Everett wrote:
So why doesn't Southern California allow Electra-San treated discharge??

Everett

"Peggie Hall" wrote in message
...

Paolo Zini wrote:

...CUT...
removing it altogether...why store waste aboard if you can discharge it
legally AND with far less negative environmental impact than dumping a
tank?

There is a movement afoot to ban chlorine as a deadly poison. We
should minimise or eleiminate poisonous chlorine. -tk

just curious... Do you like to swim in your s**t?

Every sewage treatment plant in the world discharges into somebody's
waters...so it's just a matter of how well treated you want it to be.

And fwiw, the negative impact from just ONE dumped holding tank is greater
on the surrounding waters than that from 1000 boats, all using
Lectra/Sans, in the same waters for 24 hours.

Peggie

....For an area about twice the size of your boat, for about 20
minutes, after which the effect becomes the same as if there was
about one boat using the area for ten minutes per day. It's a
question of concentrations, not quantity. It's the same as peeing
over the side when you need to, or holding it for ten minutes or so,
then peeing over the side. It's a sin which boaters are incapable of
comitting on any scale comparable to any municipal government. Who
should be getting chased over this? Municipal taxpayers and feedlot
operators and agricultural producers and their customers. (That's
"us" folks!) We can't afford wars overseas, we got a war to win in
our own back yard.

And to add to the panic, just think of the devastation to the
ecology whenever a large fish dies. The rotting corpse, full of
deadly E.Coli, fairly explodes with pathogens and methane, wiping
out entire oceans of tiny aquatic phytoplankton victims, force fed
to death, and endangered further by feeding their most deadly
enemies. What is worse is that the local scavangers reproduce
freely as a result, which hugely increases the danger that their
population will overload the ecosystem of an entire region.

The reason they keep swimming in Shanghai harbour is, they got no
where else to go, murcury or no.

We need to do one of two things:

Improve health care for large fish, so as to improve the scenery for
tourists, our only hope for a viable economy, or,

Wipe out those fish which die too often, so as to clean up the
beaches and get rid of those nasty scavangers. Starve them I say,
just like killing the Bison got rid of the pesky native indigenous
primates that stood in the way of an effective economy here in North
America 400 years ago.

Tripe, anyone?

Nature has been looking after herself for a while, as she will
continue to do long after all of stupid humanity has rotted away and
the reptiles take over again. Oh, unless the globe is all
radioactive, in which case, it wil be the insects that take over.

The real question is how and when, not if.

We are being mislead by greedy fools, again, still.

A side of hubris with that?

Terry K

I support David Suzuki as this year's greatest Canadian, but what's
he gonna do for us next year? What are YOU gonna do? That will be
his real measure.

Hi, Y'all,

Well, things are progressing on the boat - I'll go back again, this time for
two weeks, just after Thanksgiving week. Removal of the forward head
plumbing, save the hoses to and from the holding tank (only pump up/out,
can't dump), is on the list if I get the reefer done. However...

"Peggie Hall" wrote in message
...
Skip Gundlach wrote:
Back to the subject at hand, if getting them in is as easy as getting
them
out, I'm all for not doing it again. Granted, I had to take out
something
on the order of double, in that I removed the aft Lectra-San, with its
attendant very long runs of hose...

There shouldn't be any long runs of hose in a Lectra/San installation.

In our boat's case, the forward unit is well installed, I think, being in
the lavatory, right next to the head. However, in the aft, there was over
6' of run both to and from the unit to the drop - and the intake had to
clear the high vapor lock before heading downhill to it. Not a good
location for it to be installed, I don't think, though, in that instance,
short of having it on a shelf over the stool, I don't know where else they'd
have put it. In any case, we'll be in clear discharge areas all the time,
and for those exceptions which may occur, there's the forward head.

It should be installed within 6' of the toilet and also within 6' of the
discharge thru-hull. Two toilets CAN be connected to the same unit, but
only if the L/S can be within 6' of both. I think you made a mistake in
removing it altogether...why store waste aboard if you can discharge it
legally AND with far less negative environmental impact than dumping a
tank?

Heh. I spoke with someone who told me they had a "super unit" of some sort,
which LS maintained allowed them to dump (well, throughput) into
no-discharge zones. They didn't have a holding tank aboard for that reason.
In our case, we'll have one, should it ever be an issue - but until someone
changes the ocean rules where we're going, it won't matter.

As to the later poster wanting to know if we enjoyed swimming in our own
effluvia, it's a fair question. However, I don't think there's nearly any
place we'll be where folks are making an effort to be retentive, so to
speak, so we'd be swimming in theirs, too. Of course, that doesn't
acknowledge all the fish and porpoises and other things in addition to the
shoreside impacts on anchoring areas. Ya pretty much gotta stay ashore and
use municipal water if you want to avoid any contamination at all, or have,
as one of the regulars here does, a distillation system for your own water.

So, we'll just be prudent about where we stop and make sure there's some
form of natural washing going on...


, *plus* the very tall vented loop runs...

Necessary for any below waterline thru-hull connection...so you gained
nothing there.

On the center line, how far above the water line does it
have to be for safety? Above any level of conceivable heel's waterline?

Above waterline at any anglel of heel.

Given that it's full of water and other crap (pardon the expression),
all
the time, against the duckbill, it makes me wonder.

Any manual marine toilet that's working anywhere near factory specs can
move bowl contents at least 6' in the dry mode...so if you learn how to
flush your toilet correctly, there shouldn't be any water or waste in
the line between the toilet and top of the loop to run back down into
the bowl.

This has me very curious. You're saying that enough
speed/pressure/whatever-moves-it is developed, in an anti-siphon environment
(the vented loop), that I can clear a 1.5" line for what is (in the new
installation) about 3.5-4 feet by dry flushing?

I buy that I might be able to flush solids, with water, that far, if I'm
aggressive enough with my volume (and the Raritans we have probably put in a
cup per stroke or so), but I don't see how that pipe can empty, dry pump or
not. I'd have to think the surface tension of the water would not be
sufficient to prevent the water running past the bubble at the edges, as you
recharge between strokes. I'd be thrilled to think I could really empty it,
as that - with a straight discharge - would go a long way to keep odor down
(should be only sea water to make odor, that way). Help me out with my
physics, here?


On the subject of joints, I'm of distinctly curious mind. While my
current
home isn't this way, my prior home had hundreds of feet of PVC pipe run,
with all the necessary ells, Ts and other fittings, all successfully
carrying high pressure hot and cold water.... Am I missing something?

What you're missing is: houses stay put...they don't get tossed around
by wind and wave. Boats do.

Well, yes, of course. But if I secure a large pipe, in a short run, under
next to no pressure, it's not going to move. In the house example, you
could see the distortion of the hot water pipe from expansion vs resting
state as hot water entered, and see it jump as the water was shut off and
turned on - but it all stayed together. In the boat, we'll use hose as
movement absorbers.

Not trying to be argumentative - just understand why I shouldn't be doing as
SeaLand recommends...

Peggie
----------
Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and
Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"

By the way, I promoted your book to several people complaining of stinky
heads, and saw many of them being bought from the vendor table at the SSCA
Gam in Melbourne the first weekend in November...

L8R

Skip (and Lydia, by proxy)

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig
http://tinyurl.com/384p2

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain