One must bear in mind that a marine surveyor is only responsible for what he
can see.
The hidden defect and fibreglass rot are not always detected. A good
example is the stern rubber hose connecting the boat hull to the shaft. If
this hose lets go water start to get into the boat very quickly. The same
thing applies to the exhaust hoses. These hoses are hard to reach and a
visual check is not good, you have to reach them and strongly feel them all
around top and bottom. On some boat you can not reach them at all. Last
year my friend boat checked his hoses and he stated that the hoses look
pretty good. I replied, impossible, not after 23 years of service. We took
the hoses out. Yes, the hoses were rotten and were replaced with the new
approved hoses.

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
If your budget has hard limits, I would suggest spending only half of it
on the purchase, no matter how good the survey and how good the boat looks
if the boat is over 10 - 15 years old.

OTOH I'm glad we didn't follow this rule because we would only have bought
half as much boat.

--

Roger Long



wrote in message
...
At our club we have a sailboat like your and it owner like it a lot.
I am on the market for another sailboat.
I visited http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat2.htm and found it very
interesting.
I wonder if you could gave a picture of the financial implication in
purchasing your pre - owned sailboat like you did.
That is the purchased price along with all the refurbishing and upgrading
you have done to bring the sailboat to the stage it is now.
The learning curve to know what to and how to fix and repair may be hard
to establish.
The idea is If I purchase a pre - owned sailboat how much should I
allocate for sprucing up the boat and make to necessary repair like the
stern tube and other things.
Over here the insurance companies do require a boat survey when the boat
is 20 years old. The surveyor gets pay a percentage of the evaluated
replacement value of the boat. Then the insurance companies decide the
premium to be paid.


"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
I suggest you read this to start in order to get some idea of what
lies ahead and the intimidating economics of buying a used boat.

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat2.htm

--

Roger Long



"Praxi" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi all,

I'm new to sailing and I would like to buy a (used) boat between
30-35".

I'm looking for something that I can spend a couple nights on, now
and
then, while on a trip; entertain my family, and friends, and maybe
live
there for a week or so.

Can someone give me some leads as to what to look for and what to
stay
away from?

Maybe recommend some boats (brand, material, year, model, etc.) to
look
for?

Thank you,

I've only caught one pot with my E 32. That was one with a plastic
jug for a buoy that had been punctured and dragged beneath the surface
where it tangled up in a bunch of others so the line was stretched out
of sight.

I'm sure I'll catch another one someday but I now have a hook knife
and the handling, maneuverability, and performance are features I'd
rather have than being able to blindly plow through pots.

--

Roger Long



wrote in message
...
Years ago, according to Sailing magazine testing -- the fastest
sailboat to claw off a coast line (getting away from an rough and
threatening coast line) is a sloop rig with a fin keel.

As for the full keel and attached rudder I agreed that it will not
act as a lobster pot catcher the way the fin keel and suspended
rudder are doing. They only draw back I see is it may not turn as
fast as the fin keel. Nevertheless for long passage making it is
still well preferred.




"Thomas Wentworth" wrote in message
news:442Bg.60$AF1.49@trndny03...
"sloop rig equipped with a fin keel"

AKA ,,, a lobster pot catcher. I was at the boatyard this week and
there were a whole bunch of fin keel boat on the hard. Everyone
had some damage to the fin, or rudder. The rudder's were not
attached to the keel.


A full keel might not be as fast but it does have some advantages.


================================================== ======
wrote in message
...

Can someone give me some leads as to what to look for and what to
stay
away from?

At this time, the best lead is to learn the ropes.

You can learn a lot by crewing on other people sailboats. By
crewing you will learn what you prefer and what the other boat
owners like.

Most people prefer the sloop rig equipped with a fin keel. Other
people are going for the long keel and the facilities and ease of
handling small sails by having a cutter, yawl or ketch rig.

Today with the advent of the in mast furling main sail and furling
jib a wider stern hull the trend is slowly getting accepted.



"Brian Whatcott" wrote in message
...
On 4 Aug 2006 22:50:44 -0700, "Praxi" wrote:

Hi all,

I'm new to sailing and I would like to buy a (used) boat between
30-35".

I'm looking for something that I can spend a couple nights on,
now and
then, while on a trip; entertain my family, and friends, and
maybe live
there for a week or so.

Can someone give me some leads as to what to look for and what to
stay
away from?

Maybe recommend some boats (brand, material, year, model, etc.)
to look
for?

Thank you,


There's a school of thought that says a cheap old sailing dinghy
is a
whole lot cheaper to bang around in, while learning the fine
points.
Going fresh to a 32 ft sailboat can be done no doubt, but not by
most
without a few expensive trips to the bank.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

See he

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Strider0605.htm

--

Roger Long



wrote in message
...
One must bear in mind that a marine surveyor is only responsible for
what he can see.
The hidden defect and fibreglass rot are not always detected. A
good example is the stern rubber hose connecting the boat hull to
the shaft. If this hose lets go water start to get into the boat
very quickly. The same thing applies to the exhaust hoses. These
hoses are hard to reach and a visual check is not good, you have to
reach them and strongly feel them all around top and bottom. On
some boat you can not reach them at all. Last year my friend boat
checked his hoses and he stated that the hoses look pretty good. I
replied, impossible, not after 23 years of service. We took the
hoses out. Yes, the hoses were rotten and were replaced with the
new approved hoses.

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
If your budget has hard limits, I would suggest spending only half
of it on the purchase, no matter how good the survey and how good
the boat looks if the boat is over 10 - 15 years old.

OTOH I'm glad we didn't follow this rule because we would only have
bought half as much boat.

--

Roger Long



wrote in message
...
At our club we have a sailboat like your and it owner like it a
lot.
I am on the market for another sailboat.
I visited http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat2.htm and found it
very interesting.
I wonder if you could gave a picture of the financial implication
in purchasing your pre - owned sailboat like you did.
That is the purchased price along with all the refurbishing and
upgrading you have done to bring the sailboat to the stage it is
now.
The learning curve to know what to and how to fix and repair may
be hard to establish.
The idea is If I purchase a pre - owned sailboat how much should I
allocate for sprucing up the boat and make to necessary repair
like the stern tube and other things.
Over here the insurance companies do require a boat survey when
the boat is 20 years old. The surveyor gets pay a percentage of
the evaluated replacement value of the boat. Then the insurance
companies decide the premium to be paid.


"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
I suggest you read this to start in order to get some idea of what
lies ahead and the intimidating economics of buying a used boat.

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat2.htm

--

Roger Long



"Praxi" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi all,

I'm new to sailing and I would like to buy a (used) boat between
30-35".

I'm looking for something that I can spend a couple nights on,
now
and
then, while on a trip; entertain my family, and friends, and
maybe
live
there for a week or so.

Can someone give me some leads as to what to look for and what
to
stay
away from?

Maybe recommend some boats (brand, material, year, model, etc.)
to
look
for?

Thank you,

Roger Long wrote:
I've only caught one pot with my E 32. That was one with a plastic
jug for a buoy that had been punctured and dragged beneath the surface
where it tangled up in a bunch of others so the line was stretched out
of sight.

I'm sure I'll catch another one someday but I now have a hook knife
and the handling, maneuverability, and performance are features I'd
rather have than being able to blindly plow through pots.

In fact, the best cruisers are somewhere between being a fin keel, spade
rudder setup. Look at the hulls of Valiant and Pacific Seacraft. I
believe they are a very good compromise.

Furthermore, in my experience with both a fin keeler and full keeled
boat, the snag crab pots and kelp at about the same frequency. That
would be almost every time you run over one. The lobster pot business
is not a good way to choose a hull design.

Hitting logs with a spade rudder, that is a different story........

Gary

wrote:
Years ago, according to Sailing magazine testing -- the fastest sailboat to
claw off a coast line (getting away from an rough and threatening coast
line) is a sloop rig with a fin keel.

As for the full keel and attached rudder I agreed that it will not act as a
lobster pot catcher the way the fin keel and suspended rudder are doing.
They only draw back I see is it may not turn as fast as the fin keel.
Nevertheless for long passage making it is still well preferred.
Won't turn as fast;
Won't sail as fast;
More hull to sand and paint;
Much heavier displacement;
Wetter ride in heavy weather; and
Much heavier gear (more expensive) for a given size boat.

That being said, the Folkboat and its derivatives (Contessa 26,
Vancouver 26, Marie Holm) are some of the most attractive and seaworthy
boats around.

Gary




"Thomas Wentworth" wrote in message
news:442Bg.60$AF1.49@trndny03...

"Gary" wrote

In fact, the best cruisers are somewhere between being a fin keel,
spade rudder setup. Look at the hulls of Valiant and Pacific
Seacraft. I believe they are a very good compromise.


That pretty much describes the E 32 underbody.

--

Roger Long

It looks very good
I bet the stuffing box hose comes from Hamilton Marine. For us around here
a 6 ply hose can only be obtained from Hamilton.

"Roger Long" wrote in message
news
See he

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Strider0605.htm

--

Roger Long



wrote in message
...
One must bear in mind that a marine surveyor is only responsible for what
he can see.
The hidden defect and fibreglass rot are not always detected. A good
example is the stern rubber hose connecting the boat hull to the shaft.
If this hose lets go water start to get into the boat very quickly. The
same thing applies to the exhaust hoses. These hoses are hard to reach
and a visual check is not good, you have to reach them and strongly feel
them all around top and bottom. On some boat you can not reach them at
all. Last year my friend boat checked his hoses and he stated that the
hoses look pretty good. I replied, impossible, not after 23 years of
service. We took the hoses out. Yes, the hoses were rotten and were
replaced with the new approved hoses.

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
If your budget has hard limits, I would suggest spending only half of it
on the purchase, no matter how good the survey and how good the boat
looks if the boat is over 10 - 15 years old.

OTOH I'm glad we didn't follow this rule because we would only have
bought half as much boat.

--

Roger Long



wrote in message
...
At our club we have a sailboat like your and it owner like it a lot.
I am on the market for another sailboat.
I visited http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat2.htm and found it very
interesting.
I wonder if you could gave a picture of the financial implication in
purchasing your pre - owned sailboat like you did.
That is the purchased price along with all the refurbishing and
upgrading you have done to bring the sailboat to the stage it is now.
The learning curve to know what to and how to fix and repair may be
hard to establish.
The idea is If I purchase a pre - owned sailboat how much should I
allocate for sprucing up the boat and make to necessary repair like the
stern tube and other things.
Over here the insurance companies do require a boat survey when the
boat is 20 years old. The surveyor gets pay a percentage of the
evaluated replacement value of the boat. Then the insurance companies
decide the premium to be paid.


"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
I suggest you read this to start in order to get some idea of what
lies ahead and the intimidating economics of buying a used boat.

http://home.maine.rr.com/rlma/Boat2.htm

--

Roger Long



"Praxi" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi all,

I'm new to sailing and I would like to buy a (used) boat between
30-35".

I'm looking for something that I can spend a couple nights on, now
and
then, while on a trip; entertain my family, and friends, and maybe
live
there for a week or so.

Can someone give me some leads as to what to look for and what to
stay
away from?

Maybe recommend some boats (brand, material, year, model, etc.) to
look
for?

Thank you,

At our club when everyone else is heeling with the rub rail close to the
water and getting their ears wet, our friend in his E32 sails along with
minimum listing of 15 to 20 degrees.

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
"Gary" wrote

In fact, the best cruisers are somewhere between being a fin keel, spade
rudder setup. Look at the hulls of Valiant and Pacific Seacraft. I
believe they are a very good compromise.


That pretty much describes the E 32 underbody.

--

Roger Long

Roger Long wrote:
"Gary" wrote

In fact, the best cruisers are somewhere between being a fin keel,
spade rudder setup. Look at the hulls of Valiant and Pacific
Seacraft. I believe they are a very good compromise.


That pretty much describes the E 32 underbody.

Modified fin keel which describes my Tayana 42. I'm sold on this as the
best compromise.

Hitting logs with a spade rudder, that is a different story........

I have noticed that many short keel Catalina's have the rudder deeper than
the keel. This means that the first thing that goes aground is the rudder.
During my first year of sailing I turned on a dime and inadvertently hit the
bottom of the rudder. This resulted in a bent rudder post and minimum
steering capability.

"Gary" wrote in message
news:zB6Bg.325895$IK3.264217@pd7tw1no...
Roger Long wrote:
I've only caught one pot with my E 32. That was one with a plastic jug
for a buoy that had been punctured and dragged beneath the surface where
it tangled up in a bunch of others so the line was stretched out of
sight.

I'm sure I'll catch another one someday but I now have a hook knife and
the handling, maneuverability, and performance are features I'd rather
have than being able to blindly plow through pots.

In fact, the best cruisers are somewhere between being a fin keel, spade
rudder setup. Look at the hulls of Valiant and Pacific Seacraft. I
believe they are a very good compromise.

Furthermore, in my experience with both a fin keeler and full keeled boat,
the snag crab pots and kelp at about the same frequency. That would be
almost every time you run over one. The lobster pot business is not a
good way to choose a hull design.

Hitting logs with a spade rudder, that is a different story........

Gary