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Roger Long July 25th 06 09:38 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
There has been a Canadian flag mega yacht in the 150 – 200 class named
"Floridan" tied up in Portland for the past couple weeks. It’s about
as big a private yacht as I’ve seen up this way in the past couple
years.

I was heading back in today solo and close hauled in a good fresh
breeze with the boat working hard under two reefs and hoping to clear
Ram Island without having to make a short tack. The "Floridan" was
coming out and settled on exactly the opposing course with her
stemhead exactly lined up with her mast. I watched for a long time
thinking they must take a slight deviation out into the 3000 or so
miles of open water to their starboard but the angle never changed.

Finally, at about half a mile, I eased the sheets and bore off until I
could at least could see a little angle on the hull and it wasn’t like
staring directly down the sights of a shotgun from the wrong end.
Cursing the loss of 100 yards on what was going to be a pretty tight
squeak to clear the island, I watched her pass about 100 feet off my
beam. Then, I got to deal with the wake of a large displacement hull
going nearly hull speed on top of an already considerable sea.

The captain was standing on the bridge wing having a ciggy with the
autopilot on and never even waved.

As someone said, Yes, the rich are different than you and I.

Keep an eye out for this turkey if you’re cruising downeast. It’s a
bad one.

--

Roger Long





Capt. JG July 25th 06 10:13 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
There has been a Canadian flag mega yacht in the 150 - 200 class named
"Floridan" tied up in Portland for the past couple weeks. It's about as
big a private yacht as I've seen up this way in the past couple years.

I was heading back in today solo and close hauled in a good fresh breeze
with the boat working hard under two reefs and hoping to clear Ram Island
without having to make a short tack. The "Floridan" was coming out and
settled on exactly the opposing course with her stemhead exactly lined up
with her mast. I watched for a long time thinking they must take a slight
deviation out into the 3000 or so miles of open water to their starboard
but the angle never changed.

Finally, at about half a mile, I eased the sheets and bore off until I
could at least could see a little angle on the hull and it wasn't like
staring directly down the sights of a shotgun from the wrong end. Cursing
the loss of 100 yards on what was going to be a pretty tight squeak to
clear the island, I watched her pass about 100 feet off my beam. Then, I
got to deal with the wake of a large displacement hull going nearly hull
speed on top of an already considerable sea.

The captain was standing on the bridge wing having a ciggy with the
autopilot on and never even waved.

As someone said, Yes, the rich are different than you and I.

Keep an eye out for this turkey if you're cruising downeast. It's a bad
one.


Roger, was she on starboard tack, engine, or restricted in her
maneuverability?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com




Roger Long July 25th 06 10:15 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
It's a power boat.

--

Roger Long



"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
There has been a Canadian flag mega yacht in the 150 - 200 class
named "Floridan" tied up in Portland for the past couple weeks.
It's about as big a private yacht as I've seen up this way in the
past couple years.

I was heading back in today solo and close hauled in a good fresh
breeze with the boat working hard under two reefs and hoping to
clear Ram Island without having to make a short tack. The
"Floridan" was coming out and settled on exactly the opposing
course with her stemhead exactly lined up with her mast. I watched
for a long time thinking they must take a slight deviation out into
the 3000 or so miles of open water to their starboard but the angle
never changed.

Finally, at about half a mile, I eased the sheets and bore off
until I could at least could see a little angle on the hull and it
wasn't like staring directly down the sights of a shotgun from the
wrong end. Cursing the loss of 100 yards on what was going to be a
pretty tight squeak to clear the island, I watched her pass about
100 feet off my beam. Then, I got to deal with the wake of a large
displacement hull going nearly hull speed on top of an already
considerable sea.

The captain was standing on the bridge wing having a ciggy with the
autopilot on and never even waved.

As someone said, Yes, the rich are different than you and I.

Keep an eye out for this turkey if you're cruising downeast. It's a
bad one.


Roger, was she on starboard tack, engine, or restricted in her
maneuverability?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com






Capt. JG July 25th 06 10:47 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
And not restricted? In that case, a bummer.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
It's a power boat.

--

Roger Long



"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
There has been a Canadian flag mega yacht in the 150 - 200 class named
"Floridan" tied up in Portland for the past couple weeks. It's about as
big a private yacht as I've seen up this way in the past couple years.

I was heading back in today solo and close hauled in a good fresh breeze
with the boat working hard under two reefs and hoping to clear Ram
Island without having to make a short tack. The "Floridan" was coming
out and settled on exactly the opposing course with her stemhead exactly
lined up with her mast. I watched for a long time thinking they must
take a slight deviation out into the 3000 or so miles of open water to
their starboard but the angle never changed.

Finally, at about half a mile, I eased the sheets and bore off until I
could at least could see a little angle on the hull and it wasn't like
staring directly down the sights of a shotgun from the wrong end.
Cursing the loss of 100 yards on what was going to be a pretty tight
squeak to clear the island, I watched her pass about 100 feet off my
beam. Then, I got to deal with the wake of a large displacement hull
going nearly hull speed on top of an already considerable sea.

The captain was standing on the bridge wing having a ciggy with the
autopilot on and never even waved.

As someone said, Yes, the rich are different than you and I.

Keep an eye out for this turkey if you're cruising downeast. It's a bad
one.


Roger, was she on starboard tack, engine, or restricted in her
maneuverability?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com








DSK July 25th 06 11:27 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Roger Long wrote:
There has been a Canadian flag mega yacht in the 150 – 200 class named
"Floridan" tied up in Portland for the past couple weeks. It’s about
as big a private yacht as I’ve seen up this way in the past couple
years.


Hmmm... just the name already makes me suspicious....


..... I watched her pass about 100 feet off my
beam.


Bummer, you could have let them hit you and sued for
millions. The lawyer's lobby would probably elect you President!

But seriously, why not just hail on VHF?


The captain was standing on the bridge wing having a ciggy with the
autopilot on and never even waved.


Porb'ly didn't even see you.

As someone said, Yes, the rich are different than you and I.


Well, they share one characteristic with the very poor- they
don't have to worry about money ;)

Fresh Breezes- Doug King


Wayne.B July 25th 06 11:35 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Tue, 25 Jul 2006 20:38:27 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

Then, I got to deal with the wake of a large displacement hull
going nearly hull speed on top of an already considerable sea.


Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours. It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.

With regard to the right of way situation, did you sound a danger
signal or attempt contact on channel 13 or 16? That is the proper
course of action, preferably before the situation becomes critical.

Even though you had the right of way it would have been prudent to
have hailed him and proposed a "two whistle" pass. Most larger boats
will assume "one whistle" in the absence of some other arrangement.
Almost all boats of that size are piloted by professionals and will
respond positively to requests presented in a professional manner.


Roger Long July 26th 06 12:47 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Well, actually it was restricted despite 100+ feet of water, half a
mile clear on one side and several thousand on the other.

Restricted by arrogance and stupidity.

I've got to remember that my new cell phone can take short videos.
Three of those would have made a great attachment for a report to the
Coast Guard.

--

Roger Long



"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
And not restricted? In that case, a bummer.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
It's a power boat.

--

Roger Long



"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
There has been a Canadian flag mega yacht in the 150 - 200 class
named "Floridan" tied up in Portland for the past couple weeks.
It's about as big a private yacht as I've seen up this way in the
past couple years.

I was heading back in today solo and close hauled in a good fresh
breeze with the boat working hard under two reefs and hoping to
clear Ram Island without having to make a short tack. The
"Floridan" was coming out and settled on exactly the opposing
course with her stemhead exactly lined up with her mast. I
watched for a long time thinking they must take a slight
deviation out into the 3000 or so miles of open water to their
starboard but the angle never changed.

Finally, at about half a mile, I eased the sheets and bore off
until I could at least could see a little angle on the hull and
it wasn't like staring directly down the sights of a shotgun from
the wrong end. Cursing the loss of 100 yards on what was going to
be a pretty tight squeak to clear the island, I watched her pass
about 100 feet off my beam. Then, I got to deal with the wake of
a large displacement hull going nearly hull speed on top of an
already considerable sea.

The captain was standing on the bridge wing having a ciggy with
the autopilot on and never even waved.

As someone said, Yes, the rich are different than you and I.

Keep an eye out for this turkey if you're cruising downeast. It's
a bad one.

Roger, was she on starboard tack, engine, or restricted in her
maneuverability?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com










Roger Long July 26th 06 01:08 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
"Wayne.B" wrote


Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours. It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.


Agreed and I am not a wake nazi. But we're talking here about the
wake within the first two or three waves as a result of a vessel
passing far closer than is prudent. No danger but it took some
finesse in those conditions to get through without getting soaked.
Actually, the wind blanketing of the close approach was more of an
issue. I can coax a boat through just about anything but I could have
been one of many people out there that could have gotten knocked down
or backed trying to get the boat moving again.


With regard to the right of way situation, did you sound a danger
signal or attempt contact on channel 13 or 16? That is the proper
course of action, preferably before the situation becomes critical.

You really think someone in a an enclosed, air conditioned, pilothouse
is going to hear the pipsqueak horn a sailboat can carry far enough
against a 20 -25 knot wind to have any beneficial influence on the
situation? Back when I used blow horns because I believed what I read
in books, I never noticed that anyone seemed to hear them in
situations like this.

As for the radio, my theory is that someone oblivious enough miss
seeing a 32 foot sailboat directly ahead isn't going to be on the ball
enough that I want to waste time talking to them. It was another of
those days when I was using both hands for the boat. I doubt he could
have understood the handheld out in the wind even if he hadn't been
out on the bridge wing sucking a cig.

--

Roger Long






Gary July 26th 06 01:41 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Roger Long wrote:
"Wayne.B" wrote



Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours. It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.



Agreed and I am not a wake nazi. But we're talking here about the
wake within the first two or three waves as a result of a vessel
passing far closer than is prudent. No danger but it took some
finesse in those conditions to get through without getting soaked.
Actually, the wind blanketing of the close approach was more of an
issue. I can coax a boat through just about anything but I could have
been one of many people out there that could have gotten knocked down
or backed trying to get the boat moving again.


With regard to the right of way situation, did you sound a danger
signal or attempt contact on channel 13 or 16? That is the proper
course of action, preferably before the situation becomes critical.


You really think someone in a an enclosed, air conditioned, pilothouse
is going to hear the pipsqueak horn a sailboat can carry far enough
against a 20 -25 knot wind to have any beneficial influence on the
situation? Back when I used blow horns because I believed what I read
in books, I never noticed that anyone seemed to hear them in
situations like this.

As for the radio, my theory is that someone oblivious enough miss
seeing a 32 foot sailboat directly ahead isn't going to be on the ball
enough that I want to waste time talking to them. It was another of
those days when I was using both hands for the boat. I doubt he could
have understood the handheld out in the wind even if he hadn't been
out on the bridge wing sucking a cig.

It's funny how these things always seem to happen to you. What was it
last time, a small ferry?

Gary

DSK July 26th 06 02:15 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Wayne.B wrote:
Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours.


With all due respect, it is well to keep in mind that the
operator of a vessel making a wake is 100% responsible for
the damage done by his wake. It is exactly the same as a
person with a gun being held responsible for where his
bullets end up.


.... It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.


It is unreasonable to expect to endanger... or even present
a major & potentially expensive inconvenience... to other
people and have them shrug it off.



Almost all boats of that size are piloted by professionals and will
respond positively to requests presented in a professional manner.


That's been my experience as well, but the exceptions are
always noteworthy.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King


Wayne.B July 26th 06 02:26 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 00:08:23 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

As for the radio, my theory is that someone oblivious enough miss
seeing a 32 foot sailboat directly ahead isn't going to be on the ball
enough that I want to waste time talking to them.


I think that's the wrong way to look at the situation. An oncoming
sailboat can be a confusing situation and it is better to state your
intentions sooner rather than later. What if the oncoming boat had
been a freighter instead of a mega yacht, how would you view the
situation in that case? Neither will turn or stop on a dime. If you
want to receive courtesy from a power boat you must be prepared to
give it also.



Wayne.B July 26th 06 02:35 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Tue, 25 Jul 2006 21:15:40 -0400, DSK wrote:

Wayne.B wrote:
Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours.


With all due respect, it is well to keep in mind that the
operator of a vessel making a wake is 100% responsible for
the damage done by his wake. It is exactly the same as a
person with a gun being held responsible for where his
bullets end up.


No boat of Roger's size should be at risk of damage from a wake in
open water.


.... It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.


It is unreasonable to expect to endanger... or even present
a major & potentially expensive inconvenience... to other
people and have them shrug it off.

Danger is in the eye of the beholder. Since I wasn't there, it's
difficult to assess the situation impartially. I can say that in two
years of trawlering our GB49 up and down the east coast that I have
seen some incredibly bad behavior from a few sailboats who think that
they still have the right of way when motoring with the mainsail up,
or the right to suddenly tack in front with less than two boat lengths
separation, and various other similar examples.


Almost all boats of that size are piloted by professionals and will
respond positively to requests presented in a professional manner.


That's been my experience as well, but the exceptions are
always noteworthy.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King



Larry July 26th 06 02:52 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Wayne.B wrote in
:

Roger, with all due respect,


Sarcasm On:

Yeah, Roger, it was all your fault for being out there in a boat that
wasn't custom built, a hundred feet long and couldn't take an 8' wake
without having to maneuver around. How dare you?!....

Sarcasm Off:

I was swamped up to the bimini on my 16' Sea Rayder jetboat while idling
along near the Battery Wall in downtown Charleston by an asshole driving
a diving boat full of teenagers, racing back to his dock. I hauled the
flooded jetboat around and took chase as the drains and bilge pump worked
on the weight problem. Asshole decides he's gonna outrun a 175hp jetboat
with his diesel diveboat....NOT. I followed him right into his slip and
got his numbers/number of passengers (18) and noted his slip. After a
heated discussion based on his ancestral lineage, he told me I shouldn't
be out on Charleston Harbor in a 16' jetboat, anyways. It was, as my
sarcasm above, all my fault.

I called CG on the way to his slip on my VHF and asked them to meet us,
but they wouldn't respond. They don't do anything if they don't
PERSONALLY witness the event, I was told. It's like if the cops wouldn't
come to your house just because you saw someone lurking about in your
back yard. I later filed a report, duly noting he had 18 passengers on
board for hire.

They got him, not on my event, but because he had a sixpack license......

Every time I see that boat or his dive shop driving by it angers me he's
just gone on as if nothing mattered. I guess it doesn't, until someone
dies.

You never have a Stinger or depth charge when you need one.....


Wayne.B July 26th 06 03:11 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Tue, 25 Jul 2006 21:52:24 -0400, Larry wrote:

Sarcasm On:

Yeah, Roger, it was all your fault for being out there in a boat that
wasn't custom built, a hundred feet long and couldn't take an 8' wake
without having to maneuver around. How dare you?!....


There is a *big* difference between a 32 ft cruising sailboat and a 16
ft jetboat. You were endangered, Roger was inconvenienced.

I'm always amazed at the number of cruising sailboats that feel
entitled to perpetual flat water as some sort of birth right.


Mark Borgerson July 26th 06 03:33 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
In article ,
says...
"Wayne.B" wrote

SNIP
As for the radio, my theory is that someone oblivious enough miss
seeing a 32 foot sailboat directly ahead isn't going to be on the ball
enough that I want to waste time talking to them. It was another of
those days when I was using both hands for the boat. I doubt he could
have understood the handheld out in the wind even if he hadn't been
out on the bridge wing sucking a cig.


Yes, but the Coast Guard recording of your call on channel 16
might be a fine companion to your pictures in a report. ;-)


Mark Borgerson


Capt. JG July 26th 06 06:43 AM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
What about the people on it? Suppose someone was injured. That could easily
happen as a result of wake or evasive maneuvers to avoid a collision.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 25 Jul 2006 21:15:40 -0400, DSK wrote:

Wayne.B wrote:
Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours.


With all due respect, it is well to keep in mind that the
operator of a vessel making a wake is 100% responsible for
the damage done by his wake. It is exactly the same as a
person with a gun being held responsible for where his
bullets end up.


No boat of Roger's size should be at risk of damage from a wake in
open water.


.... It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.


It is unreasonable to expect to endanger... or even present
a major & potentially expensive inconvenience... to other
people and have them shrug it off.

Danger is in the eye of the beholder. Since I wasn't there, it's
difficult to assess the situation impartially. I can say that in two
years of trawlering our GB49 up and down the east coast that I have
seen some incredibly bad behavior from a few sailboats who think that
they still have the right of way when motoring with the mainsail up,
or the right to suddenly tack in front with less than two boat lengths
separation, and various other similar examples.


Almost all boats of that size are piloted by professionals and will
respond positively to requests presented in a professional manner.


That's been my experience as well, but the exceptions are
always noteworthy.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King





Denny July 26th 06 12:18 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 

I have limited salt water experience, only a couple of bareboat
charters in the Gulf of Mexico... But I have a lifetime of sweet water
sailing on the Great Lakes... One thing I learned early on is that
ships/freighters don't change course, even in a thousand feet of water
and no land visible in any direction... There is no one looking out
the window, and no one will answer the radio - and if in some miracle
they did they don't speak any english anyway...

So, as a sail boat skipper I learned to automatically change course as
soon as I see it is going to be close...... I don't get all bent up
over regulations, or that as a sailing vessel I have the right of way,
or that the hired Captain is an arrogant ass... Opposing a large ship
is like a motorcycle challenging a semi at 70 MPH on a narrow road...
You may be dead right on your cycle, but you will still be dead...
Roger, take a deep breath and forget about it...

cheers ... denny


DSK July 26th 06 12:42 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Wayne.B wrote:
I'm always amazed at the number of cruising sailboats that feel
entitled to perpetual flat water as some sort of birth right.


Well, look at it this way...

If your wake causes any damage or injury, you are responsible.

If your wake causes hazard or great inconvenience, that
makes you an inconsiderate asshole.

Maybe I should give your next door neighbor's kid an
electric guitar and a 1,000 watt amplifier to drive home
this point.

Ownership of a boat (or a guitar)(or a gun) does not convey
the unlimited right to use it however you want.

I'm always amazed at the number of power boaters who feel
that their wake should make other people happy.

DSK


Roger Long July 26th 06 01:24 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
"Gary" wrote

It's funny how these things always seem to happen to you. What was
it last time, a small ferry?

Gary


Twice in 36 years doesn't add up to "always" in my book and, while I
may be the only one reporting in this particular venue, I'm sure I'm
not the only one this happens to.

Twice in a summer may be a interesting statistical cluster. What I
think I'm really seeing here is a change in culture and expectations
of professionals on the water made more obvious by my having been a
pleasure boating Rip Van Winkle for 15 years. Far fewer people have a
clue about the right of way rules than they used to and I'm sure this
effects the thinking of commercial operators. Effectively, there are
no right of way rules for pleasure boats now or between pleasure boats
and commercial craft. Perhaps it's reasonable for the commercial
boats to just go in straight lines and keep the right of way rules
between them and their peers whose behavior can be predicted.

The responses about large vessels are off the mark. Both of these
were boats that could, and would, have diverted around a floating log
without a second thought to avoid possible damage to their props.
They held their courses either because of inattention or because they
assumed I would adopt the role of the burdened vessel in violation of
my duty to maintain a straight and predictable course. Neither
reflects well on them.

I would happily put the plots of my courses down an any USCG inquiry
table. I maintained a straight and consistent course as the stand on
vessel. When it became clear that the burdened vessel was not going
to respond appropriately, I diverted or slowed in time to avoid danger
of collision as well as danger that they would divert in the same
direction.

Regarding the radio, it is only a means of communication. The
handling of your vessel can be an excellent and even more convenient
method of indicating your intent. If you intend to depart your stand
on course, make a big and obvious change, show the other vessel the
whole side of your boat for a few moments and then come back to the
course that will clear. If they are watching, they'll get the
message. If they aren't watching, they probably aren't going to make
any sudden course changes before taking a look around.

--

Roger Long






Roger Long July 26th 06 01:56 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
"Denny" wrote

Roger, take a deep breath and forget about it...


Don't read too much into this. These were hardly big deals or
emergencies but they do raise some interesting discussion points about
the current state of the system we all rely on to help us avoid
hitting each other.

I used to sail Solings around Boston Harbor on Sunday afternoons with
spinnakers set so I'm comfortable keeping complex traffic situations
sorted out and handling a sailboat. Both of these close encounters
however, were situations where an inexperienced person, already
dealing with challenging conditions, could have gotten into trouble.
The skippers of these two boats had no way of knowing I wasn't one of
those.

What I hear from my numerous contacts on the "other side", as one
primarily involved with commercial vessels, is irritation that so many
sailboats assume that the always have the right of way, even over
large vessels constrained in channels and, as someone else responded,
when their engines are on. Many also think the sails give them the
right to tack whenever they want.

What we may be seeing here is the commercial vessels (and private
yacht captains with the conceit that they are such) pushing back by
trying to promote the expectation that they will NEVER deviate or
change speed for smaller craft. If this is the case, it's only a
matter of time before there is a tragedy.

--

Roger Long






boatgeek July 26th 06 04:10 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Is this the boat?

http://www.yachtportfolio.com/yacht.cfm?yid=357

Gary wrote:
Roger Long wrote:
"Wayne.B" wrote



Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours. It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.



Agreed and I am not a wake nazi. But we're talking here about the
wake within the first two or three waves as a result of a vessel
passing far closer than is prudent. No danger but it took some
finesse in those conditions to get through without getting soaked.
Actually, the wind blanketing of the close approach was more of an
issue. I can coax a boat through just about anything but I could have
been one of many people out there that could have gotten knocked down
or backed trying to get the boat moving again.


With regard to the right of way situation, did you sound a danger
signal or attempt contact on channel 13 or 16? That is the proper
course of action, preferably before the situation becomes critical.


You really think someone in a an enclosed, air conditioned, pilothouse
is going to hear the pipsqueak horn a sailboat can carry far enough
against a 20 -25 knot wind to have any beneficial influence on the
situation? Back when I used blow horns because I believed what I read
in books, I never noticed that anyone seemed to hear them in
situations like this.

As for the radio, my theory is that someone oblivious enough miss
seeing a 32 foot sailboat directly ahead isn't going to be on the ball
enough that I want to waste time talking to them. It was another of
those days when I was using both hands for the boat. I doubt he could
have understood the handheld out in the wind even if he hadn't been
out on the bridge wing sucking a cig.

It's funny how these things always seem to happen to you. What was it
last time, a small ferry?

Gary



Scotty July 26th 06 05:08 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
While sailing the lower Ches. Bay, I noticed a freighter
about a mile off, directly astern on my same heading. Soon
after, the Capt ( probably a pilot ) radioed and asked if I
was going to maintain my course. I replied that I could
change course easily and asked which direction he would
prefer I do so. He asked me if I wouldn't mind steering to
port a few degrees and said he would veer to starboard some.
I gybed and headed off 60 8 to port, well out of his path.
He thanked me and we wished each other a safe trip.
Not your normal ''power boater'' story, eh?


--
Scott Vernon
Plowville Pa _/)__/)_/)_


"Denny" wrote in message
ups.com...

I have limited salt water experience, only a couple of

bareboat
charters in the Gulf of Mexico... But I have a lifetime of

sweet water
sailing on the Great Lakes... One thing I learned early on

is that
ships/freighters don't change course, even in a thousand

feet of water
and no land visible in any direction... There is no one

looking out
the window, and no one will answer the radio - and if in

some miracle
they did they don't speak any english anyway...

So, as a sail boat skipper I learned to automatically

change course as
soon as I see it is going to be close...... I don't get

all bent up
over regulations, or that as a sailing vessel I have the

right of way,
or that the hired Captain is an arrogant ass... Opposing

a large ship
is like a motorcycle challenging a semi at 70 MPH on a

narrow road...
You may be dead right on your cycle, but you will still be

dead...
Roger, take a deep breath and forget about it...

cheers ... denny




Sal's Dad July 26th 06 06:15 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Thanks for the heads-up, Roger - we'll keep an eye out. Makes me shudder
to think of being out in a kayak when that guy is in Maine.

It would be nice if more people considered the consequences of their wakes.
We have a handful of large vessels, such as the "Pink Lady" out of Boothbay,
that can make life pretty exciting sometimes. One neighbor had his 17'
outboard wrecked, while on the dock. Of course no one was watching it at
that moment, so there was no "proof" that the only large vessel to pass by
was at fault...

It is entirely possible that there will be children or less-experienced
adults in small boats, or along the shoreline; on a calm day some of the
wakes exceed what we see in the stormiest conditions. Vessels and
experience should be appropriate for the conditions you are likely to run
into, but this doesn't mean we must all be prepared for a 4' wake at all
times.

Sal's Dad

"boatgeek" wrote in message
ups.com...
Is this the boat?

http://www.yachtportfolio.com/yacht.cfm?yid=357

Gary wrote:
Roger Long wrote:
"Wayne.B" wrote



Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours. It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a confined
area where you could lose control.


Agreed and I am not a wake nazi. But we're talking here about the
wake within the first two or three waves as a result of a vessel
passing far closer than is prudent. No danger but it took some
finesse in those conditions to get through without getting soaked.
Actually, the wind blanketing of the close approach was more of an
issue. I can coax a boat through just about anything but I could have
been one of many people out there that could have gotten knocked down
or backed trying to get the boat moving again.




July 26th 06 06:55 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
The "Floridian" was built by Greg Norman in Australia under another name.
Wayne Hurnanga, think "Blockbusters", bought it, added 20 feet aft for his
chopper, and named it "Floridian".

"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
There has been a Canadian flag mega yacht in the 150 - 200 class named
"Floridan" tied up in Portland for the past couple weeks. It's about as
big a private yacht as I've seen up this way in the past couple years.

I was heading back in today solo and close hauled in a good fresh breeze
with the boat working hard under two reefs and hoping to clear Ram Island
without having to make a short tack. The "Floridan" was coming out and
settled on exactly the opposing course with her stemhead exactly lined up
with her mast. I watched for a long time thinking they must take a slight
deviation out into the 3000 or so miles of open water to their starboard
but the angle never changed.

Finally, at about half a mile, I eased the sheets and bore off until I
could at least could see a little angle on the hull and it wasn't like
staring directly down the sights of a shotgun from the wrong end. Cursing
the loss of 100 yards on what was going to be a pretty tight squeak to
clear the island, I watched her pass about 100 feet off my beam. Then, I
got to deal with the wake of a large displacement hull going nearly hull
speed on top of an already considerable sea.

The captain was standing on the bridge wing having a ciggy with the
autopilot on and never even waved.

As someone said, Yes, the rich are different than you and I.

Keep an eye out for this turkey if you're cruising downeast. It's a bad
one.

--

Roger Long







Wayne.B July 26th 06 07:11 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 07:42:37 -0400, DSK wrote:

If your wake causes hazard or great inconvenience, that
makes you an inconsiderate asshole.


That's a little extreme although there are plenty of sailors who would
agree with you. Tell it to the container ships blasting along at 20+
knots.

Wakes are funny things, one man's ripple is another man's tsunami.
I will reduce my wake for canoes, kayaks, small open boats, or
anything else that looks like it might be endangered. I will also
reduce it in close quarters where a wake could cause loss of control.
Other than that, wakes are just another hazard of boating to be
watched for and dealt with like any other wave. I get rolled by some
boats, and some get rolled by me. Other than a sportfish that once
trashed our television while I was waiting for a bridge to open, I've
never gotten too excited about it.


Wayne.B July 26th 06 07:22 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 12:08:48 -0400, "Scotty"
wrote:

While sailing the lower Ches. Bay, I noticed a freighter
about a mile off, directly astern on my same heading. Soon
after, the Capt ( probably a pilot ) radioed and asked if I
was going to maintain my course. I replied that I could
change course easily and asked which direction he would
prefer I do so. He asked me if I wouldn't mind steering to
port a few degrees and said he would veer to starboard some.
I gybed and headed off 60 8 to port, well out of his path.
He thanked me and we wished each other a safe trip.
Not your normal ''power boater'' story, eh?


Perhaps not but I've had pretty good luck communicating with
commercial vessels about their course and intentions. We even had an
interesting dialog last year with a large navy vessel off the coast on
Beaufort, NC. They were making frequent course changes and the last
one put us at a CPA of less than 1/2 mile, too close for my comfort.
I hailed them on channel 13 and they assured me that they were
tracking us on radar, and that we would pass astern if we held speed
and course. They were right, but at least we had established that
they were aware of us and not planning any more immediate course
changes.

Obviously none of this is possible if you wait until the last minute,
or if you don't have a radio close at hand.

DSK July 26th 06 07:37 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
If your wake causes hazard or great inconvenience, that
makes you an inconsiderate asshole.



Wayne.B wrote:
That's a little extreme


Not really.


... Tell it to the container ships blasting along at 20+
knots.


Well now there's a funny thing... they're not doing it for fun.

What do you think of a person who, for fun, forces other
people to go out of their way to avoid danger? Who, because
he can't be bothered, insists that other people can have
their possessions trashed and it's just "part of being on
the water"?

I call that an inconsiderate asshole, because that's what it
is. What do you call it?


Wakes are funny things, one man's ripple is another man's tsunami.


True, but there is also a very quantifiable scale for wakes.
Not long ago, I videotaped a big sportfisherman going thru
the Adams Creek cut at 8 knots or so... pulling a wake that
was literally rolling up over people's docks & bulkheads.
Over the radio, the skipper insisted that he was obeying the
"no wake" signs.


I will reduce my wake for canoes, kayaks, small open boats, or
anything else that looks like it might be endangered.


That phrase "anything else" covers a LOT of territory. How
about anchored boats? Boats tied to docks? Shorelines
subject to erosion?

... I will also
reduce it in close quarters where a wake could cause loss of control.


I've never known a wake to cause a loss of control, OTOH
there are certainly places where it is difficult or
impossible to maneuver bow-on to a wake or otherwise
minimize impact.

Other than that, wakes are just another hazard of boating to be
watched for and dealt with like any other wave.


For the most part, I agree. But that does not change the
fact that every boat operator is responsible for his wake.

.... Other than a sportfish that once
trashed our television while I was waiting for a bridge to open, I've
never gotten too excited about it.


Did you call him names ;)

Fresh Breezes- Doug King


Glenn Ashmore July 26th 06 07:49 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Well, at least Roger picked a good one to get run over by. $8.3 billion
will bring out the best lawyers on a contingency basis. :-)

--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 13:55:35 -0400, wrote:

The "Floridian" was built by Greg Norman in Australia under another name.
Wayne Hurnanga, think "Blockbusters", bought it, added 20 feet aft for his
chopper, and named it "Floridian".




Here's a local story from Camden, ME

http://knox.villagesoup.com/Communit...?storyID=75720

CWM




Wayne.B July 26th 06 08:20 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 14:37:17 -0400, DSK wrote:

If your wake causes hazard or great inconvenience, that
makes you an inconsiderate asshole.



Wayne.B wrote:
That's a little extreme


Not really.


... Tell it to the container ships blasting along at 20+
knots.


Well now there's a funny thing... they're not doing it for fun.


If I'm leaving a wake it's because I'm trying to get somewhere, just
like the container ship. If I'm also having fun, that is incidental
and irrelevant. A wake is a wake.

What do you think of a person who, for fun, forces other
people to go out of their way to avoid danger?


See above.

Who, because
he can't be bothered, insists that other people can have
their possessions trashed and it's just "part of being on
the water"?

I call that an inconsiderate asshole, because that's what it
is. What do you call it?


I call it someone in a heavy displacement boat trying to get
somewhere. No one, other than a wake boarder, leaves a wake for fun.
At today's fuel prices, wake production is getting very expensive.


Wakes are funny things, one man's ripple is another man's tsunami.


True, but there is also a very quantifiable scale for wakes.
Not long ago, I videotaped a big sportfisherman going thru
the Adams Creek cut at 8 knots or so.


Do you live on Adams Creek? It's one of my favorite areas of the ICW.
Not all of it is a no wake zone however.

.. pulling a wake that
was literally rolling up over people's docks & bulkheads.


I have seen docks that were built too low for the type of exposure
they encounter. Who do these people yell at with storm waves?

Over the radio, the skipper insisted that he was obeying the
"no wake" signs.

Some people are truly oblivious.

I will reduce my wake for canoes, kayaks, small open boats, or
anything else that looks like it might be endangered.


That phrase "anything else" covers a LOT of territory. How
about anchored boats? Boats tied to docks? Shorelines
subject to erosion?


It depends. Endangered yes, discomforted no.


... I will also
reduce it in close quarters where a wake could cause loss of control.


I've never known a wake to cause a loss of control, OTOH
there are certainly places where it is difficult or
impossible to maneuver bow-on to a wake or otherwise
minimize impact.

Other than that, wakes are just another hazard of boating to be
watched for and dealt with like any other wave.


For the most part, I agree. But that does not change the
fact that every boat operator is responsible for his wake.

.... Other than a sportfish that once
trashed our television while I was waiting for a bridge to open, I've
never gotten too excited about it.


Did you call him names ;)

Fresh Breezes- Doug King



Roger Long July 26th 06 08:46 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Yup. That looks like it.

--

Roger Long



"boatgeek" wrote in message
ups.com...
Is this the boat?

http://www.yachtportfolio.com/yacht.cfm?yid=357

Gary wrote:
Roger Long wrote:
"Wayne.B" wrote



Roger, with all due respect, a large wake should be regarded as
just
another wave in a seaworthy and decent sized boat such as yours.
It
is unreasonable to expect people to slow down except in a
confined
area where you could lose control.


Agreed and I am not a wake nazi. But we're talking here about
the
wake within the first two or three waves as a result of a vessel
passing far closer than is prudent. No danger but it took some
finesse in those conditions to get through without getting
soaked.
Actually, the wind blanketing of the close approach was more of
an
issue. I can coax a boat through just about anything but I could
have
been one of many people out there that could have gotten knocked
down
or backed trying to get the boat moving again.


With regard to the right of way situation, did you sound a danger
signal or attempt contact on channel 13 or 16? That is the
proper
course of action, preferably before the situation becomes
critical.


You really think someone in a an enclosed, air conditioned,
pilothouse
is going to hear the pipsqueak horn a sailboat can carry far
enough
against a 20 -25 knot wind to have any beneficial influence on
the
situation? Back when I used blow horns because I believed what I
read
in books, I never noticed that anyone seemed to hear them in
situations like this.

As for the radio, my theory is that someone oblivious enough miss
seeing a 32 foot sailboat directly ahead isn't going to be on the
ball
enough that I want to waste time talking to them. It was another
of
those days when I was using both hands for the boat. I doubt he
could
have understood the handheld out in the wind even if he hadn't
been
out on the bridge wing sucking a cig.

It's funny how these things always seem to happen to you. What was
it
last time, a small ferry?

Gary





DSK July 26th 06 09:17 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Wayne.B wrote:
I call it someone in a heavy displacement boat trying to get
somewhere.


And forcing other people to go out of their way to avoid
possible injury, and risking damage to other people's goods.

In other words, no consideration to others.


At today's fuel prices, wake production is getting very expensive.


Why do so many people do it so prodigiously then?

Wayne.B wrote:
Wakes are funny things, one man's ripple is another man's tsunami.


True, but there is also a very quantifiable scale for wakes.
Not long ago, I videotaped a big sportfisherman going thru
the Adams Creek cut at 8 knots or so.



Do you live on Adams Creek?


No.

... It's one of my favorite areas of the ICW.
Not all of it is a no wake zone however.


True!


.. pulling a wake that
was literally rolling up over people's docks & bulkheads.



I have seen docks that were built too low for the type of exposure
they encounter. Who do these people yell at with storm waves?


In Adams Creek? Get real.

In any event, how they built their docks is their business.
If your wake damages it, that is your business.

It is the same as if you fired a gun, you are responsible
for where the bullet goes.

Why is this so hard to understand?


Over the radio, the skipper insisted that he was obeying the
"no wake" signs.


Some people are truly oblivious.

I will reduce my wake for canoes, kayaks, small open boats, or
anything else that looks like it might be endangered.


That phrase "anything else" covers a LOT of territory. How
about anchored boats? Boats tied to docks? Shorelines
subject to erosion?



It depends. Endangered yes, discomforted no.


If you are unwilling to exert at least some effort to avoid
causing possible harm and certain discomfort/inconvenience t
others, who are doing nothing to bother you, then that makes
you... what, exactly? I believe I defined it earlier quite well.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King


Don White July 26th 06 09:20 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Charlie Morgan wrote:
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 13:55:35 -0400, wrote:


The "Floridian" was built by Greg Norman in Australia under another name.
Wayne Hurnanga, think "Blockbusters", bought it, added 20 feet aft for his
chopper, and named it "Floridian".





Here's a local story from Camden, ME

http://knox.villagesoup.com/Communit...?storyID=75720

CWM


Makes me wonder why Roger thought it was a Canadian owned vessel.

Roger Long July 26th 06 09:22 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
"Don White" wrote

Makes me wonder why Roger thought it was a Canadian owned vessel.


It had something to do with the big Canadian flag flying off the
stern. Maybe it was just being chartered by Canadians.

--

Roger Long





Dick Locke July 26th 06 09:38 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 20:22:16 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

"Don White" wrote

Makes me wonder why Roger thought it was a Canadian owned vessel.


It had something to do with the big Canadian flag flying off the
stern. Maybe it was just being chartered by Canadians.


Flags on stern are country of registration, not the owner's country of
citizenship. Owner's country flag has some obscure spot to fly in.

Fuzzy Logic July 26th 06 10:23 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Charlie Morgan wrote in :

On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 13:55:35 -0400, wrote:

The "Floridian" was built by Greg Norman in Australia under another name.
Wayne Hurnanga, think "Blockbusters", bought it, added 20 feet aft for his
chopper, and named it "Floridian".


BTW - When the owner isn't using Floridian, it can be chartered for
$400k (four hundred thousand dollars) per week. I'm not making this
up!

CWM


Is this it:

http://www.yachtportfolio.com/yacht.cfm?yid=368

Roger Long July 26th 06 10:53 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Poor wording. I should have said "flagged" instead of "owned". It's
not widely known that the "Titanic", for example, was a U.S. owned
vessel, J.P. Morgan, actually.

--

Roger Long



"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 20:22:16 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote:

"Don White" wrote

Makes me wonder why Roger thought it was a Canadian owned vessel.


It had something to do with the big Canadian flag flying off the
stern. Maybe it was just being chartered by Canadians.


As the story indicates, the owner was on board. It wasn't being
chartered.

CWM




Stephen Trapani July 26th 06 10:59 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Denny wrote:
I have limited salt water experience, only a couple of bareboat
charters in the Gulf of Mexico... But I have a lifetime of sweet water
sailing on the Great Lakes... One thing I learned early on is that
ships/freighters don't change course, even in a thousand feet of water
and no land visible in any direction... There is no one looking out
the window, and no one will answer the radio - and if in some miracle
they did they don't speak any english anyway...

So, as a sail boat skipper I learned to automatically change course as
soon as I see it is going to be close...... I don't get all bent up
over regulations, or that as a sailing vessel I have the right of way,
or that the hired Captain is an arrogant ass... Opposing a large ship
is like a motorcycle challenging a semi at 70 MPH on a narrow road...
You may be dead right on your cycle, but you will still be dead...
Roger, take a deep breath and forget about it...

cheers ... denny


Here lies the body of William J.
He died maintaining his right of way.
He was right, dead right as he sped along
but he's just as dead as if he'd been dead wrong.

--
Stephen

-------

For any proposition there is always some sufficiently narrow
interpretation of its terms, such that it turns out true, and
some sufficiently wide interpretation such that it turns out
false...concept stretching will refute *any* statement, and will
leave no true statement whatsoever.
-- Imre Lakatos

Glenn Ashmore July 26th 06 11:07 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote

BTW - When the owner isn't using Floridian, it can be chartered for
$400k (four hundred thousand dollars) per week. I'm not making this
up!


That is not unusual. We made friends with a couple off one of those mega
yachts in North Sound, Virgin Gorda and were invited aboard. 4 couples went
in on the charter. When they told me it was $290,000 for the week I almost
choked on my Scotch! Those people were spending more per person for a week
on a boat that I plan to spend for spars, rigging and a set of sails!
Oddly, for rich Yankees they were pretty nice folks. :-)

--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com



Don White July 26th 06 11:17 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Roger Long wrote:
"Don White" wrote


Makes me wonder why Roger thought it was a Canadian owned vessel.



It had something to do with the big Canadian flag flying off the
stern. Maybe it was just being chartered by Canadians.


In the picture someone presented, it appeared to be a red ensign.... not
sure what flag the Cayman Islands fly.

Don White July 26th 06 11:25 PM

Dangerous mega yacht warning for Maine
 
Roger Long wrote:
Yup. That looks like it.


Note flag here re Cayman Islands Civil Ensign
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...renoJul21C.jpg

Bad view but does it resemble this flag on stern of your mega yacht..
http://www.yachtportfolio.com/yacht.cfm?yid=357

or..
http://www.pch.gc.ca/progs/cpsc-ccsp/sc-cs/df2_e.cfm


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