Another post concerned an 86 yr old wanting to sail over the horizon
but it had gotten too long, so...........
I was once forced to spend a few days at the harbor of Dog Island in N.
FL cuz it was just too nasty to go the three miles back to the
mainland. While hanging out on the dock, a very frail old lady with a
walker slowly made her way down the dock and into an open 19' sailboat
carefully stowing her walker. Finally, a younger woman came along and
told me that her granny insisted on going into town for her checkup in
spite of the weather. I expressed reservations about this but she
seemed to be a knowledgable sailor. The next day they came back and
when they got back on the dock I asked how it had been, the old woman
shook her head and said "I kept telling her to take the waves on the
quarter, but she wouldnt listen" Clearly, she knew what she was doing.

On 17 Dec 2005 14:32:23 -0800, wrote:

Another post concerned an 86 yr old wanting to sail over the horizon
but it had gotten too long, so...........
I was once forced to spend a few days at the harbor of Dog Island in N.
FL cuz it was just too nasty to go the three miles back to the
mainland. While hanging out on the dock, a very frail old lady with a
walker slowly made her way down the dock and into an open 19' sailboat
carefully stowing her walker. Finally, a younger woman came along and
told me that her granny insisted on going into town for her checkup in
spite of the weather. I expressed reservations about this but she
seemed to be a knowledgable sailor. The next day they came back and
when they got back on the dock I asked how it had been, the old woman
shook her head and said "I kept telling her to take the waves on the
quarter, but she wouldnt listen" Clearly, she knew what she was doing.

That speaks to the old woman's judgement, at an advanced age probably
the greatest part of her ability.

I didn't read the entirety of the previous thread, and I know some
85-plus sailors at my club, but I didn't see whether anyone mentioned
reaction time and confusion being issues. If I were in a shipping
channel with The Old Man On the Sea and his mind wandered while
helming in a tight spot, his heavy, large yacht could easily run down
a couple of Sharks and a dory or two before he'd feel the rumbling of
rig on keel over the diesel.

I have been in racing situations with 75 year old guys screwing up
dangerously at the start and I can say that few of us seem to know
when to swallow the anchor. On the other hand, I've had 80 year olds
helming like Ahab in 40 knots quite effectively, but it's fair to say
that's the exception, not the rule.

A lot of older couples take a 30-something crew to handle sail
stowing, anchors and halyards, it seems. They remain "co-captains",
but the muscle stuff is farmed out. That seems logical.

R.

Commodore Joe Redcloud wrote:
On 17 Dec 2005 14:32:23 -0800, wrote:

Another post concerned an 86 yr old wanting to sail over the horizon
but it had gotten too long, so...........
I was once forced to spend a few days at the harbor of Dog Island in
N. FL cuz it was just too nasty to go the three miles back to the
mainland. While hanging out on the dock, a very frail old lady with
a walker slowly made her way down the dock and into an open 19'
sailboat carefully stowing her walker. Finally, a younger woman
came along and told me that her granny insisted on going into town
for her checkup in spite of the weather. I expressed reservations
about this but she seemed to be a knowledgable sailor. The next day
they came back and when they got back on the dock I asked how it had
been, the old woman shook her head and said "I kept telling her to
take the waves on the quarter, but she wouldnt listen" Clearly, she
knew what she was doing.

People have different abilities at all ages. Some people die of old
age when they are 50, and some people at 99 can dance the boog-a-loo
all night long.

At 84, my father hurt his knee carrying a full bucket of tar up a
ladder to repair a leak in the roof of his house. He wasn't one to go
running to the doctor , but after 3 months it was still painful.

The doctor examined him, and said, "well you have to expect things
like this at your age". My father, without batting an eye, replied,
"That is not true. My other knee is the exact same age and IT DOESN'T
HURT AT ALL!"

At 90, my father complained to his doctor that he was tired all the
time. The doctor asked him if he was still walking every day. My
father replied that he was still walking 6 miles every day. The
doctor suggested that he cut down to 2 miles and see if he was still
so tired all the time.


Commodore Joe Redcloud

That's exactly the remark my own medic made to me when I went to see him
about my left knee, and my reply was also the same. They don't have an
answer to that one. I suspect that the ruptured quads tendon I incurred 15
years ago whist sailing may have had something to do with it, but he had my
notes open at the time, and this didn't seem to strike him as a possibilty.

Guess they are trained at medic school to use stock phrases like this. It
called the no-intervention syndrome, and saves the NHS a fortune in
operating theatre costs! UK that is. In the US, don't they judge your
operability by the thickness of you wallet? ;-))

On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:30:20 GMT, "Dennis Pogson"
wrote:


*snip!

Guess they are trained at medic school to use stock phrases like this. It
called the no-intervention syndrome, and saves the NHS a fortune in
operating theatre costs! UK that is. In the US, don't they judge your
operability by the thickness of you wallet? ;-))


That's still the most common way in the US.

But things are changing. More and more people are becoming aware
of real healthcare instead of our Medical Doctors, who are trained to
use drugs. (Contrary to the Oath of Hippocrates, I might add. Drugs
are, ipso facto, poisonous. That's why they are controlled substances.
Anyone who takes the Oath is vowing to never use poisonous or harmful
substances.)

There is more awareness of real health care. This may include
surgery or drugs, but is more likely to include diet, lifestyle,
breathing, thinking, exercise, and relationships.

You are mischaracterizing the Hippocratic Oath. The relevant part of the
(classical) oath is as follows:

I will neither give a deadly drug to anybody who asked for it, nor will I
make a suggestion to this effect. Similarly I will not give to a woman an
abortive remedy. In purity and holiness I will guard my life and my art.

Clearly this is refering to refusing to help someone commit suicide with
drugs. This does not refer to medical use of drugs intended to cure
ailments or relieve suffering without being fatal.

Archie Peligo

"Skipper" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:30:20 GMT, "Dennis Pogson"
wrote:


snip

(Contrary to the Oath of Hippocrates, I might add. Drugs
are, ipso facto, poisonous. That's why they are controlled substances.
Anyone who takes the Oath is vowing to never use poisonous or harmful
substances.)


snip

"Archie Peligo" wrote in message
...
You are mischaracterizing the Hippocratic Oath. The relevant part of the
(classical) oath is as follows:

I will neither give a deadly drug to anybody who asked for it, nor will I
make a suggestion to this effect. Similarly I will not give to a woman an
abortive remedy. In purity and holiness I will guard my life and my art.

Clearly this is refering to refusing to help someone commit suicide with
drugs. This does not refer to medical use of drugs intended to cure
ailments or relieve suffering without being fatal.

Archie Peligo

"Skipper" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:30:20 GMT, "Dennis Pogson"
wrote:


snip

(Contrary to the Oath of Hippocrates, I might add. Drugs
are, ipso facto, poisonous. That's why they are controlled substances.
Anyone who takes the Oath is vowing to never use poisonous or harmful
substances.)


snip



Thanks Archie for pointing out that error. Interestingly surgery is
forbidden by the Hippocratic Oath as well, to wit:

"I will not use the knife, not even on sufferers from stone, but will
withdraw in favour of such men as are engaged in this work."

The "stone" in this case applied to bladder stones which were very painful
and given the quick and easy surgery was the most common operation performed
prior to anaesthesia. Some English surgeons were recorded as finishing the
operation in a minute or so. I'm glad I didn't have to have an incision
through abdominal wall into bladder without anaesthesia.

Apparently a "modernised" version of the Oath is still common in the US, but
internationally it has fallen by the wayside in medical schools as the
original precepts often do not apply in the modern world.

Regarding the original topic- I don't think you can ever be too old to sail,
but you might be too sick to sail.


Peter HK

Dennis Pogson wrote:
I suspect that the ruptured quads tendon I incurred 15
years ago whist sailing may have had something to do with it, but he had my
notes open at the time, and this didn't seem to strike him as a possibilty.

Guess they are trained at medic school to use stock phrases like this. It
called the no-intervention syndrome, and saves the NHS a fortune in
operating theatre costs! UK that is. In the US, don't they judge your
operability by the thickness of you wallet? ;-))

Just because he had the notes open doesn't mean he was seeing what was
there. Mine will look at his notes and I will have to remind him of why
I'm there and what he has given me, whereupon he will re-open his notes
and confirm it. He is very interested in boats which I suspect has
caused some nuerological damage. In fact that is why I keep going to
the airhead, as the waiting room is stocked with a 3 foot pile of '
Wooden Boats' and other publications. Sam