"Marty" wrote in message
...
Richard Casady wrote:
How come stainless cable is more than six times as costly as
galvanized, yet nobody uses the galvanized. Stainless the same size
has about 80% of the breaking strength. Galvanized is what they guy
power poles with.

Casady


Well, the price differential isn't that high, if you don't buy SS wire
that is preceded by the six most expensive letters in the English
alphabet; M A R I N E.

The basic material is more costly, and great deal more galvanized is used
throughout the world, cranes, tow cable, highway restraint cable, antenna
guys, drilling derricks......etc.


Properly cared for galvanized will out last steel, take an old boat
restoration class or two, ignore Wilbur/Neal, he knows nothing about
boats.

Yes, it is Ok in any application where you can grease it. But you can't
grease your rigging unless you want your sails, ropes and everything else to
get covered in it.

"hpeer" wrote in message
m...
Marty wrote:
Richard Casady wrote:
How come stainless cable is more than six times as costly as
galvanized, yet nobody uses the galvanized. Stainless the same size
has about 80% of the breaking strength. Galvanized is what they guy
power poles with.

Casady


Well, the price differential isn't that high, if you don't buy SS wire
that is preceded by the six most expensive letters in the English
alphabet; M A R I N E.

The basic material is more costly, and great deal more galvanized is used
throughout the world, cranes, tow cable, highway restraint cable, antenna
guys, drilling derricks......etc.


Properly cared for galvanized will out last steel, take an old boat
restoration class or two, ignore Wilbur/Neal, he knows nothing about
boats.

Cheers
Martin

Bernard Boitessier rigged Joshua with galvanized wire and wood poles.
Worked for him. Not exactly light or pretty but worked.

Galvanised rigging looks perfectly OK but will start to rust after a year or
two. However this rusting is easy to check, since it will almost always
start at the lower ends of the shrouds where salt spray reaches it most
often. For this reason you mut periodically remove the seizing from the
splice at the lower end to make sure that hidden rust has not started inside
the splice.

"Marty" wrote in message
...
hpeer wrote:


Properly cared for galvanized will out last steel, take an old boat
restoration class or two, ignore Wilbur/Neal, he knows nothing about
boats.

Cheers
Martin

Bernard Boitessier rigged Joshua with galvanized wire and wood poles.
Worked for him. Not exactly light or pretty but worked.

Indeed, check out the great sailing vessels of the end of the 19th century
and early 20th, some of which are still plying the seas.

They were not yachts so there was no objection to coating the wires
frequently with Stockholm tar to prevent corrosion.
Anyway stainless steel was only invented around WW1 time

Edgar wrote:
"Marty" wrote in message
...
Richard Casady wrote:
How come stainless cable is more than six times as costly as
galvanized, yet nobody uses the galvanized. Stainless the same size
has about 80% of the breaking strength. Galvanized is what they guy
power poles with.

Casady

Well, the price differential isn't that high, if you don't buy SS wire
that is preceded by the six most expensive letters in the English
alphabet; M A R I N E.

The basic material is more costly, and great deal more galvanized is used
throughout the world, cranes, tow cable, highway restraint cable, antenna
guys, drilling derricks......etc.


Properly cared for galvanized will out last steel, take an old boat
restoration class or two, ignore Wilbur/Neal, he knows nothing about
boats.

Yes, it is Ok in any application where you can grease it. But you can't
grease your rigging unless you want your sails, ropes and everything else to
get covered in it.

For the boats we sail, annual soaking in linseed oil will suffice, and
leave a lot less mess on your sails..

Cheers
Martin

On Mon, 9 Feb 2009 22:45:55 -0800 (PST), Two meter troll
wrote:

On Feb 9, 10:35 pm, Bruce wrote:
On Mon, 09 Feb 2009 23:46:11 GMT, (Richard

Casady) wrote:
How come stainless cable is more than six times as costly as
galvanized, yet nobody uses the galvanized. Stainless the same size
has about 80% of the breaking strength. Galvanized is what they guy
power poles with.

Casady

Basically using galvanized wire rope just takes a LOT more
maintenance, and a LOT more time to build. If you are doing your own
work then perhaps it is more economical, but if you are paying others
the it is doubtful

The first problem comes when you attempt to locate proper heavy duty
thimbles for the eyes. Damned hard to find. Next comes splicing the
eyes in the cables. Again, if you can do it yourself and have the
tools then go for it but if you are paying rigger's rates then get
your wallet ready.

Now you have the cables cut, spliced around proper heavy duty
thimbles. Next step is to worm, parcel and serve all splices and
usually the lower cables up 10 - 15 feet above the deck. Once that is
done you need to mix up some slushing and paint the cables, working it
well into the wrappings.

Now! At last, you can rig the boat. But remember that annually you
will need to inspect, replace worn wrappings and re-slush all the
cables and slushing is a mixture of tar, oil, Japan dryer and various
other arcane substances. (think roofing tar) so don't even begin to
think about slushing down the rigging while in a marina slip as you
will sprinkle not only your deck but your neighbor's decks with
sticky, black, tarry gunk.

Now, having said all that you might be interested that properly
maintained galvanized rigging will out last stainless.

Cheers,

Bruce

Bruce where the hell do you get that idea? spend a couple pennies more
and get the better galv.
you just described what i do to my standing rigging and mine is all
manella and hemp. yes with proper care galv will out last SS but the
level of care is not serving the bloody thing. you soak the cable warm
for a bit till the grave penetrates the core and then gravy the
outside about twice a year.


If you want galvanize to last 15 - 20 - 30 years, or longer, then you
do it the old fashioned way I described. Otherwise you will be
changing the stuff every ten years or so.

Hell, I've seen boats rigged with telephone pole cables and cable
clips. It works but you get to replace the rigging pretty often.

If your standing rigging is all hemp and manila how are you making
the terminations? Spliced eyes or served?
Cheers,

Bruce

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 11:53:06 +0100, "Edgar"
wrote:

Anyway stainless steel was only invented around WW1 time

One of the very first applications was tubes for a Naval gun. Today
you can get any number of different guns made entirely from the stuff.
[ give or take the handles, traditionally wood.]

Casady

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:35:15 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

The first problem comes when you attempt to locate proper heavy duty
thimbles for the eyes. Damned hard to find. Next comes splicing the
eyes in the cables. Again, if you can do it yourself and have the
tools then go for it but if you are paying rigger's rates then get
your wallet ready.

Don't they have fittings that avoid the eyesplice, for stainless, but
not for galvanized? That would do it even if stainless is six times as
costly. I don't know about those compression sleeves. I remember in
the fifties when Lands End sold nothing but sailboat stuff. They had
sleeves and a tool that looked like a boltcutter.

You can get 3/8 galv. for less than a buck a foot, breaking strength
14 000 lbs. My original reference was to anchor rode, and you can bet
the ranch it wasn't stainless. You can brush grease over a wire filled
winch drum and not get it on the rest of the boat.

People who aren't useing it say it rusts. How come the zinc does not
afford anodic protection to the steel. I drive by the neighors steel
roof that has a third of the zinc gone, and no rust. No salt of
course. My dad built the Iowa schooner [only been the one] and used
galvanized. Whatever the local hardware store had.

Casady

Casady

On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:53:24 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

If your standing rigging is all hemp and manila how are you making
the terminations? Spliced eyes or served?

Perhaps deadeyes at the bottom end, so maybe both? My dad could do all
the splices. He made a rope ladder, all rope, no wood steps, and not
anchored at the bottom. Only a kid trying to get to the tree platform
would put up with it. To digress, the mountain climbers have short
rope ladders with four inch aluminum steps. Why not a long one and
haul it up with a halyard. I guess a bosuns chair is far better,
unless you are alone. I believe ladder steps are far cheaper than mast
steps. Not marine. I am a coward, and don't want to climb ladders
without a harness clipped to a halyard, with someone tending the other
end.

Casady

Bruce wrote:
On Mon, 09 Feb 2009 23:46:11 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

How come stainless cable is more than six times as costly as
galvanized, yet nobody uses the galvanized. Stainless the same size
has about 80% of the breaking strength. Galvanized is what they guy
power poles with.

Casady


Basically using galvanized wire rope just takes a LOT more
maintenance, and a LOT more time to build. If you are doing your own
work then perhaps it is more economical, but if you are paying others
the it is doubtful

The first problem comes when you attempt to locate proper heavy duty
thimbles for the eyes. Damned hard to find. Next comes splicing the
eyes in the cables. Again, if you can do it yourself and have the
tools then go for it but if you are paying rigger's rates then get
your wallet ready.

Now you have the cables cut, spliced around proper heavy duty
thimbles. Next step is to worm, parcel and serve all splices and
usually the lower cables up 10 - 15 feet above the deck. Once that is
done you need to mix up some slushing and paint the cables, working it
well into the wrappings.

Now! At last, you can rig the boat. But remember that annually you
will need to inspect, replace worn wrappings and re-slush all the
cables and slushing is a mixture of tar, oil, Japan dryer and various
other arcane substances. (think roofing tar) so don't even begin to
think about slushing down the rigging while in a marina slip as you
will sprinkle not only your deck but your neighbor's decks with
sticky, black, tarry gunk.

Now, having said all that you might be interested that properly
maintained galvanized rigging will out last stainless.

Cheers,

Bruce

Brion Toss, pages 276 and 277 goes into slushing of several types
including Marvel Mystery Oil!
He also goes into wire types and brands on pages 148 and 149 and is a
staunch proponent of galvanized wire for long life and low cost in spite
of the annual maintenance.
Gordon
BTW, This book is really a must have for a serious interest in sailing.

"Richard Casady" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:35:15 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

The first problem comes when you attempt to locate proper heavy duty
thimbles for the eyes. Damned hard to find. Next comes splicing the
eyes in the cables. Again, if you can do it yourself and have the
tools then go for it but if you are paying rigger's rates then get
your wallet ready.

Don't they have fittings that avoid the eyesplice, for stainless, but
not for galvanized? That would do it even if stainless is six times as
costly. I don't know about those compression sleeves. I remember in
the fifties when Lands End sold nothing but sailboat stuff. They had
sleeves and a tool that looked like a boltcutter.

Yes, you can get compression fittings for galvanised wire as well as
stainless.
I have the gear to do my own splices by the Talurit system, which makes a
very neat job with a 20 ton hydraulic press.
The only difference is that you use aluminium ferrules for galvd. and
copper ones for stainless.
You can use these copper ferrules also for 1 x 19 wire if you don't want to
go for swaging. In that case you use the next larger ferrule because 1 x 19
is much more resistant to compression than stranded.

I have no experience of the systems worked by a sort of bolt cutter but
would not be certain that the average person could produce enough force to
compress a copper ferrule.
I am about to fit new steering wires to my boat if it ever stops snowing.
The old ones are terminated with Nico-press fittings but I have made Talurit
splices on the new ones.