On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 19:55:39 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:
What
will be left to differentiate us "sailors" from the farmers?

Get one of those Capt'n hats. Even works in Iowa.
Add a rubber parrot on the shoulder so there's no mistaking you.
When you buy feed the parrot will alert the clerk to your real
identity every time, in case he thinks the hat is just a strange
bandana.
I was surprised to read on the first link that steaming Navy vessels
carried sails as a backup for 32 years after the intro of steam.

--Vic

On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 07:18:49 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 19:55:39 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:
What
will be left to differentiate us "sailors" from the farmers?

Get one of those Capt'n hats. Even works in Iowa.
Add a rubber parrot on the shoulder so there's no mistaking you.
When you buy feed the parrot will alert the clerk to your real
identity every time, in case he thinks the hat is just a strange
bandana.
I was surprised to read on the first link that steaming Navy vessels
carried sails as a backup for 32 years after the intro of steam.

--Vic

Yes - can't trust this newfangled stuff.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 21:11:46 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

I was surprised to read on the first link that steaming Navy vessels
carried sails as a backup for 32 years after the intro of steam.

--Vic

Yes - can't trust this newfangled stuff.

Until the perfection of the triple expansion steam engine, you
couldn't carry enough coal to cross oceans. What you could do with
limited coal was enter harbors, up rivers and against the wind. In a
fight you could take in the sails and manuver independent of the wind.

That is what you call an overwhelming advantage over a sail only ship.
Prior to the perfection of the screw propellor, the paddle wheels
presented huge targets and took out lots of broadside space used for
guns on a sail only ship. One reason steam was slow to be adopted. It
was used for harbor tugs early on.

Casady

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says...
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says...
On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 21:11:46 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

I was surprised to read on the first link that steaming Navy vessels
carried sails as a backup for 32 years after the intro of steam.

--Vic

Yes - can't trust this newfangled stuff.

The Titanic (and I presume her sister ships Britannic and Olympic)
carried emergency sails.


Interesting. The rigging plan at
http://titanic-theshipmagnificent.co...icRiggingPlan/

doesn't seem to show any sail control lines or yards.


Mark Borgerson

In article ,
says...
In article ,
says...
In article ,
says...
In article ,
says...
On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 21:11:46 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

I was surprised to read on the first link that steaming Navy vessels
carried sails as a backup for 32 years after the intro of steam.

--Vic

Yes - can't trust this newfangled stuff.

The Titanic (and I presume her sister ships Britannic and Olympic)
carried emergency sails.


Interesting. The rigging plan at
http://titanic-theshipmagnificent.co...icRiggingPlan/

doesn't seem to show any sail control lines or yards.


Mark Borgerson

Ref: British Government, Loss of the Steamship Titanic, Report of formal
investigation (Washington: Governmernt Printing Office, 1912) p. 29.


Is that report available on line? It would be interesting to see what
sort of sails they hand and what kind of progress they would expect
if the engines failed.

The only thing I found was:

http://www.titanicinquiry.org/BOTInq...pStructure.php

"Masts and Rigging. - The vessel was rigged with two masts, and fore and
aft sails. The two pole masts were constructed of steel, and stiffened
with angle irons. The poles at the top of the mast were made of teak."

I wonder how effective a few fore and aft sails might have been,
considering the windage and weight of the ship.





Mark Borgerson

Gogarty wrote:
... I did most of my research at the Library of Congress
and had access to all the original documents.

I doubt those sails could have been very effective at all. Puts me in mind of
vestigial organs or limbs that once had a function but no longer do and
nobody can figure out why they are still there except they always have been.
I measn look at the design of your average 1920s megayacht with long bowsprit
and clipper bow and raked masts that might carry sails but never did.


My guess, for what it's worth:
with no sails, Titanic might have made 3 points off downwind to either
side with no adverse run of the sea.
With both sails set, you might notch it up to 4 points off the downwind,
and a shade faster....

Brian W

Brian Whatcott wrote:
My guess, for what it's worth:
with no sails, Titanic might have made 3 points off downwind to either
side with no adverse run of the sea.
With both sails set, you might notch it up to 4 points off the downwind,
and a shade faster....


Oh c'mon...look at the rake to her masts! Surely the schooner Titanic
would have pointed like a witch!

Actually IIRC the major purpose of carrying sails was to qualify as a
mail ship. Ancient regulations & all that.

DSK