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#21
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On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:33:59 -0500, Jean Dufour
wrote: Hi Peter! I do not disagree with you on the matter that CGs will procees a Pan Pan or Mayday according to the emergency of the situation if described, but when I got my operator licence, them calls were clearly described as such: Mayday: Life threatening emergency. Pan Pan: Non-life threatening emergency. I do not believe the boat is the greatest concern to rescue people and CGs. So I believe asking the question "Is someone's life in danger?". That's the only thing one should ask himself. Yes: Mayday, Nope: Pan Pan and that's it. The CPS Maritime Radio Course manual states that a Distress (Mayday) call can only be sent if the _vessel_ is in grave and imminent danger, or is aware of another vessel that is in grave and imminent danger - no mention of people. However, I have a US book that does include "person" in the above definition, and I recall seeing something from a Canadian Coast Guard website that indicated that a person in danger could justify a Mayday. I always teach that whether a person in danger is a justifies Mayday or not, it will be handled with the highest priority, regardless of how the originator of the call started it. Another good thing is that you can't get shot by a Canadian CG as they don't carry guns! ;-) this is true... Jean Montreal -- Peter Bennett, VE7CEI peterbb4 (at) interchange.ubc.ca new newsgroup users info : http://vancouver-webpages.com/nnq GPS and NMEA info: http://vancouver-webpages.com/peter Vancouver Power Squadron: http://vancouver.powersquadron.ca |
#22
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On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 07:43:40 -0800, "Steve" wrote:
Can I get a clear definition of "Pan-Pan", who and when may it be declared. Less than MayDay and a judgement call on the urgency. Possibly appropriate in a situation of unknown severity. I called Pan-Pan a few years ago in the middle of the night on Lake Ontario after sighting flares. The Coast Guard operator told me I made the right call with good form, then explained it was the military on an exercise and that they claimed there was no need for broadcast notice because "nobody ever sees our flares". We continued cautiously through the area and never sighted lights or other signs of the origin of the flares. Ryk |
#23
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"Rolf" wrote in message ups.com... Some examples may help from my own experience with my 33 ft sailboat.. Once I was in the shipping channel very close to Golden Gate bridge. Suddenly my ruddeer breaks off and i am without steering. My boat cannot be steered without the rudder. There is a lot of current and also some very heavy container and ther large ships. Even though the boat was not sinking, I felt my life was in imminent grave danger from the rocks and possible being hit by a big boat which have no room for maneuver. I called Mayday and the coast guard obviously agreed with my judgement. They came out and towed me to a small yacht harbor. At this point the emergency was over and they left after giving my vessel a safety inspection. Good call. If I would have been some other place where there is no shipping traffic and no rocks, this would have been a call to a towing service, which is neither Pan, nor an urgency call. Running out of gasoline is not normally a Mayday ( no people in imminent danger ) nor a Pan, nor an urgency call. It is simply a telephone call to atowing service to bring gasoline or tow to a pump. The coast guard will not respond in this case. I would dissagreed here. I think a Pan-Pan would be reasonable because being adrift with no control can quickly deteriate into a dangerous situation. One should first attempt to summon help via phone, radio, handwaving, etc but if that is unsuccessful then declaring a non-lifethreatinging emergency is reasonable. In San Francisco Bay we get a lot of securitee calls from the coast guard, which advises people of floating logs in the water. Same here on THE bay. Doug Dotson wrote: "Steve" wrote in message ... Can I get a clear definition of "Pan-Pan", who and when may it be declared. I have hard the USCG declare "Pan-Pan", followed by a requirement that all none "Pan-Pan" traffic on channel 16 traffic be suspended. True. Pan-Pan (pronounced Pon-Pon) is a non-life threatening emergency. Can an individual boat declare "Pan-Pan", say when a crew member is lost overboard, etc?? Any vessel can call Pan-Pan. A crew member lost overboard would be a MAYDAY however. I fairly sure I understand when I could send a "May Day" but, to me, Pan Pan is something more recent and I must have missed out on earlier definition.. Thanks Steve s/v Good Intentions |
#24
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On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 00:31:46 -0500, Ryk
wrote: On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 07:43:40 -0800, "Steve" wrote: Can I get a clear definition of "Pan-Pan", who and when may it be declared. Less than MayDay and a judgement call on the urgency. Possibly appropriate in a situation of unknown severity. I called Pan-Pan a few years ago in the middle of the night on Lake Ontario after sighting flares. The Coast Guard operator told me I made the right call with good form, then explained it was the military on an exercise and that they claimed there was no need for broadcast notice because "nobody ever sees our flares". We continued cautiously through the area and never sighted lights or other signs of the origin of the flares. This is a good point because it illustrates how "Pan-Pan" alerts others to your apprehension of danger, rather than just your OWN danger. Sighting flares at night in such a spot (usually sparsely travelled out of the ship lanes) leads to a reasonable assumption that someone was potentially in a Mayday situation. I am glad the Coast Guard was able to provide a reasonable answer that put the matter to rest. Did you provide a GPS lat/lon or just a general DR position, because I can see a situation where a boat could sink within a short distance of a military exercise without necessarily being seen. Ironic, but they are separate situations that might be proximate. R. |
#25
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"Doug Dotson" dougdotson@NOSPAMcablespeedNOSPAMcom wrote:
"Steve" wrote in message Can I get a clear definition of "Pan-Pan", who and when may it be declared. I have hard the USCG declare "Pan-Pan", followed by a requirement that all none "Pan-Pan" traffic on channel 16 traffic be suspended. True. Pan-Pan (pronounced Pon-Pon) is a non-life threatening emergency. Can an individual boat declare "Pan-Pan", say when a crew member is lost overboard, etc?? Any vessel can call Pan-Pan. A crew member lost overboard would be a MAYDAY however. From a UK perspective, I've been told that MOB on a well-crewed race yacht involving say, a foredeck monkey, would be a Pan-Pan, but a MOB where the remaining crew are 75-yo grandfather on the helm, and an 12-yo child down below would be a Mayday. I assume we all agree that SAR prefer to downgrade rather than upgrade when it's too late. ISTR that (in the EU at least), 'Pan-Pan Medico'[0] has been depricated. rgds, Alan [0] i.e STFU, I want to speak to a doctor 'cos I'm not sure that it's 'grave and iminent' -- 99 Ducati 748BP, 95 Ducati 600SS, 81 Guzzi Monza, 74 MV Agusta 350 "Ride to Work, Work to Ride" SI# 7.067 DoD#1930 PGP Key 0xBDED56C5 |
#26
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On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 15:37:08 -0500, rhys wrote:
I am glad the Coast Guard was able to provide a reasonable answer that put the matter to rest. Did you provide a GPS lat/lon or just a general DR position, Full precision position data and description of the situation in my original broadcast, just as they taught me in class. I was rather surprised and pleased that I managed to get it right. We confirmed on further exchange that yes, we were about X miles due south of Y by our reckoning just to be sure I wasn't reading the data points wrong. (decimal vs DDD:MM:SS?) because I can see a situation where a boat could sink within a short distance of a military exercise without necessarily being seen. Ironic, but they are separate situations that might be proximate. I suspect they saw us, even though we weren't showing anything more than nav lights, and that's why we didn't see them ;-) Ryk |
#27
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On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 17:37:33 -0800, Peter Bennett
wrote: /// Although "Mayday" officially indicates the _vessel_ is in grave and imminent danger, you are unlikely to be shot if you use it for man overboard or serious medical emergencies. /// There is something about this note on Mayday that doesn't seem quite right to me. Mayday is (in my view) associated with imminent danger to life. A ship, a sail boat, or an airplane may be lost, but if life is not in question, the degree of attention is not the highest, as I see it. Brian Whatcott Altus, OK |
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