So, I'm finally at the point of reinstalling/completing my head
installations. I'm using either aussieglobe cuz I ordered before they
quit selling it, or PVC/aussie joint for the downstream stuff.

However, the supply hoses which were on the pumps (in and out, from
through hull shutoff and to bowl) are white, stamped "made in the USA"
and no other visible markings. Recall that I have tees which used to
supply some venturi-provided solution to the flush; your recommendation
was to delete those and the solution.

Given my enthusiasm for not having to later replace those hoses, and
knowing that even plain seawater stinks if it stagnates, but also
knowing that those little hoses get a lot of movement, I'm wondering if
any special hose is needed for these applications. The current hoses
don't seem to smell, aren't sticky, or otherwise resemble the removals
of the outflow hoses. However, with the tees, plus the new requirement
(not present in either head before) of much longer lines and vented
loops, I'm going to replace them.

What's the recommended supply line?

Thanks.

L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
http://tinyurl.com/p7rb4 - NOTE:new URL! The vessel as Tehamana, as we
bought her

"Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely
nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing,
messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats.
In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter,
that's the charm of it.
Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your
destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never
get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in
particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to
do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."

Skip Gundlach wrote:
So, I'm finally at the point of reinstalling/completing my head
installations.

However, the supply hoses which were on the pumps (in and out, from
through hull shutoff and to bowl) are white, stamped "made in the USA"
and no other visible markings.

What's the recommended supply line?
Skip


Hi Skip:
Not sure what head you have........ I put in a new PH 2 a few weeks ago
on PH's recomendation for heads under $200. The 3/4" supply hose from
the pump to the bowl was fastened on with nylon zip ties. The hose was
solid white with no markings and the ID was reduced by half because the
hose collapsed in place. Pretty Mickey Mouse OEM IMHO. But
hey........... for 200 bucks?

So I called an industrial hose supply and asked for some clear pvc
"suction hose" with a hard helix coil. This stuff is the same stuff I
recommended for use as 1 1/2" bilge hose.

Cost was $.98/ foot. Now, "be advised" and "now hear this" the hose I
got is one stout hunk of hose. Very flexible but will not collapse when
bent or kinked. On the other hand, that clear stuff with the woven
reinforcement so common every where will collapse.

So this is where someone will chime in and say, "oh, oh! It is not
designed for below the water line applications. Why save ten cents and
have your boat sink?!?!?"

I say read the spec sheet and use the stuff best suited for the
installation environment and at a reasonable price. You seem like a
fairly smart person who makes decisions on facts........ and if I
remember your boat buying posts, LOTS of facts. Go to the link below
and make your own decision if that pvc hose will work for a seawater
intake:

http://www.ges-inc.com/PacificEcho.html

I use it for all bilge and head intake applications. Now head discharge
is a whole nother story...................
Bob

Oh...... I forgot. this is the exact stuff I use:

Spiralite 090 PVC all weather Suction hose with rubber-like
flexibility.

Bob

Quite right - pragmatic, frugal and fact oriented.

I'm grateful for your link, as I spent a great deal of time trying to
find stuff which would work at anything approaching your pricing in
prior posts, and eventually gave up.

My PHII (with the same sort of plastic clamps and intake pipe as you
describe for the intake side) head outflow is S40 PVC rigid, with head
connector of AVS96, slip joint at the Y valve from hard pipe to Y
(where the gap will be very small - butted up to each other), and
outflow valve of AVS96 connector, again, to the head leg of the Y. I
was very gratified to find that with a heat gun, it was very soft and
flexible and allowed me to make rather harder turns than otherwise.
I'm guessing your 090 Spiralite would be the same way.

So, meanwhile, they're in CA and I'm in FL; shipping will be
interesting, plus, I can't see on my first tour of the site whether
they sell cut lengths. I'm pretty sure I don't need 100' of either the
3/4 or whatever the intake is, nor the 1.25 or so that the bilge out
is, and would be a bit challenged to store that much excess.

How much is the bilge size hose? The head intake hose is similar in
cost to the inferior stuff...

And, the stuff for which I'd use this isn't below the waterline in
function, other than its physical location. I don't count something
being pumped up over the waterline as being below it :{))

And, thanks for remembering my boat buying posts - that's over 2 years
ago, now...

And thanks again for the link - how say you on the other questions
about them?

L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
http://tinyurl.com/p7rb4 - NOTE:new URL! The vessel as Tehamana, as we
bought her

"Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely
nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing,
messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats.
In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter,
that's the charm of it.
Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your
destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never
get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in
particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to
do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."

Skip Gundlach wrote:
Quite right - pragmatic, frugal and fact oriented.

I'm grateful for your link, as I spent a great deal of time trying to
find stuff which would work at anything approaching your pricing in
prior posts, and eventually gave up.

No problem. Glad to be of help. The pricing can be a problem at first
look. What worked best form me was find an idustrial hose supply. The
kind of place that sell nothing but hose. The hole idea is the same as
buying anchor chain. Forget West Marine and head to an industrial
supply that sell nothing but wire rope, chain, chain binders etc.

My PHII (with the same sort of plastic clamps and intake pipe as you
describe for the intake side)

Yea, aint it a bit shoddy. Maybe they just figure everyone is goign to
replace it any way so why put good stuff on the toilet.

head outflow is S40 PVC rigid, with head
connector of AVS96, slip joint at the Y valve from hard pipe to Y
(where the gap will be very small - butted up to each other), and
outflow valve of AVS96 connector, again, to the head leg of the Y.

I started to go that route too but having only a 39' boat the
flexibility of hose was the better choice for my tight spaces.

was very gratified to find that with a heat gun, it was very soft and
flexible and allowed me to make rather harder turns than otherwise.

I did not know the stuff could be bent???? Cool!

I'm guessing your 090 Spiralite would be the same way.

The 090 stuff is rather stiff. But with a little heat becomes rather
trainable.
Working temps for the 090 go to 140 F with a safe working preasure of
300 psi.
Like I said 140 degrees at 300 psi.............. I think it will suck a
little sea water just fine.

So, meanwhile, they're in CA and I'm in FL; shipping will be
interesting, plus, I can't see on my first tour of the site whether
they sell cut lengths.

That is wher I say agin just look locally in FL. Gotta be a store that
sells only hose to agraculture, fish processing, wine making, orange
juice industry. Thoes guys wont pay marine prices so the prices are
usually rather fair...... when compared to Hamilton, Defender, West
Marine, etc.

Oh, and then there is TX with the whole petro chemical industry. Its
gotta be there. Keep looking.

I'm pretty sure I don't need 100' of either the
3/4 or whatever the intake is, nor the 1.25 or so that the bilge out
is, and would be a bit challenged to store that much excess.

Agreed.


How much is the bilge size hose?

Its been a few months since a Replaced my three pump bilge system. If I
remember right about $1.50/ft

The head intake hose is similar in
cost to the inferior stuff...

Yea, go figure. I really do not like that, ooh so common hose with the
braided reinforment weaved into the hose wall. The stuff will collaps
on a tight bend and the wall is way to thin for my likeing.


And, the stuff for which I'd use this isn't below the waterline in
function, other than its physical location. I don't count something
being pumped up over the waterline as being below it :{))

Boy do I agree there. Seems we had quite an excahnge a few weeks ago
over the definition of "below the waterline." Athough I would think the
3/4" head intake does qualify for BTW.

And, thanks for remembering my boat buying posts - that's over 2 years
ago, now...
And thanks again for the link - how say you on the other questions
about them?

No problem, just hope you can find the stuff on the east side. I can
not recomend the it highly enough for bilge and head applications.I've
seen the 1 1/2" just brutalized on construction sites around here. I'm
talking pumping 10' ditches dry with escavators running over the stuff,
rocks/ small bolders abrading the stuff, baking in 106 F sun etc. I
think it will certainly suck up a little bilge or sea water inside a
boat easily. Oh, but for the real tough stuff try the "oil resistant"
version. A bit more expensive but.......................

Bob

Skip Gundlach wrote:
I
was very gratified to find that with a heat gun, it was very soft and
flexible and allowed me to make rather harder turns than otherwise.

Something you may end up paying for later...'cuz hose should never be
heated to make it bend tighter than it wants to bend willingly. That
stretches the outside of the radius--which can cause it to tear--and
weakens the inside of the radius, which can cause it to collapse.

Break the hose and use an inline radius fitting instead.

--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304

Something you may end up paying for later...'cuz hose should never be
heated to make it bend tighter than it wants to bend willingly. That
stretches the outside of the radius--which can cause it to tear--and
weakens the inside of the radius, which can cause it to collapse.

Break the hose and use an inline radius fitting instead.


Hi, Peggie, and thanks for the response.

I'm not sure of damage - it seemed like it just made it easier to work
with in a somewhat cramped area.

The particular place was at the part of the current gallery beginning
at
http://www.justpickone.org/skip/gall...ay06&start=155

I also cut a section to go over the hose where it bore against the
grease plug for the valve under it (intake valve, one on the through
hull as well), to prevent against chafe. Would you mind looking at
that and saying whether you think that radius is too tight? I got it
warm, positioned it under a bit of compression, let it cool, and the
joker plopped perfectly in place the next day.

FWIW, I'm nearly finished with the outflow Y installation, and will
have pix at the end of that gallery when it's installed. Hard pipe
from the place you see in the above to just before the Y, where there's
a bend to the through hull, and hose to the holding tank.

Any watching this thread and interested in the hard pipe parts can
start at the same above but change the number to 285. The finished (Y
part) won't be up until Tuesday night...

Thanks again for your assistance. I've been promoting your book over
in a bunch of sailnet lists where sort of thing comes up all the time
(thus my interest in AVS/Shields 101, you'll recall - and what was the
outcome of Aussiglobe?)...

L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
http://tinyurl.com/p7rb4 - NOTE:new URL! The vessel as Tehamana, as we
bought her

"Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely
nothing-half so
much worth doing as simply messing, messing-about-in-boats; messing
about in
boats-or *with* boats.
In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter,
that's
the charm of it.
Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your
destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never
get
anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in
particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to
do, and
you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."

Skip Gundlach wrote:

Something you may end up paying for later...'cuz hose should never be
heated to make it bend tighter than it wants to bend willingly. That
stretches the outside of the radius--which can cause it to tear--and
weakens the inside of the radius, which can cause it to collapse.

Break the hose and use an inline radius fitting instead.

I'm not sure of damage - it seemed like it just made it easier to work
with in a somewhat cramped area.

You may not be for a while...it can takes weeks or months for material
that's stretch too thin to finally part company.

Inline radius fittings would actually have made the job even easier in
cramped quarters...'cuz you don't have to wrestle the hose around a
corner. Instead, you put a hose connector on each end of the hose, put a
little PVC cement on the ends the radius...hold it in place while you
just put the ends together.

The particular place was at the part of the current gallery beginning
at
http://www.justpickone.org/skip/gall...ay06&start=155

I also cut a section to go over the hose where it bore against the
grease plug for the valve under it (intake valve, one on the through
hull as well), to prevent against chafe. Would you mind looking at
that and saying whether you think that radius is too tight?

It looks ok from what I could see.

Thanks again for your assistance. I've been promoting your book over
in a bunch of sailnet lists where sort of thing comes up all the time...

Thanks!

(thus my interest in AVS/Shields 101, you'll recall - and what was the
outcome of Aussiglobe?)...

It's gone. The best hose on the market now is Trident (which I think you
meant, not Shields) 101/102. In fact, it may even be better than AVS96,
'cuz it has a biocide in the rubber compound.
--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304

Bob wrote:
Not sure what head you have........ I put in a new PH 2 a few weeks ago
on PH's recomendation for heads under $200. The 3/4" supply hose from
the pump to the bowl was fastened on with nylon zip ties. The hose was
solid white with no markings and the ID was reduced by half because the
hose collapsed in place. Pretty Mickey Mouse OEM IMHO. But
hey........... for 200 bucks?

That hoseisn't intended to be anything but a means of making sure the
toilet works...it's expected that it'll be replaced with sanitation hose
when a vented loop installed.

So I called an industrial hose supply and asked for some clear pvc
"suction hose" with a hard helix coil. This stuff is the same stuff I
recommended for use as 1 1/2" bilge hose.

Cost was $.98/ foot. Now, "be advised" and "now hear this" the hose I
got is one stout hunk of hose. Very flexible but will not collapse when
bent or kinked. On the other hand, that clear stuff with the woven
reinforcement so common every where will collapse.

So this is where someone will chime in and say, "oh, oh! It is not
designed for below the water line applications. Why save ten cents and
have your boat sink?!?!?"

It's not likely to be the hose that sinks your boat or requires a mop,
it's the absence of a vented loop in the intake line. When you install
it, replace the cheap hose with any suitable hose that suits you.

I use it for all bilge and head intake applications. Now head discharge
is a whole nother story...................

Which, if your toilet is below waterline, also requires a vented loop.

Loops should be at least 6-8" above waterline at any angle of heel.

--
Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://shop.sailboatowners.com/books...ku=90&cat=1304