necessary to review any or all steps.
Most people intuitively skip step 1 which is a huge mistake,
because the student has no idea what to focus on.


.... Years ago, I
taught College Physics and my students seemed to think I was good but
that is all abstractions. Teaching a skill is different. I have never
been able to teach my wife to steer a canoe either. I cannot explain
how to do it, I just do it.

I am not saying this to be insulting, but if you can't
explain it, then you don't understand it yourself all that well.


.... Its like explaining how to ride a bike.

Easy to explain, difficult to take the first steps of practice.


Some people really want personal instruction and others just want to be
pointed in the right direction and let them go.

Yep. Different people have different ways of learning....
who'd have thunk it?!?


Tacking in the channel was like that. How do I tell her "Steer up when
you feel power coming on from the wind and then down a little when it
goes away".

Don't start by letting the student steer. Start by letting
the student hold (not allowed to use the cleat) the
mainsheet. Have the student watch the wind angle and boat's
heeling angle, and explain the necessary steps to keep the
boat moving and not heeling too much, until they can do it
with no instruction.

Then let them steer while you trim the sails.

What you're expecting is for your wife to learn about 7
complex interactions at once. Did you start your physics
students on electrodynamics, and shock them when they made
mistakes?

I'd recommend taking a big step backwards... get her to feel
relaxed & comfortable around the water. Just go to a shallow
sandy beach for a day of splashing & fun with some floating
toys. Push her along while she's reclining on an inflatable
raft, for example. *Don't* take her out on the boat and
don't even breathe a hint that your goal is to get her to
like sailing. Take as long with this step as necessary, it
may be a year of beach trips, or maybe some canoing! Once
she is OK with being on the water, then sailing might start
to seem like fun. Another possibility is to go out with
other people on their boats. That really takes the pressure off.

That said, the best answer is really to let somebody else
teach your wife to sail. My wife already knew how to sail
when we met, the only thing I have taught her is how to
handle a spinnaker. That was over a decade ago, at one point
she was good enough to be recruited as crew for more serious
racers (which she declined politely) and now she thinks she
always knew how to sail with a spinnaker & I never taught
her... in fact last time we sailed together she was telling
me how. Doesn't bother me a bit... a long long time ago I
learned to not demand credit, just results!

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Maybe she's just genetically predispositioned to be a stinkpotter.

Worse things have happened. :-)

Chuck Gould wrote:
Maybe she's just genetically predispositioned to be a stinkpotter.

Worse things have happened. :-)

We will soon know as I have finished my Tolman Skiff and plan to launch
it this coming Saturday. Maybe that will be "her" boat. She doesnt
allow me to use her car (the good one in the family) as I would and I
go beserk if she tries to clean my old Nissan truck with 302,000 miles
on it.

"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...

Maybe she's just genetically predispositioned to be a stinkpotter.

Worse things have happened. :-)


In my experience, most women are. Not all .... but most.
Something about the ability to go home when you want ... not when you get
there.

I wanted to get a sailboat a few years ago. Vetoed.

Eisboch

wrote:
OK, I admit I am unable to teach someone.
It's probably not that you can't teach anyone but that the way you teach
is not the way she learns. Different people learn in different ways.

wrote:
OK, I admit I am unable to teach someone.

You can lead a horse to water but cant make them drink.

The secrect getting a horse to drink water is not leading them around,
rather, its how to create the thirst.

You should not be concerend with "teaching" studetns rather wondering
how studetns "learn."
Thus: learners not students.


Sometimes you explain it
several times and they dont get it. What do you do?

Determine what the learner need to be able to do when its all over.
Match learnering styles, outcomes, learning methods.


Years ago, I
taught College Physics and my students seemed to think I was good but
that is all abstractions. Teaching a skill is different.


No, not really. Yes, there are a few diffrneces between Thinking and
DOing skills but in the long run none.

I have never
been able to teach my wife to steer a canoe either. I cannot explain
how to do it,

Sounds as though you lack the skill to describe skills (behaviors) ,
that when put together, alow a person to canoe.

Think: Progressve approximation of a target behavior. In other words,
baby steps. Or learn to crawl before stand, before toddle, before walk,
before walking 25 feet without falling. etc.

I just do it.

Modeling is an effective learning stratigy. See one, do one, teach one.
Monkey see, monkey do (social learning theory)

Its like explaining how to ride a bike.
Some people really want personal instruction and others just want to be
pointed in the right direction and let them go.

Yes, now youre on the right track. Diffrent learning types.


My son is like my
wife, he craves instruction to the nth degree and he makes me crazy.

Do you mean detailed concrete instructions? If you can not explaine
what you want how on earth can you expect someone to do it?????

My 10 yr old daughter just wants some general directions and she'll
figure out the rest. Of course, my little daughter drives my wife
crazy.
Tacking in the channel was like that. How do I tell her "Steer up when
you feel power coming on from the wind and then down a little when it
goes away".

Lots of prereq skills to acccomplish that.


"When you tack, you gotta feel when the wind begins to
catch the jib to help push the bow around in a tight tacking situation"
There is a lotta "feel" that goes into this that I cannot explain.

You are not alone. I have listened to 1000s of seasoned managers, cops,
teachers, who get very frustrated becfause they lack the skills to
describe human behavor. Just that you are describing this problem shows
that you have great insight.

The first step is to be able tod istinguish betwen an opinion and a
fact. For example:
1) outside theweather is 81 degrees F, wind NW 18-24 K, visibility 3000
m.
2) Its a beautiful day.

Which is an opinion? Which is the fact (observable behavior)

Now lets take that concept and apply it diffrently. Which is an
opnionand fact?
1) you are so stupid!
2) name all parts of the mainsail.

AKA bob

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:

On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:59:04 -0500, DSK wrote:

That said, the best answer is really to let somebody else
teach your wife to sail.

All those words for that one gem of wisdom.

One of the best things I did when we were in the process of buying a
sailboat was to talk to my sister who recommended that I take a course
in sailing without my husband. I did that - actually I took 3
courses. One in a Rainbow 23 foot with no engine, one in a Newport 30
(I think), and the third one was a weekend with my husband on a Morgan
45.

In the first (beginner) course, they had a short class work session,
and then we went out in the boats and we each took a turn steering and
sail handling until everyone had mastered each of the skills that were
presented in each lesson. You could do this in 4 sessions - morning
and afternoon Sat and Sunday, but I picked to do it in the morning of
4 successive weekends so I could process the information between each
lesson.

BTW I was already completely comfortable in the water, as in swimming
and I can canoe and row.

My biggest problem was learning to reverse think when I was using a
tiller. I still can't do that, and if I try, I then can't use a wheel
either for awhile. There are some skills that just aren't worth it to
me to learn and that is one of them. Another one is a racing flip
turn and also any kind of diving (as in diving off a diving board - I
love SCUBA and snorkeling, but I just am not coordinated enough to
reliably go into the water head first when I start out standing up on
my feet)

Just send her to the club house, she will take up with the towel boy ...
soon you will be done with her.

Then you can go sailing with "men" ... big blond men, men with muscles, men
that wear little bathing suits that show their things ,,,,

A jolly ho ho and a bottle or rum ... pass the bree Bruce.


================================================
"DSK" wrote in message
...
wrote:
OK, I admit I am unable to teach someone. Sometimes you explain it
several times and they dont get it. What do you do?

Very very very standard teaching discipline:
1- tell the student what you're going to teach him

check: ask the student to describe in his own words the goal of the lesson

2- teach the student the info & skills needed

check: ask the student to list the necessary info, equipment, & skills
necessary for the task

3- Demonstrate each component skill of the task

check: have the student practice each component skill

4- Demonstrate the entire task under the students direction

5- supervise the student demonstrating the entire task.

It may be desirable or necessary to review any or all steps. Most people
intuitively skip step 1 which is a huge mistake, because the student has
no idea what to focus on.


.... Years ago, I
taught College Physics and my students seemed to think I was good but
that is all abstractions. Teaching a skill is different. I have never
been able to teach my wife to steer a canoe either. I cannot explain
how to do it, I just do it.

I am not saying this to be insulting, but if you can't explain it, then
you don't understand it yourself all that well.


.... Its like explaining how to ride a bike.

Easy to explain, difficult to take the first steps of practice.


Some people really want personal instruction and others just want to be
pointed in the right direction and let them go.

Yep. Different people have different ways of learning.... who'd have thunk
it?!?


Tacking in the channel was like that. How do I tell her "Steer up when
you feel power coming on from the wind and then down a little when it
goes away".

Don't start by letting the student steer. Start by letting the student
hold (not allowed to use the cleat) the mainsheet. Have the student watch
the wind angle and boat's heeling angle, and explain the necessary steps
to keep the boat moving and not heeling too much, until they can do it
with no instruction.

Then let them steer while you trim the sails.

What you're expecting is for your wife to learn about 7 complex
interactions at once. Did you start your physics students on
electrodynamics, and shock them when they made mistakes?

I'd recommend taking a big step backwards... get her to feel relaxed &
comfortable around the water. Just go to a shallow sandy beach for a day
of splashing & fun with some floating toys. Push her along while she's
reclining on an inflatable raft, for example. *Don't* take her out on the
boat and don't even breathe a hint that your goal is to get her to like
sailing. Take as long with this step as necessary, it may be a year of
beach trips, or maybe some canoing! Once she is OK with being on the
water, then sailing might start to seem like fun. Another possibility is
to go out with other people on their boats. That really takes the pressure
off.

That said, the best answer is really to let somebody else teach your wife
to sail. My wife already knew how to sail when we met, the only thing I
have taught her is how to handle a spinnaker. That was over a decade ago,
at one point she was good enough to be recruited as crew for more serious
racers (which she declined politely) and now she thinks she always knew
how to sail with a spinnaker & I never taught her... in fact last time we
sailed together she was telling me how. Doesn't bother me a bit... a long
long time ago I learned to not demand credit, just results!

Fresh Breezes- Doug King