Well your source for information is obviously way out of date because
SeaDoo hasn't made the GTX RFI in a few years.

Here's Seadoo's marketing blurb for their current flagship model on the
CURRENT web site:
"Roughing it is relative on the GTX and GTX SC. Packed with two
powerful engine options, luxury to spare and smooth maneuverability. A
top-notch boat that takes riding to a new place. Like your favorite
camping spot. Or a little island hopping."

Here's their description of another model:

"If the journey is the reward, you may never reach your destination.
Thanks to the uncompromising luxury of the 2006 GTX Limited. With a 215
HP engine, and 18 features that make fully-loaded an understatement.
Perfect for carving up some serious glass at dusk. A weekend out of
town. Or a shopping spree in Venice."

Here's how they want to sell you on their current entry level model:

"We figure the best way to get you on the water is to design a PWC with
technology, ergonomics and convenience you feel great about. At a price
you still feel good about. So we totally redesigned our GTI recreation
models. And it goes well beyond the brand new, 3-Star Certified 130 HP
four-stroke Rotax engine. With 20 more horses than its closest rival
for an extra jolt of top speed, acceleration and handling that could
only come from a Sea-Doo watercraft. And a quiet efficiency that makes
competitive models seem downright obnoxious.

We went further. We rebuilt the entire hull. It's flatter and wider,
for more stability. It's easier to board, thanks to a larger rear
platform and reboarding ladder. In the highly unlikely event of a tip,
it's easier than ever to pop it back up. And since where the water
takes you sometimes depends on what you can take with you, there's the
exclusive Sea-Doo removable waterproof 10.6-gallon storage bin. The
Sea-Doo Learning Key is preprogrammed to limit RPMs, giving novices
more control and confidence.

Put simply, the design, technology, comfort and convenience packed into
these watercraft are unrivaled by anything in their class. And you'll
know it the minute you hop on an all-new GTI and take it for a spin.
Kind of makes you want to redefine a little thing called value, doesn't
it?"

The web site blurb for Yamaha's flagship model on their web site reads:
"The performance to get your family excited, the comfort to keep you
relaxed." They want us to know this about the boat: "With its all-new
ergonomically designed dash, the FX Cruiser High Output has an
automotive-like feel in the way it keeps riders comfortable and
invigorated at the same time. This WaveRunner offers a unique, Cruiser
style of riding - a contoured Cruiser seat, adjustable raised
handlebars and foot chocks create a three-point contact system that
gives the driver support while reducing tension on the arms and legs.
And because the passenger also has a supportive seat and handholds, the
driver is never crowded. Power, performance and comfort - all rolled
into one very full-featured flagship."

For their VX110 Deluxe model, the headline blurb reads "Family weekends
are even more valuable when they're affordable," there's a picture of a
grinning couple riding one of the boats. Let's look at the marketing
description for that watercraft on Yamaha's web site. Hmmm: "The VX110
Deluxe was designed to deliver fun and performance, while pairing
Yamaha's unparalleled reliability with a stylish design. The VX110
Deluxe is longer than comparable models, providing a rider-forward
design that not only accommodates a roomier, more comfortable seat, it
allows for a larger rear platform. This makes reboarding easy and
offers a great place to hang out and relax with the family." Wow,
really aggressive and testosterone-fueled marketing slant.

For their FX HO for '06 (I've got an '05, most versative and
comfortable pwc I've ever owned, I use it primarily for ambitious
long-distance cruises and overnight trips, and some of idle-speed
sightseeing explorations of scenic shallow creeks): "The FX High Output
doesn't just look like a sports car, it performs like one. Underneath
its new, sleek aerodynamic surface lies the most powerful four-stroke
engine in our arsenal - a High Output Yamaha Marine engine. Add to
that an ultralight high-strength hull, a high-pressure pump,
extraordinary handling and an exceptional power-to-weight ratio, and
you've got an ultimate performance machine. So if you're looking
for a high-performance WaveRunner that's quick, nimble and great for
offshore riding, prepare yourself for the FX High Output." Nothing
about attitude or leaving anybody in any wake. Wonder why I'm not
getting the same results you got?

Even their race model, the GP1300R, just goes this far: "Lots of
watercraft that offer performance, but the GP1300R is the WaveRunner
that blows right by them. With a technologically advanced,
fuel-injected, 170-horsepower Yamaha Marine engine, the GP1300R offers
enough power and control to make every ride exhilarating. Plus, with
features like Quick Shift Trim System and adjustable sponsons, you can
customize the handling to suit your individual preferences. If you want
the WaveRunner with the best performance and highest top speed, the
GP1300R is waiting." I don't know if powerful performance or
exhiliration upset you...still a far cry from the lines you pulled out
of I don't know where. (I know that advertising blurbs in recent
magazines I"ve seen say stuff like this, one has a dad riding two kids
through what looks lke canyons in Lake Powell or somewhere similar, the
blurb mentions the fact that it's a vacation with screaming happy kids
but no oversized rodents selling overpriced souvenirs...nothing like
the ones you cite. Did you make them up? I know you didn't, you just
used old, out of date ones to support your outdated perceptions.)

Let me check Kawasaki's web site.

Stx-15f, their current flagship mode:
With its fuel-injected, four-stroke engine and racing-inspired hull,
aggressive turning and high-speed stability are key performance
attributes of the STX-15F. It's not only loaded with features, but
the STX-15F has earned a coveted Three-Star Ultra-Low Emissions rating
from the California Air Resources Board (CARB). That's what Kawasaki
calls leading-edge technology. Dressed in new colors for 2006, it is
available in Jet White / Kawasaki Lime Green, and Firecracker Red /
Galaxy Silver. Available late 2005.

stx-12f:
"The STX-12F boasts a sporty design with its stylish deck and angular
seat, offering a muscular look befitting a high-performance watercraft.
The handlebars are located in a cab-forward position to provide plenty
of room for the rider. Plus, abundant floor space provides room for the
rider's feet. There are even footrests to help stabilize a
rear-facing spotter when pulling a skier, wake boarder or tuber. The
model that started Kawasaki's four-stroke watercraft revolution, also
earned CARB's Three-Star Ultra-Low Emissions rating, a full five
years prior to the mandated deadline. Dressed in new colors for 2006,
it is available in Jet white / Candy Thunder Blue. Available late
2005."

Once again, I'm looking for the words "attitude," "wake," "power trip"
(although I don't really think there's anything that wrong with
suggesting that the boats are fast and powerful; the emphasis in most
cases seems to be, JUST LIKE I SAID, on features, comfort, family
friendliness, reliability, clean-running engines, etc.

Here's how Kawasaki describes their stand=up model:
For riders who like to stand up in the breeze and lean into turns while
accelerating over the water, the 800 SX-R is the ultimate stand-up Jet
Ski watercraft. A descendant of the original 400cc model, this
watercraft thrills riders with a 781cc two-stroke engine and the most
power available in a production Kawasaki stand-up. Light and
quick-handling, it's the favorite among hard-core watercraft
enthusiasts and racers everywhere. Dressed in new colors for 2006, it
is available in Jet White / Kawasaki Lime Green, and Jet White / Pearl
Citrus Yellow. Available late 2005.

Let the good times roll.™

Maybe it supports your thesis because they mention that the watercraft
gives a thrilling and exciting ride? Still doesn't really sound too
aggressive or like it's about blasting around without caring about
anybody, in fact, this model is marketed towards athletic, dedicated
stand-up riders (the few, the proud, not me!), who are probably the
most responsible and knowledgeable pwc riders of all, in the sense
that, like with sailboats, it takes a lot of practice and skills just
to make one go in the first place.

Here's what Honda brags about with their flagship mode, the F-12X
GPScape: "its features continue to impress; 1235cc turbocharged
four-stroke engine, off-throttle steering system, selectable speed
limiter and electronic keyless ignition." Good reasons to give anybody
you see driving one the finger or assume the worst of them.

For their fastest and presumably most aggressively-oriented model, the
turbo-powered smaller two-seather the R-12X this is what they have to
say: "The sleek, specially-designed hull cuts through the water like a
scalpel. The two work seamlessly together to provide the perfect blend
of agility and stability. And since the R-12X is the world's only turbo
four-stroke two-seater, you can share the fun." Sounds like they're
really trying to appeal to on-water terrorists to me, agility and
stability, share the fun.

Really it still sounds to me like you're desperately trying to support
and refuse to change all of your outdated preconceptions. You've
cherry-picked a few brief quotes from some obviously outdated source,
I've quoted almost the entire current marketing materials from the
current web-site of ALL the pwc manufacturers in the market, and it
sounds like there just MIGHT be a little truth to what I said in the
first place, that they're marketing to families, to boaters, and
emphasizing comfort, features, technology, family use, rather than
sheer brute power and aggressive irresponsible riding.

But you know a lot more about this subject than I do.

Based on your observations.

richforman

In article .com,
wrote:

Well your source for information is obviously way out of date because
SeaDoo hasn't made the GTX RFI in a few years.

Here's Seadoo's marketing blurb for their current flagship model on the
CURRENT web site:
"Roughing it is relative on the GTX and GTX SC. Packed with two
powerful engine options, luxury to spare and smooth maneuverability. A
top-notch boat that takes riding to a new place. Like your favorite
camping spot. Or a little island hopping."

Here's their description of another model:

"If the journey is the reward, you may never reach your destination.
Thanks to the uncompromising luxury of the 2006 GTX Limited. With a 215
HP engine,

215 f*****g HORSEPOWER? For *ONE* or *TWO* people on a goddam toy? My
6.5 tonne workboat only has 2 225 HP turbo diesel engines driving
Hamilton jets, and it'll do in excess of 40 knots unladen!

Thanks for that, you've confirmed my opinion. Those damn things should
be banned from all public waterways. Far too much HP for any rational
purpose.

PDW

Peter Wiley wrote:
In article .com,
wrote:

Well your source for information is obviously way out of date because
SeaDoo hasn't made the GTX RFI in a few years.

Here's Seadoo's marketing blurb for their current flagship model on the
CURRENT web site:
"Roughing it is relative on the GTX and GTX SC. Packed with two
powerful engine options, luxury to spare and smooth maneuverability. A
top-notch boat that takes riding to a new place. Like your favorite
camping spot. Or a little island hopping."

Here's their description of another model:

"If the journey is the reward, you may never reach your destination.
Thanks to the uncompromising luxury of the 2006 GTX Limited. With a 215
HP engine,

215 f*****g HORSEPOWER? For *ONE* or *TWO* people on a goddam toy? My
6.5 tonne workboat only has 2 225 HP turbo diesel engines driving
Hamilton jets, and it'll do in excess of 40 knots unladen!

Thanks for that, you've confirmed my opinion. Those damn things should
be banned from all public waterways. Far too much HP for any rational
purpose.


Makes sense! Let's ban 'em all because PDW says it's too much
horsepower! What is the cut-off for an acceptable level of power, and
who will be the arbiter of what qualifies as a "rational purpose"?
Well, PDW, of course!

And again - very important - your analysis here fails on one very
important point: we're talking about boats, not toys! It's when
anybody thinks or treats pwc's as toys, I suspect, that most of the
conflicts and problems arise! (Operating them without knowing what
they're doing, etc.)


richforman

PDW

In article . com,
wrote:

Peter Wiley wrote:
In article .com,
wrote:

Well your source for information is obviously way out of date because
SeaDoo hasn't made the GTX RFI in a few years.

Here's Seadoo's marketing blurb for their current flagship model on the
CURRENT web site:
"Roughing it is relative on the GTX and GTX SC. Packed with two
powerful engine options, luxury to spare and smooth maneuverability. A
top-notch boat that takes riding to a new place. Like your favorite
camping spot. Or a little island hopping."

Here's their description of another model:

"If the journey is the reward, you may never reach your destination.
Thanks to the uncompromising luxury of the 2006 GTX Limited. With a 215
HP engine,

215 f*****g HORSEPOWER? For *ONE* or *TWO* people on a goddam toy? My
6.5 tonne workboat only has 2 225 HP turbo diesel engines driving
Hamilton jets, and it'll do in excess of 40 knots unladen!

Thanks for that, you've confirmed my opinion. Those damn things should
be banned from all public waterways. Far too much HP for any rational
purpose.


Makes sense! Let's ban 'em all because PDW says it's too much
horsepower! What is the cut-off for an acceptable level of power, and
who will be the arbiter of what qualifies as a "rational purpose"?
Well, PDW, of course!

And again - very important - your analysis here fails on one very
important point: we're talking about boats, not toys! It's when
anybody thinks or treats pwc's as toys, I suspect, that most of the
conflicts and problems arise! (Operating them without knowing what
they're doing, etc.)

They *are* toys. They may be toys that float, but they're still toys.
OTOH my workboats are just that.

My sailboat is a toy. It serves no practical purpose except to provide
me with entertainment.

PDW

Peter Wiley wrote:

They *are* toys. They may be toys that float, but they're still toys.
OTOH my workboats are just that.

My sailboat is a toy. It serves no practical purpose except to provide
me with entertainment.


Well, I don't know. Okay, in that very loose sense, the same sense
that all recreational boats would be classified as toys, meaning they
can be used for recreation and to have fun, we can say that. But
really - well, ask a CoastGuard or Power Squadron member or marine law
enforcer if pwc's are toys, see what they think. The first point they
make in the user's manuals, safety instruction videos, and those
special safety courses you have to take to ride them here in New York
State - is in fact that they are not toys, but serious pieces of
machinery to be approached and treated with respect and seriousness.
Kind of ironic, some of us here are talking about irresponsible,
dangerous operators, and it seems to me that those problems start right
off the bat when these people think of them as toys and approach them
that way, failing to realize that, in a very important way, these
aren't toys at all.

richforman

PDW